'Between Two Worlds'

[Mark Hone]

On Sunday last, Radio 3 broadcast an interesting (and long!) radio play 'Between Two Worlds' about Sir Oliver Lodge and his quest for evidence of the afterlife. Lodge was a friend of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle and his interest in Spiritualism was, like many people at the time, piqued by bereavement in the Great War. His son Raymond of the South Lancs was killed in 1915 and is buried at Birr Cross Roads.

The play is available to listen on iPlayer for a few more days. Next week's 'Drama on Three' on Sunday evening also has a Great War connection. It is apparently an espionage drama about Turkey's entrance into the war.

[J Banning]

Thanks Mark. Missed this one. Website here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00szxst

BBC iPlayer link here: http://beta.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/console/b00szxst/Drama_on_3_Between_Two_Worlds

It's only available for another three days.

[MichaelBully]

Thank you very much Mark. I had read about Sir Oliver Lodge in the work of modern day 'Survivalists' , who believe that there is a case for life after death, from a non-religious scientific perspective. Interesting to realise that one of the effects of the Great War was an interest in Spiritualism. Did not know about his son Raymond's death in the Great War. Will listen to this play.

Regards

Michael Bully

[Mark Hone]

I managed to listen to all of the play before it disappeared from iPlayer. It was very well-written and acted, if rather predictable in development. One of the authors was David Hendy, a Reader in Media and Communication at Westminster University who used to be a BBC producer. He also acted as Historical consultant. The play was obviously carefully researched and had some interesting quotations from Raymond Lodge's letters from the front, as well as re-enactments of some of the seances from original transcripts. A recurring element was the bizarre experiment conducted in the 1950s involving sealed envelopes left by Sir Oliver after his death. Towards the end of the play, Sir Oliver Lodge visited his son's grave at Birr Cross Roads. I found the whole thing particularly interesting as I came across Lieutenant Raymond Lodge's grave by chance a few years ago and subsequently did some research on the family background.

[edwin astill]

Missed the play, but I expect much of the material came from Sir Oliver's book "Raymond or Life and Death: with Examples of the Evidence for Survival of Memory and Affection after Death" I have a newish facsimile reprint by Kessinger Publishing, bought because of my interest in the battalion as part of 3rd then 25th Division. I'll have another go at reading it, but when I first got it I found it all a bit confusing.

Edwin

[MichaelBully]

I listened to the whole play last night via Radio 3 I player. Very impressed. Not easy to follow at times as the play veered from Edwardian times to 1915, then 1950's, but as an attempt to understand the impact of the Great War on people who were interested in Spiritualism, or became interested in Spiritualism due to losing a loved one in the War it was very thoughtful,

I found it very stimulating in trying to understand how people at the time of the Great War would cope with a loss.

Thank you again Mark for highlighting this play.

Michael Bully

[Guest DavidHendy]

Hello,

I'm the co-writer of 'Between Two Worlds', and have just joined the Great War Forum. I'm pleased that the play was of interest to some members of the Forum. Much of the material did indeed come from the 'Raymond' book; but my background work also drew on the records of the Society for Psychical Research, other war memoirs, sermons, letters, etc, and academic work by Jay Winter and others. I'm an historian of broadcasting and nineteenth/twentieth century culture, and have become more and more interested in the importance of war in shaping the media. As well as having researched Oliver Lodge, I've started researching the impact of 1914-1918 war-time experiences on those who went on to create broadcasting in the 1920s.

David Hendy, University of Westminster.

[ianw]

Welcome to the Forum , David.

This is certainly an interesting area of study - I am sure that Reith's war time experiences shaped his management of the BBC. The Great War was crucible through which all these people came, of course.

[edwin astill]

Back to the psychic theme, my grandfather was a Roman Catholic, and all that sort of thing was not encouraged by the Church. However, he used to talk about some odd experiences - much along the lines of those mentioned by Graves in "Goodbye to all That". I believe he took part in some "table knocking" after the war, with results that he said "shook me".

Edwin

[MichaelBully]

Pleased that you have joined us David. I was wondering, was the interest in Spiritualism during and immediately after the Great War a concern to the established churches? Have you found sermons where ministers have preached against Spritualism?

Regards, Michael Bully

Hello,

I'm the co-writer of 'Between Two Worlds', and have just joined the Great War Forum. I'm pleased that the play was of interest to some members of the Forum. Much of the material did indeed come from the 'Raymond' book; but my background work also drew on the records of the Society for Psychical Research, other war memoirs, sermons, letters, etc, and academic work by Jay Winter and others. I'm an historian of broadcasting and nineteenth/twentieth century culture, and have become more and more interested in the importance of war in shaping the media. As well as having researched Oliver Lodge, I've started researching the impact of 1914-1918 war-time experiences on those who went on to create broadcasting in the 1920s.

David Hendy, University of Westminster.

[Guest DavidHendy]

Hello Michael,

You asked if interest in Spiritualism during the Great War was of concern to the established churches, and about sermons preaching against it. Yes, indeed. In my researches I came across a small fraction of what I assume to be a large body of such sermons and writings. One outstanding example was that delivered by Viscount Halifax at St. Martin's-in-the-Fields on February 14th 1917, titled "Raymond: some criticisms" - and some of the dialogue in the 'Between Two Worlds' play was taken from this speech. I also came across a number of books published by wartime chaplains, in which Spiritualism, superstitions, etc, were discussed. These included Dugald MacFadyen, Our Mess: Mess Table Talks in France (1917), and William Duncan Geare, Letters of an Army Chaplain (1918). There's a good discussion of the established church's reaction to Oliver Lodge's book in Jay Winter's book, 'Sites of Memory, Sites of Mourning', which also gave me some interesting ideas for the play.

Best, David.

[MichaelBully]

Thank you for sharing more of your sources David. I was wondering, do you think that the Spiritualism that was emerging in response to the Great War losses was essentially Christian, even though not accepted by the mainstream churches, or do you think that it was something 'alternative' as it were? What do you think that Sir Oliver Lodge was ultimately aiming to do by writing 'Raymond....' Was it to strengthen the existing Spiritualist current or start some other movement?

With best wishes

Michael

[MichaelBully]

With reference to Sir Oliver Lodge's book "Raymond or Life and Death: with Examples of the Evidence for Survival of Memory and Affection after Death", I have been reading Jean Moorcroft Wilson's Siegfried Sassoon (two part biography ) : The first volume is 'Siegfried Sassoon 'The Making of a War Poet-1886-1918'.

The author suggests that Robert Graves' account in 'Goodbye To All That' of visiting and staying with an officer friend at his mother's house in Kent was a reference to some leave he took with Seigfried Sassoon at Theresa Sassoon's house in 1917, which seems to be accepted. Seigfried Sassoon and Robert Graves had a falling out when 'Goodbye To All That' was published many years later.

Roberts Graves did not name Theresa Sassoon but the fact that she kept her son Hamo's bedroom in immaculate condition some two years after he was killed in action, with clean sheets and fresh flowers,just like the mother of the fellow officer Graves mentioned, suggests that Graves was referring to Siegfried Sassoon's mother.

Graves recalls in 'Goodbye To All That' at said place, how he was kept awake by rapping noises,sobs and shrieks and ended up leaving after one night . Jean Moorcroft Wilson mentions that Theresa Sassoon was inspired by reading 'Raymond' to attempt to make contact with her deceased son and that this was confirmed by Seigfried Sassoon's diary.

Jean Moorcroft Wilson points out that if accepted that Robert Graves was referring to a visit to Theresa Sassoon's house, Graves did not leave after one night but stayed on, so the 'Goodbye To All That' account could well have been an embellishment.