Tyneside Chinaman Posted 8 September , 2010 Share Posted 8 September , 2010 Good evening all, I picked up this photo a few weeks back and thought it may generate a bit of debate. French carte postale and the huts shout behind the lines in France or Belgium. I have done close ups which I will post seperately. regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 8 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 8 September , 2010 From l to r R SCOTS (BY SHAPE OF BADGE, ARMY PHYSICAL TRAINING STAFF, NTHBLD FUS OR R INNIS FUS, MIDDLESEX REGT, ARMY CYCLIST CORPS. FRONT IRISH GUARDS, SCHOOL OF MUSKETRY, GORDONS, HAMPSHIRES edit HAVING SCANNED AGAIN AT 1200 DPI CAN NOW TELL THAT THE ACC SGT IS ACTUALLY SOUTH STAFFORDSHIRE REGT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 8 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 8 September , 2010 NEXT REAR R FUSILIERS, NOT SURE CHESHIRES OR E YORKS, RIFLE BDE OR POST OFFICE RIFLES, NOTTS & DERBY FRONT, R FUSILIERS, 5TH SEAFORTHS, BLACK WATCH, WELSH REGT, U/K HIGHLAND REGT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 8 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 8 September , 2010 SEAFORTHS SGT TWO BAR BATTALION IDENTIFIER TOP OF SLEEVE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 8 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 8 September , 2010 NEXT ROW SGT MAJOR SCHOOL OF MUSKETRY, LOYAL REGT NOTE CROSSED SWORDS WORN AS A COLLAR BADGE, MIDDLESEX REGT, R MUNSTER FUSILIERS (WITH A GLASS THE TIGER STANDS OUT) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 8 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 8 September , 2010 NEXT IT CAN BE SEEN THE HAMPSHIRES MAN HAS BEEN WOUNDED TWICE STARTING WHERE THE PRIVIOUS PHOTO WAS CUT OFF HLI NOTE HE IS THE ONLY ONE WEARING A CLOTH TITLE, R FUSILIERS ANOTHER ONE WEARING CROSSED SWORDS AS A COLLAR BADGE, R SUSSEX REGT, R WELSH FUS, SCHOOL OF MUSKETRY, 10TH KING'S LIVERPOOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
max7474 Posted 8 September , 2010 Share Posted 8 September , 2010 Swords as a collar is a new one to me. Fascinating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 8 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 8 September , 2010 SEATED SGT MANCHESTER REGT YOUNG BUT HAS TWO MEDAL RIBBONS, RSM R FUSILIERS, CAPT NOT SURE E YOPRKS OR CHESHIRES, LANCASHIRE FUILIERS, RIFLE BRIGADE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 8 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 8 September , 2010 NEXT SEATING ON THE GROUND FRONT LEFT SOUTH LANCASHIRE REGT, KING'S OWN LANCASTER, R IRISH FUS, KING'S LIVERPOOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 8 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 8 September , 2010 SEATED RIGHT RIFLE BRIGADE, OX AND BUCKS LI, DURHAM LI, LOW SGT R WELSH FUS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 8 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 8 September , 2010 LAST BUT NOT LEAST SEATED ON THE GROUND FRONT RIGHT LANCASHIRE FUSILIERS, NORTHUMBERLAND FUS T BELOW COLLAR BADGE, GREEN HOWARDS, UNKNOWN REGT, FRENCH LIASON OFF, 11TH PIONEER BN KINGS LIVERPOOL REGT. IF ANY ONE CAN SHED ANY LIGHT ON THE CROSSED SWORDS COLLARS OR THE SEAFORTH SHOULDER BADGES I WOULD BE VERY GRATEFULL. REGARDS JOHN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Dunlop Posted 8 September , 2010 Share Posted 8 September , 2010 Are there any Lt Colonels in the mix? I have three names of musketry instructors. Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 8 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 8 September , 2010 Hi The Rifle Brgade Officer in the centre has three cuff rings although stars and crowns cannot be seen which could be either a Lieutenant Colonel or a Major. regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Stewart Posted 9 September , 2010 Share Posted 9 September , 2010 Nice one John and very unusual. Noted the brassards with crossed rifles too. Might be off the mark here, but the lads wearing the crossed swords may be qualified as both Musketry Instructors and P.T.I's, however regs may decree that only the highest trade appointment is to be worn on the sleeve, so they wouldn't be able to wear the crossed swords below the crossed rifles. As you well know some 'old' soldiers have a flare for wearing things non-regulation, so I wonder if vanity took over and they decided to wear the crossed swords as collars just to say "b*gger regs". