Roger Thompson Posted 18 December , 2015 Share Posted 18 December , 2015 On the Death Plaques(I hope I have correctly called them) are there the Regimental number as well as the persons name. The reason I am asking is that yesterday there was on in a jewellers window so I went in and asked if he knew anything about it, like was the soldier local, his answer was he didn't know so I took a mental note of the name. He was Fred Harpin, last night I had a look at him, the only Fred Harpin was 36761 Pvt of the 1/4th East Yorkshire Regiment from Huddersfield(I was in Dewsbury, West Yorkshire about 6 miles from Huddersfield). There is a copy of his service record at the TNA, I also looked at all the relevant census returns for him. Any pointers on this might help, it would be nice for it to go home, but I suspect the jeweller would want to sell it, I didn't want to ask him at this point until I was certain who he was. Cheers Roger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tootrock Posted 18 December , 2015 Share Posted 18 December , 2015 Death Plaques just had the recipient's name - no regiment, rank or number given. Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 18 December , 2015 Share Posted 18 December , 2015 Out of interest how much does he want for it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Thompson Posted 18 December , 2015 Author Share Posted 18 December , 2015 I didn't ask as it was part of a display in the window along with other medals, a bugle, a sword and scabbard and the Union flag, I didn't want to create too much interest(kerching money) until I knew more. I might pop down again and ask after Christmas. Cheers Roger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depaor01 Posted 18 December , 2015 Share Posted 18 December , 2015 A name on a memorial plaque that appears only once on the CWGC site is the only way to link a plaque to an individual. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Thompson Posted 18 December , 2015 Author Share Posted 18 December , 2015 Thank you all for the information I was thinking that, but only ever having seen one before quickly I wasn't certain. Cheers Roger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyH Posted 18 December , 2015 Share Posted 18 December , 2015 I think that Memorial Plaque is the correct name, but anything is better than the awful term Dead Man's Penny. BillyH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Thompson Posted 18 December , 2015 Author Share Posted 18 December , 2015 Agreed BillyH Cheers Roger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyH Posted 18 December , 2015 Share Posted 18 December , 2015 Perhaps it doesn't seem important to some, but it always seems extremely disrespectful to me ! BillyH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Upton Posted 18 December , 2015 Share Posted 18 December , 2015 A name on a memorial plaque that appears only once on the CWGC site is the only way to link a plaque to an individual. Strictly speaking, that is not entirely true. Canada for example issued Memorial Plaques to the NOK of soldiers who died of causes directly related to service for quite some time after the 1921 CWGC cut-off for commemoration came into effect. Thus it is possible to find correctly and uniquely named plaques to men that are not even listed by the CWGC. Those ones generally aren't as easy to track down as a result... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Filsell Posted 18 December , 2015 Share Posted 18 December , 2015 I understand the dislike of the term, but it does seem to have been used widely after the war by many who did not consider it inappropriate. In one way it seems to reflect on the thought all you got for dying was a large penny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Thompson Posted 18 December , 2015 Author Share Posted 18 December , 2015 Hello Andrew, Thanks for your input and following on from the information I have checked the BMD records for a Fred Harpin and there is only one listed and that is in 1917 aged 62 in Huddersfield. The only other one is the one I mentioned in my original post. All the others are mentioned as either Frederick and other permutations, so I am thinking that the man I mentioned is the correct one. Thanking you for your help. Cheers Roger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depaor01 Posted 19 December , 2015 Share Posted 19 December , 2015 Strictly speaking, that is not entirely true. Canada for example issued Memorial Plaques to the NOK of soldiers who died of causes directly related to service for quite some time after the 1921 CWGC cut-off for commemoration came into effect. Thus it is possible to find correctly and uniquely named plaques to men that are not even listed by the CWGC. Those ones generally aren't as easy to track down as a result... That's very interesting. Were they of the same design as the usual Woolwich type - Lion and Britannia holding wreath etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Upton Posted 19 December , 2015 Share Posted 19 December , 2015 That's very interesting. Were they of the same design as the usual Woolwich type - Lion and Britannia holding wreath etc? No difference whatsoever. Have a look at the following site under Memorial Plaques: http://www.jackclegg3.webspace.virginmedia.com/ This website actually has two post-1921 British casualty plaques one after the other, about two thirds of the way down the page. The first is named to G/18434 Pte. Malcolm Douglas Crawfurth-Smith, 2nd Bn. Royal Sussex Regt, who died in the USA on the 1st March 1922. The second is named to 4/3282 AB Ernest Lawrence Cooke RNVR, Late of the Collingwood Bn., who died on the 13th April 1926. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depaor01 Posted 19 December , 2015 Share Posted 19 December , 2015 Interesting that Canada was allowed to "go it alone" and the rules were made flexible for non UK recipients - Also that the machinery to make them was still in working order for so long after they ceased to issue to UK. I wonder where the machinery and dies are today? Sorry for inadvertently hijacking your thread Rogerpopeye! Thanks for that info Andrew, Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trenchtrotter Posted 19 December , 2015 Share Posted 19 December , 2015 Trouble is CWGC may have many F Hairpins listed? He maybe a unique name but just because there is only one listed is not 100%. Is it local to where the soldier came from? Can be a good starter RE IDing to him. TT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Strawbridge Posted 20 December , 2015 Share Posted 20 December , 2015 A name on a memorial plaque that appears only once on the CWGC site is the only way to link a plaque to an individual. Dave Another exception is if the memorial plaque comes with it's original delivery envelope that has his name and address on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Thompson Posted 20 December , 2015 Author Share Posted 20 December , 2015 Hi there Andrew, I don't mind in the least as it helps me understand them. Hello there Trench Trotter, Your observations are valid. Yes the Fred Harpin on the Memorial Plaque was resident in Huddersfield West Yorkshire and the Memorial Plaque is in Dewsbury West Yorkshire about 6 miles away. Cheers Roger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitchener's Bugle Posted 20 December , 2015 Share Posted 20 December , 2015 Rogerpopeye - Certainly looks like your man - Fred Harpin 36761 Pvt of the 1/4th East Yorkshire Regiment - awarded British War Medal and Victory Medal. Name: Fred Harpin Birth Place: Newsome, Yorks Death Date: 27 May 1918 Death Place: France and Flanders Enlistment Place: Huddersfield Rank: Private Regiment: East Yorkshire Regiment Battalion: 1st 4th Battalion Regimental Number: 36761 Type of Casualty: Killed in action Theatre of War: Western European Theatre Comments: Formerly 33322, Northumberland Fus. Do you think that you will pick the plaque up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Thompson Posted 20 December , 2015 Author Share Posted 20 December , 2015 Hello there Kitchener's Bugle, I am more than convinced that it's him. I don't think I will bother as I'm not a collector, but you never know. His service record as survived although badly water stained, what I might do is print it off and go and see the jeweller. Cheers Roger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
303man Posted 21 December , 2015 Share Posted 21 December , 2015 Another exception is if the memorial plaque comes with it's original delivery envelope that has his name and address on. The envelope will have the deceased next of kin as the addressee, not the Casualties address and in a lot of cases the surname on the plaque will not be the same as the one on the address label. It can help if the CWGC has NOK details as a cross reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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