John Taylor, L/Cpl, 4957, 1/7 Gordon Highlanders: Errors in MIRC and Registers of Effects? + Other questions.

[rolt968]

L/Cpl John Taylor was killed in action on 9 January 1917.

He was a serving with 1/7 Gordon Highlanders and was a prewar territorial.

He went to France with the original contingent of 1/7 Gordon Highlanders.

He was discharged having served his time on 11 November 1915.

Question 1: I think that suggests that he most likely enlisted in November 1910. Am I right?

 

He rejoined in August 1916 - presumably conscripted in August 1916, returning to 1/7 Gordon Highladers apparently.

Question 2: Was he allocated a new number when he rejoined? If so, should't the 1914-15 Star have his original serial number?

 

His gratuity seems to me to be for less than a year's service.

Quetion 3: Has his 1915 service been ommitted or would the total come out as less than a year?

RM

[rolt968]

May I push this thread to the front again, please?

The following two articles appeared in the Montrose Review on 26 January 1917.:

 

To recap a couple of points from my original post. He served from August 1914 to 11 November 1915 (2 May 1915 to unknown date in France) and from August 1916 to January 1917, yet his gratuity was for less than one year's service.

His 1914-15 Star should have had his original serial number.

I would like to add one more question:

Question 4: If itme served territorials were conscripted were arrangements made for them to rejoin their original units?

Thank you

RM

 

[RussT]

An interesting case - unfortunately I don't have the answers - but I'm interested in knowing what they are myself !

Some thoughts/observations that may or may not help the discussion - at least perhaps it keeps the thread moving.

On 21/04/2021 at 19:13, rolt968 said:

He was discharged having served his time on 11 November 1915.

Question 1: I think that suggests that he most likely enlisted in November 1910. Am I right?

I think that is correct - joined the TF for the standard 4 years but then retained and served an extra year because the war had broken out within his 4 year term of engagement.

 

On 21/04/2021 at 19:13, rolt968 said:

He rejoined in August 1916 - presumably conscripted in August 1916, returning to 1/7 Gordon Highladers apparently.

Question 2: Was he allocated a new number when he rejoined? If so, should't the 1914-15 Star have his original serial number?

I would agree he would have been conscripted under the MSA - although I have seen examples of men who were time expired re-volunteering, either directly or under the Derby Scheme. I would conclude he would have been given a new number when he was newly called-up. Certainly his 7th Bn GH number of 4957 dates from around end of July/beginning of August 1916 as per other men's service records with near numbers.

My understanding is that he should have been awarded his Star with his original GH number.

 

On 21/04/2021 at 19:13, rolt968 said:

Quetion 3: Has his 1915 service been ommitted or would the total come out as less than a year?

A £3 Type 1 War Gratuity means less than 1 year service, so it looks like he has been short changed - I thought there might be a second record for him in the Effects Register but there is no sign of one. See below on the observation of Bounty payments.

 

4 hours ago, rolt968 said:

Question 4: If itme served territorials were conscripted were arrangements made for them to rejoin their original units?

I have seen a few of these over the years - and there has been a mix - some going to their original units, others going to wherever the army evidently needed men at the time - so I'm not sure what, if any, arrangements there might have been for the former - I've not seen anything official instructions.

As an aside to help the discussion - in looking for near-number service records I came across the record of Joseph Strachan. He was also apparently time expired having served 5 years 3 days with the 7th GH (relevant to your Q1). He was conscripted on August 1st 1916 and allotted the number 4966 in the 3/7th Bn GH, which I would conclude is the unit your man would have gone to first upon being re-called. There is some correspondence in his file requesting his earlier GH number but I couldn't spot any response that gives the answer. He was later 38988 MGC - with whom he was awarded his VM/BWM. There is no mention of GH on his Medal Roll - so I assume he never served overseas with the GH either during his original engagement with them or during his later conscripted service.

One interesting detail is that he received a Bounty on re-joining - I can't re-call all the details on Bounty Payments - but I wonder whether such a payment might have influenced how his War Gratuity was later calculated. Perhaps Craig can help @ss002d6252

Regards

Russ

 

 

 

 

[ss002d6252]

18 minutes ago, RussT said:

One interesting detail is that he received a Bounty on re-joining - I can't re-call all the details on Bounty Payments - but I wonder whether such a payment might have influenced how his War Gratuity was later calculated. Perhaps Craig can help @ss002d6252

The bounty shouldn't affect the war gratuity.

Craig

[rolt968]

Thank you both. I suppose if he had lived he might have sent the 1914-15 Star back to have the correct number inscribed on it and he would have noticed the error in the gratuity. I suppose his parents didn't.

I am coming across one or two errors like this where service was disrupted in some way. Another one will come up in a week or two.

I think I have already posted about a man whose service overseas on the MIRC was counted from some time in the spring of 1915, but he had originially arrived in France in 1914. However on closer inspection he did get the right medal as it was December 1914.

RM

[rolt968]

Interesting. I had not noticed that Soldiers Died in the Great War says that John Taylor enlisted in Aberdeen. That sounds to me like his second period of service too.