Can you help explain a Wireless Operator duties in WW1.

[Welly]

Dear GWF

I wonder if the forum having already so ably assisting me in gathering information regarding my grandfather Joseph Griffith Weldon whether there might be someone able to assist me in the following question:

During the 1914 -18 conflict my Grandfather enlisted and joined the RFC as 1^st AM as a Wireless Operator and was attached to the 56^th Siege Battery and I have just found his signals instructions card Signals between Aeroplanes and Artillery. The card outlines the codes used during that time. The outside cover is barely legible but seems to indicate basic communications such as -Are you receiving my signals ….B. Are you ready to fire …OF etc

Inside the card it heading is - Very’s lights – The code will be as follows:

No correction and Over …Red

No correction Short… Green

Right Over …Red, red.

Were these coloured lights used by reconnaissance planes to indicate to the Wireless Operator the accuracy of the Artillery fire and would this information have then be passed onto the Artillery to amend their position accordingly? If so, would the Wireless Operator then have used Morse code to inform the artillery of the aeroplanes observations?

I would be very grateful if anyone could enlighten me as to the duties of a Wireless Operator attached to a Siege Battery in the 1914-18 conflict. This would greatly add to the information I have so far gathered from your Forum and Kew.

Many thanks again

Sue

[truthergw]

I can offer a little help here until the real experts arrive. Wireless communication at the time was in morse code which required the use of a key and a bit of concentration. In a single seater the pilot would seldom have that luxury so communication tended to be one way only, i.e. to him and he responded by firing flares. I am sure that many enthusiasts would be interested in the content of the code card.

[lauracobb]

Hi there!

I don't know if this is much help at all, but I have been led to believe that there was very few wireless operators attached to the Royal Flying Corps. You could be in line to do some pretty unique and interesting research. There is a bit in Joshua Levine's Book 'Fighter Heroes of WW1', which tells a little bit more about the role of wireless operators. I don't have my copy to hand, so if someone else could oblige?

Best

Laura

[centurion]

Hi there!

I don't know if this is much help at all, but I have been led to believe that there was very few wireless operators attached to the Royal Flying Corps.

By the end of 1916 the RFC wireless organisation had 2,000 operators mainly attached to artillery. At the Battle of Vimy Ridge the RFC deployed 30 wireless equipped aircraft which carried out 406 shoots. So at this time there would be a signifcant number of shoots by aircraft without wireless. Sometimes the battery would be out of line of sight of both the target and the spotting aircraft. If the aircraft had no wireless it might signal (with lights etc) to a ground based RFC wireless post that would act as a relay to the battery in question. By the end of the war the number of wireless aircraft in the RAF has risen to 400 plus (possibly 500) with 1000 ground stations and 18,000 wireless operators.From the begining of 1918 two way wireless communication was increasing, this had the advantage that the battery could signal when it had fired and when the shells should arrive on target. This made it much easier for the aircraft to spot the fall of shot, from the battery it was servicing, amidst everything else that was falling on the battlefield.

[centurion]

In a single seater the pilot would seldom have that luxury so communication tended to be one way only, i.e. to him and he responded by firing flares.

Initally it was the otherway round - wireless equipped aircraft transmitted to ground stations but couldn't receive. The original transmitters were much lighter than receivers. The original RFC wireless equiped aircraft were usually two seaters but the pilot sometimes did the keying so the observer could concentrate on looking out for enemy aircraft

[Welly]

Dear GWF

Thank you so much for all your help.

I do know that my Grandfather was attached to the 56th as he is mentioned in the 56th Siege Battery War Diaries provided to me in a previous thread by another kind forum member.

In the early hours of the morning of the 21^st July 1917 the Battery was positioned at Kroisstraathoek (cordinates H30d 75.25 Sheet 28) and was heavily shelled by enemy 8 in and 5. 9 in hows, 5.3 and 4.2 guns. One 8 in shell exploded at the right side of the Wireless Operators dugout blowing it in. No 11369, 2ndA/M LLOYD W M was killed and No 5084 1stA/M WELDON J G and No 65053 Gnr GRACE J were buried in the dugout. The two latter when extricated were taken to the dressing station and detained suffering from shell shock. 2^ndA/M LLOYD was buried at Vlamertinghe.

This is a scan of the inside of the code book as mentioned, if that helps!

It also talks about (see 3 on rightside of booklet), If it is necessary to distinguish between batteries close together, Roman figures placed under other signals can be used.

Any idea what Roman figures are?

Thanks again

Sue

[Welly]

I can offer a little help here until the real experts arrive. Wireless communication at the time was in morse code which required the use of a key and a bit of concentration. In a single seater the pilot would seldom have that luxury so communication tended to be one way only, i.e. to him and he responded by firing flares. I am sure that many enthusiasts would be interested in the content of the code card.

I have attached a copy of the signal book for you. See further down the thread.

Thanks

Sue

[truthergw]

I have attached a copy of the signal book for you. See further down the thread.

