KONDOA Posted 5 February , 2005 Share Posted 5 February , 2005 Good Morning Chums, Can anyone provide a possible identity to this vessel. I believe the photo was taken around 1905 during an official visit by the RN Mediteranean Fleet to Greece. All suggestions welcomed with thanks. Roop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Roberts Posted 7 February , 2005 Share Posted 7 February , 2005 Roop I am fairly certain that these are King Edward VII class battleships of which Eight were built, 1905-7 [so if I'm right the photo nust be slightly later than 1905]: KingEdward VII, Africa, Hibernia, Dominion, Commonwealth, New Zealand [later Zealandia], Britannia & Hindustan Displacement 15630 tons standard; 454 ft long o/a Armament: Four 12" guns [2xtwin turrets]; four 9.2", ten 6" [all mounted singly]; four torpedo tubes and presumably smaller weapons. Compare photo of Africa below I believe the preceding classes all had twin funnels mounted abreast. Adrian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horace Bachelor Posted 7 February , 2005 Share Posted 7 February , 2005 Roop and Adrian, I'm not sure that it is a King Edward. The size and spacing of the funnels looks wrong. I believe the last class of pre-dreadnoughts to have funnels mounted abreast were the Majestics which were completed 1895-98. It's definately not Swiftsure or Triumph and I don't think it's a Canopus class. My guess would be a Formidable, London or Queen. Unfortunately, all the photo's I have are too indistinct. Here's a nice photo of King Edward VII. My Great uncle joined her at Devonport in 1905 when she was brand new. Rich. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horace Bachelor Posted 7 February , 2005 Share Posted 7 February , 2005 And here's the other side of the previous postcard which was sent to my Grandfather. It says:- Dear T. Know this is not much in your line. Ought to have a tower to it eh. Hope you are all well. H. My Gramp was involved with the church all his life, hence the tower reference. I get the impression Harry was having a bit of gentle fun with him. Sorry to hijack your thread Roop. Cheers Rich. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KONDOA Posted 7 February , 2005 Author Share Posted 7 February , 2005 Thanks for the replies, all interesting stuff. On the same trip the following photo was taken. They may well date from later than 1905 as Ggf rejoined the RN in 1906 after RFR service. Roop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Lowrey Posted 7 February , 2005 Share Posted 7 February , 2005 After looking through the 1914 edition of Jane's fighting Ships and Conway's All The World's fighting Ships 1860-1905, the answer is a battleship of the Formidable or London classes. The spacing and location of the funnels is wrong for a King Edward VII[i/] class ships, which in any case were not based in the Mediterranean. The same is true for the Canopus class, the name ship excepted on the basing point (she was in the Med from 1899 to 1903). The two funnels in the photo are not of the same size -- Jane's notes that this is a way to distinguish between the otherwise rather similar looking Formidable and London classes (fore funnel smaller than aft funnel) from the Duncan class (both funnels same size.) To top things off, Conway's notes that the eight ships of the Formidable and London classes served in the Mediterranean from completion until 1907 or 1908 depending upon the ship. Best wishes, Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob H Posted 7 February , 2005 Share Posted 7 February , 2005 Roop I agree with Rich & Michael that the first photo is of one of the Formidable/London/Queen classes. These were all externally very similar. The second photo was not taken at the same time as it shows the ships in the old style black hull and white superstructure which was changed to all over grey between Nov 1902 & early 1903 Regards Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Roberts Posted 8 February , 2005 Share Posted 8 February , 2005 Sorry about the red herring in respect of the KE7 identification! In future I shall be careful about entering battle equipped only with a Jane's Battleships of the 20th Century when there are chaps out there armed with Conways and with Jane's heavyweight sister Adrian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horace Bachelor Posted 8 February , 2005 Share Posted 8 February , 2005 No problem Adrian, I've always found identification of Pre-Dreadnoughts a bit of a problem. Several of the classes were very similar in appearance and this, coupled with my lack of decent photos does make it hard. Can anyone out there recommend a good book on British battleships up to 1906? Regards Rich. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KONDOA Posted 8 February , 2005 Author Share Posted 8 February , 2005 Super sleuthing Chums, great credit to all. Bob, may we revise the date of the photos a little then. The ln Line Ahead photo posted above was most certainly taken in the same set as the others!!?? I have the full set of the visit to Greece. This particular one is number 20 entitled British Fleet at Nauplia. The one below is 73 Fleet at Argostoli Roop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob H Posted 8 February , 2005 Share Posted 8 February , 2005 Rich A good book is ‘BRITISH BATTLESHIPS 1889-1904’ by R.A.Burt This covers the Royal Sovereign class to the Lord Nelson class which were completed in 1908. Another classic book is British Battleships by Oscar Parkes. Originally published 1956 this covers everything from Warrior in1860 to Vanguard in WWII. It has been reprinted a couple of times since, but I don’t know how easy it is to find now. Roop That is a surprise. All the books seem to suggest that the change was fairly rapid, but I never would have dreamed it would occur halfway through a visit to Greece. Please can you scan just the front ship in the first photo at a higher resolution to help with a possible identification? Thanks Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KONDOA Posted 8 February , 2005 Author Share Posted 8 February , 2005 Bob, This is about the best I can get as they are only old 2 1/2" square pics. Roop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KONDOA Posted 8 February , 2005 Author Share Posted 8 February , 2005 Bit of vague detail on this one. Roop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 8 February , 2005 Share Posted 8 February , 2005 Hope you dont mind me butting in, but here is a picture of a Formidable class All The Best Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob H Posted 8 February , 2005 Share Posted 8 February , 2005 Roop Thanks for those, the second one stumped me for a couple of minutes, then I realised it is a photo of the stocked anchors secured on the billboards. This is one of the differences I am looking for as the Queen class had stockless anchors pulled up into the hawse pipes like most modern ships. Sorry to be a nuisance but can you do a higher scan of the side on ship? Thanks Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 8 February , 2005 Share Posted 8 February , 2005 London Class - you want to try & get a book that size under your scanner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 8 February , 2005 Share Posted 8 February , 2005 Another Formidable - does anyone require any class history notes to go with these All The Best Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob H Posted 9 February , 2005 Share Posted 9 February , 2005 Roop The ship in the head on shot is probably HMS Vengeance, of the Canopus class. I can’t be absolutely sure but if it is it would date the photo between April 1902 and July 1903 as this was when she was part of the Mediterranean fleet. Chris The photo of HMS London is after her conversion to a minelayer, with all her 12in guns removed and also the rear turret replaced by a single 6in gun. She laid 2,640 mines in the Northern Mine Barrage in 1918. Rgards Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KONDOA Posted 9 February , 2005 Author Share Posted 9 February , 2005 Bob, Chris, Thanks for the additional info. Heres the side on pic you requested, let me know if this is the view you required, I can always scan again. Roop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KONDOA Posted 9 February , 2005 Author Share Posted 9 February , 2005 Or this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 9 February , 2005 Share Posted 9 February , 2005 Canopus Class - sorry I coudnt find an earlier shot of a London Class All The Best Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KONDOA Posted 9 February , 2005 Author Share Posted 9 February , 2005 Thanks for some great pictures Chris, what is your source book. It seems very comprehensive. Roop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob H Posted 9 February , 2005 Share Posted 9 February , 2005 Roop Sorry! I didn't make it clear. I meant the first photo you put on this thread. Thanks Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 10 February , 2005 Share Posted 10 February , 2005 Thanks for some great pictures Chris, what is your source book. It seems very comprehensive. Roop Roop It is "Weapons & Warfare" an encylopedia series published during the 1970s which I pestered mum & dad to buy me. My brother tried to sell the set while I was away in the army for the whole of the 80s & which I managed to reclaim when I married in 1990. I didn't realise what an asset I had sitting there until just recently. The only problem is the size of the volumes which make it difficult to get them under the scanner hence the quality of some of the photos. All The Best Chris PS Just let me know if you need some more. Here is a KE7 Class Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KONDOA Posted 10 February , 2005 Author Share Posted 10 February , 2005 Here you go Bob, hope it is clear enough. Roop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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