Brixmouse Posted 18 December , 2018 Share Posted 18 December , 2018 I have seen some amazing research from people on here and wonder if you could share your wisdom in helping me piece together the movements of my grand father. I have uncovered a lot from his medical records but am now unsure if he served in Gallipoli as first thought? From his records "Statement by a soldier concerning his own case" (attached) it would seem he did. However he did not have his first TaB injections till 05/06/1916 (attached) and finally the casualty form active service first stated embarked Devonport 05/09/1916. He would then of been 19 as signed up at 17 years and 7 months on the 03/12/1914. So I'm not sure if he did not serve abroad until he was 19 or I am missing information to put him in Gallipoli? He served with the 1/5th Royal Scot Fusiliers and was attached to the 155th Light Mortar Trench Battery and injured for the 2nd time on 02/09/1918 at the 2nd battle of Arrass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotonmate Posted 18 December , 2018 Share Posted 18 December , 2018 Welcome to the Forum ! Something not right here ! Do you have a copy of the full service record ? I recognise some of your forms as being a standard content of such a record. This soldier's Medal Index Card shows 2 service numbers,both RSF,the first one being 8180 and the second one being 240919 which can be recognised as being in the 1917 re-numbering series. The MIC has no entitlement to the 1914-15 Star which would have been issued if he had been anywhere fighting overseas in 1915, so even though the 1/5 RSF were at Gallipoli from 7 June 1915 he seems not to have been, unless there was a clerical error on the card. Clerical error may also have occurred on the last form you show (do you have the other side of this form as it would show his early service postings ?) as it looks to me as if a later summary may have been written on the wrong form. There were a fair few J Little in records. His "Discharged 7.5.1920 Para 392 (XVI)KR" would have entitled him to a Silver War Badge as discharged unfit and yet there is no entry on the MIC or no detail of one issued to this soldier in the Silver War Badge Lists. Yet a part of the final summary is correct as the unit did arrive in France on 17.4.1918 ! If you have more info please post it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brixmouse Posted 18 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 18 December , 2018 Hi and thank you for your response. I only his medical records 23 pages! So I know he was first shot 05/11/17 and was at No.24 stationary hospital Kantara. The last page states home between 3/12/14 and 04/09/16 which ties in with this page the date he left Devonport was 05/09/15. But not sure why he would have stated that he was in Gallipoli if he wasn't? It all started from Erskine hospital digitalising there records. He is also listed in the Muirkirk Advertiser January 1915 as parish roll of honour with all the other brave men that served. the correct page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brixmouse Posted 19 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 19 December , 2018 Medal awarded British war medal and victory medal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roughdiamond Posted 19 December , 2018 Share Posted 19 December , 2018 I'm having the same results, no sign of a "Star" medal Card or indeed one for a "SWB", the former maybe missing, it'd be worth checking the Star roll to see if he's on it, unlike the War and Victory roll which lists men by service number, it lists men alphabetically, I had considered him serving underage with a pseudonym and there is an 8180 Peter McCutcheon RSF but he was 1/4th and was KIA 25/06/15. As for the lack of a SWB card or entry on his War and Victory card, that's a strange one and maybe a clerical error as I believe the SWB was issued until early 1922 and he was discharged in 1920. Going by his records, they all tally to his first overseas service being with the "Mesopotamian Expeditionary Force (MEF) from 17/09/16 when he arrived in Alexandria so the "Statement of a Soldier Concerning his Own Case" seems incorrect, however it seems strange he'd fabricate Gallipoli service when it's easily disproved. One final observation is that he had a very unlucky left thigh, it received the "Gun Shot Wound (GSW)" on 03/11/17 and the same 07/09/18 which led to him losing his leg. Sam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brixmouse Posted 19 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 19 December , 2018 Thank you. He comes up twice in my searches both as J Little and James Little with 240919. I remember hitting his leg with the fire poker and I would think he would say that his left leg was his lucky one...especially when I wacked his right leg! I will check the Star roll. We where led to believe that he lied about his age. I just do not understand the bit surrounding Gallipoli. I have now found this . Surname: Little Incident Details: War Office Daily List No. 5423 Incident Date: 22/11/1917 More Information: Entitled to wear a "Wound Stripe" as authorised under Army Order 204 of 6th July 1916. The terms of this award being met by being named in this list. Rank: Private Service Number: 240919 Wounded Casualty Address: Muirkirk Service: British Army Primary Unit: Royal Scots Fusiliers Archive Reference: NLS 1917_Wlist17 WO-372-12-104533.