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 9 September , 2010 Share Posted 9 September , 2010 Super foto and I like the commentary! The sgt with arm band has crossed everything: swords rifles and flags! Any chance of a high res. scan by email please: I would like to do a "size" and "shape" examination of all the various crossed swords badges. By the way, the regulation regarding two "trade" badges was post-war ...... there are lots of 1914 18 examples of two on one arm, including instructor. A fairly recent post showed an Hussar Sgt with HG and MG upper right arm ..... can't find it at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grovetown Posted 9 September , 2010 Share Posted 9 September , 2010 A fairly recent post showed an Hussar Sgt with HG and MG upper right arm ..... can't find it at the moment. Voila! http://1914-1918.inv...howtopic=150059 GT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Upton Posted 9 September , 2010 Share Posted 9 September , 2010 And hopefully: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 9 September , 2010 Share Posted 9 September , 2010 good old forum, this. Complete with viola! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 9 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 9 September , 2010 Grumpy, a scan at 1200 dpi has been sent to both email address' that I have for you. regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 10 September , 2010 Share Posted 10 September , 2010 public thanks .... I will have a good look and put my thoughts up here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBrockway Posted 10 September , 2010 Share Posted 10 September , 2010 SEATED RIGHT RIFLE BRIGADE, OX AND BUCKS LI, DURHAM LI, LOW SGT R WELSH FUS Pals, Could that be a DSO ribbon (with the well-known tone distortion caused by orthochromatic film) being worn by the Rifle Brigade officer? Several KRRC and RB officers were heavily involved in setting up sniping & scouting schools. The Expert and I have been chatting, because this chap seems familiar to both of us. We have some possible names and Andy's going to check his photos. Cheers, Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Dunlop Posted 11 September , 2010 Share Posted 11 September , 2010 The Rifle Brigade Officer in the centre...Thanks John, I am completely hopeless when it comes to cap badges (except NZ ) and determining ranks from photographs . Here is a name that comes from 'Notes for Commanding Officers':Lieut-Colonel J. Micklem, D.S.O., M.C., Rifle Brigade. He gave a lecture on musketry to the 5th Course at the Senior Officers' School in Aldershot, 1917. A Lieut-Colonel Luckock (D.S.O.) is also mentioned as someone who gave a lecture. His regiment is not listed but he was General Staff (Training), 4th Army, France. No other reason for offering the names. Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 11 September , 2010 Share Posted 11 September , 2010 Could that be a DSO ribbon (with the well-known tone distortion caused by orthochromatic film) being worn by the Rifle Brigade officer?Several KRRC and RB officers were heavily involved in setting up sniping & scouting schools. The Expert and I have been chatting, because this chap seems familiar to both of us. We have some possible names and Andy's going to check his photos. Could be a DSO ribbon. And he's a Major, by the way (3 rings on his cuff, a crown just about visible on his left - our right) sleeve. But, of course, several other regiments used essentially the same badge as RB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 11 September , 2010 Share Posted 11 September , 2010 First things first: it is a reasonable deduction that this is a Musketry Course, F&F. Trying to date it, I can see no OR economy jackets. As the photo is extremely unlikey to be 1914 [too much going on for Schools to be set up in F&F], it is probably post-1915, the heyday of the economy. But there are no badges for the wounded that I can see, which [unless all these men were very lucky and were never scratched] suggests pre-July 1916, the grant of the badge. I suggest the officers and men with dark armband [some with x rifles thereon] are course staff/ instructors. There seem to be no OR below sergeant, so all the non-armbanded OR COULD be Sergeant instructors musketry in their own battalions [snag there is that they should have been left to instruct in UK, along with Bandmasters and blanket stackers]. As for the x swords collar badges, one lives and learns! Over! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyneside Chinaman Posted 11 September , 2010 Author Share Posted 11 September , 2010 Hi it must be after July 16 as the Hampshire Sgt has two wound badges they are visible in post 6 between the heads of the Notts and Derby and HLI Sgts. Also the HLI Sgt has a Cloth title on his left shoulder. The dealer I bought it off had another card of just officers in front of the same hut but I had spent everything so couldn't buy it. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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