Thanks

Sue

Thank you very much.

[David_Underdown]

Any idea what Roman figures are?

Roman numerals?

[truthergw]

As David says, Roman numerals to differentiate signals which had to be repeated. Interesting to see the hand written amendments to the print. A warning not to take printed matter as the final arbiter. They were often a work in progress and the press could not always keep up with the reality.

[centurion]

[/size]In the early hours of the morning of the 21^st July 1917 the Battery was positioned at Kroisstraathoek (cordinates H30d 75.25 Sheet 28) and was heavily shelled by enemy 8 in and 5. 9 in hows, 5.3 and 4.2 guns. One 8 in shell exploded at the right side of the Wireless Operators dugout blowing it in. No 11369, 2ndA/M LLOYD W M was killed and No 5084 1stA/M WELDON J G and No 65053 Gnr GRACE J were buried in the dugout. The two latter when extricated were taken to the dressing station and detained suffering from shell shock. 2^ndA/M LLOYD was buried at Vlamertinghe.

The RFC would provide operators for both ends of the wireless communication and so would have operators at the battery either taking signals direct from an aircraft or from a remote station that was relaying non wireless communications.

It also talks about (see 3 on rightside of booklet), If it is necessary to distinguish between batteries close together, Roman figures placed under other signals can be used.

Some RFC (and later RAF) wireless stations might service more than one battery and some aircraft might spot for more than one battery as well (this was easier when two way comms were established). A station could even combine spottings from aircraft and one or more observation balloons. Towards the end of the war it could get very complex but as a result British artillery as well as being effective became more efficient as a result (it took fewer shells to achieve the intended result).

[Starlight]

[/quote The outside cover is barely legible but seems to indicate basic communications such as -Are you receiving my signals ….B. Are you ready to fire …OF etc[/size][/font]

My grandfather was a wireless mechanic with 6 squadron and was involved a lot with training the wireless operators in the field at the batteries (they were attached to the squadron but spent most of their working life at the battery) as well as working with the aircrew. Both pilots and observers were trained to operate the wireless and the role was taken depending upon various factors such as the type of mission, type of aircraft etc.

Here is a copy of the chart my grandfather used that shows the basic signals used by the operator in the aircraft to transmit to the batteries in the early part of the war. When a 'shoot' was underway, shell accuracy and gun aim corrections were transmitted using the clock code / rings method, which you included as one of the graphics in your post. The wireless operator on the ground would then pass the information on to the gunnery officer and arrange for ground signals to be set up (eg cloth strips / Popham Panels et al) next to the guns in order to communicate with the crew in the aircraft that was ranging for the battery.

The above is very simplistic. I can give you more details if you need them.

Steve

[RobL]

The RAF Museum at Hendon has (had?) a good display relating to Wireless operators, including a dressed mannequin of a Wireless Operator in RFC Maternity tunic and Brodie helmet with wireless equipment, although it was in the upstairs gallery which is more often than not closed to the public, although i'm sure they'll let you up there if you ask in advance - there's some interesting paintings of the role available to view online too;

http://navigator.rafmuseum.org/results.do?view=detail&db=object&pageSize=1&id=106782

http://navigator.rafmuseum.org/results.do?view=detail&db=object&pageSize=1&id=106796

http://navigator.rafmuseum.org/results.do?view=detail&db=object&pageSize=1&id=106802

[Robert Dunlop]

So at this time there would be a signifcant number of shoots by aircraft without wireless.

What was the number of shoots carried out using aircraft that did not use wireless in the Battle of Vimy?

Robert

[yorksburnett]

Hello - it's me again!!

This forum has already been immensely helpful to me on a variety of topics and I'm hoping to tap into the wealth of expert knowledge available once again. This time it concerns a soldier named Thomas Alfred CARA who I know became a wireless operator. I eventually found his medal index card which shows that he enlisted as sapper No.126617 in the Royal Engineers on 23 Sep 1916 . This confirms information given on his citation in the CWGC Debt of Honour Register, however, this has him as a wireless operator in the Merchant Navy aboard SS "Sampan" when he died on 16 Nov 1918. The medal index card has a number of abbreviated entries which I find totally confusing. First, under the heading 'Corps & Rank', it has "Fen. Strat. S. D." then it has "Cause of Discharge Para 392 XVI K. R. A. O. 29 of 19 S." I know that the first part of the Cause of Discharge means that he was permanently unfit for service but what on earth does all the rest mean? It also begs the question - how did a man who enlisted in the Royal Engineers come to be aboard a merchant ship at the end of the war?

Any help with this would be much appreciated.

Penzance Bill

[Kath]

Bill, quite a bit comes up if you google "Thomas Alfred Cara".

He was a PO telegraphist:

http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/28752/pages/6245/page.pdf

Kath.

[yorksburnett]

Hi Kath

I had of course Googled Thomas Alfred Cara but I did not come up with the entry in the London Gazette - great find, thank you for the link.

Bill