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1959 Posted 19 December , 2018 Share Posted 19 December , 2018 (edited) There can be little doubt he did not serve in Gallipoli based on the records shown. I note that his statement is typed in - possibly by a clerk. So is this the clerical error. Did he ever say he served in Gallipoli? I am intrigued to know where you found his medical records as I cannot - are they on fold3? Edited 19 December , 2018 by Mark1959 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brixmouse Posted 19 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 19 December , 2018 He like many did not mention much about his time. Whilst the statement is typed he has signed it? But I have searched the Star medal and nothing, so have to conclude he did not serve in Gallipoli. I came across his record via national archives catalogue ref 364/6440 as search came up as James S Little medical card. His birth cerificate confirmed his middle name. They did a page search and confirmed 24 pages, so I got them scanned and emailed. My seach has sent me in different directions most recent are the diaries of 155th brigade trench motar battery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotonmate Posted 19 December , 2018 Share Posted 19 December , 2018 The Egypt and Palestine War Diary is not yet available online as it hasn't been digitised yet: WO95/4607 covers both 1/4 and 1/5 Battalions RSF from Jan 1916 to Mar 1918 and just prior to shipping out to France: http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C4557760 The unit was engaged on Suez Canal Defences when James joined them and he was later wounded at the 3rd Battle of Gaza in Nov 1917, having been through the earlier first two Battles as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brixmouse Posted 19 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 19 December , 2018 (edited) Thank you...That looks like my next lot of reading (subject to visiting/price of scanning) WO 95/2896/5 covered April till December 1918 with 155th Brigade Trench Mortar Battery which it looks like he was with when injured the 2nd time. Thank you all for your help. I will continue to research as much as I can in the hope I can help others in the future. Edited 19 December , 2018 by Brixmouse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianmorris547 Posted 20 December , 2018 Share Posted 20 December , 2018 (edited) On 19/12/2018 at 14:21, Brixmouse said: I came across his record via national archives catalogue ref 364/6440 as search came up as James S Little medical card. His birth cerificate confirmed his middle name. They did a page search and confirmed 24 pages, so I got them scanned and emailed. I'm confused.com re WO 364/6440. I can't find James Little 8081 or 240919 in WO 364 on my Ancestry.co.uk so are there more Pension Records at TNA. I will check FMP at the library this morning. I tried a similar search for my wounded RE grandfather by putting "Medical Card John Morris" into Discovery with WO 364 and it came up with WO 364/2584: Morris Jeremiah - Morris John E. It also said that the record was available to download on Ancestry. I will contact TNA to check this unless someone has knowledge. Brian EDIT: No trace of a Pension Record on FMP either. Edited 20 December , 2018 by brianmorris547 additional info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brixmouse Posted 20 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 20 December , 2018 Hi Brian http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ This is the link all I put was James S Little and he was the 3rd record down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianmorris547 Posted 21 December , 2018 Share Posted 21 December , 2018 12 hours ago, Brixmouse said: Hi Brian http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ This is the link all I put was James S Little and he was the 3rd record down. Yes, I see how you got there. What I can not understand is why I can not find him on Ancestry.co.uk or FMP in WO 364 Pension Records searching for him by name and/or number. The indexing on Ancestry leaves a lot to be desired so he may be there somewhere but I would have expected to find him on FMP. This morning's task is to explore WO 364/2584 for any trace of my gf. Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brixmouse Posted 21 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 21 December , 2018 Agree the search facility on Ancestry and some of the others brought up very little and all referred to national archives. So I thought better to go straight to the source. Good luck in your search. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now