Nick Allan Posted 29 January , 2010 Share Posted 29 January , 2010 Hi, My Great-Great Uncle fought with the 5th Battalion Gordon Highlanders and was killed between the 16th and 17th May 1917 during an attack and counter-attack in the vicinity of Cupid Trench, North of Roeux. The war diary for those two days is brutal reading and there is mention of frantic action and heavy casualties being sustained in and around several named trenches. Does anyone know of a map that shows the trench system in this area ? I am very interested in Cupid, Curly, Crash, Cardigan, Calabar, Clover, Crow and Crook trenches. If anyone can point me in the right direction I would be very grateful. I am heading to Roeux in March and amazingly I think I might be the first ever member of my family to visit the graveside at Brown's Copse. Thanks folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trenchtrotter Posted 29 January , 2010 Share Posted 29 January , 2010 Im sure I have a small unit issue paper map or two for this area...will look tomorrow and if so scan and post. TT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Allan Posted 29 January , 2010 Author Share Posted 29 January , 2010 Im sure I have a small unit issue paper map or two for this area...will look tomorrow and if so scan and post. TT I would appreciate that, many thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 29 January , 2010 Share Posted 29 January , 2010 Hope this helps a bit. Cheers Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 29 January , 2010 Share Posted 29 January , 2010 This is Roeux 18/5/1917 ( I think ) It will give you an idea of the state of the ground at the time. A relation also fell in this action, 17/5/1917 with the 1/8th Argyll & Southern Highlanders. There is a very good account of the battle in Bewsher's book The History of the Fifty First ( Highland ) Division Cheers Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Allan Posted 29 January , 2010 Author Share Posted 29 January , 2010 Hope this helps a bit. Cheers Mike This is brilliant Mike, thank you for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eltoro1960 Posted 29 January , 2010 Share Posted 29 January , 2010 The trenches you refer to were dug and developed to a large extent by the 8th Royal Scots who were the Pioneers of the 51st Highland Division. The fighting for the Chemical Works at Rouex was amongst some of the bloodiest and severe of the war. I had the privilige of visiting Fampoux and Rouex where I took part in a Documentary about the attacks of the 11th and 12th April,1917 by the 4th and the 9th (Scottish) Division. If you visit my website you can read a bit about the battle. I can also recommend an excellent guest house in Fampoux that I stayed in, the bedroom window looks out over the battlefield to the pretty Brown's Copse Cemetery about 400 yards away. Just to make you aware though the battlefied is now bi-sected by a dirty great motorway and a TGV line, so has changed a bit. The Chemical Works was demolished years ago and a Shoppi supermarket was built on the site. Murder on the Hill documentary Greenland Hill Browns Copse Hope this assists John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 29 January , 2010 Share Posted 29 January , 2010 I'm sure you will have a great trip, we were there last summer. We too were the first members of family to visit, and it was very moving. If I can offer one bit of advice, plan your photographs, and keep a note of them. I am 99% sure this is Roeux Cheers Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Allan Posted 29 January , 2010 Author Share Posted 29 January , 2010 The trenches you refer to were dug and developed to a large extent by the 8th Royal Scots who were the Pioneers of the 51st Highland Division. The fighting for the Chemical Works at Rouex was amongst some of the bloodiest and severe of the war. I had the privilige of visiting Fampoux and Rouex where I took part in a Documentary about the attacks of the 11th and 12th April,1917 by the 4th and the 9th (Scottish) Division. If you visit my website you can read a bit about the battle. I can also recommend an excellent guest house in Fampoux that I stayed in, the bedroom window looks out over the battlefield to the pretty Brown's Copse Cemetery about 400 yards away. Just to make you aware though the battlefied is now bi-sected by a dirty great motorway and a TGV line, so has changed a bit. The Chemical Works was demolished years ago and a Shoppi supermarket was built on the site. Murder on the Hill documentary Greenland Hill Browns Copse Hope this assists John John, Thank you very much for all the information and links. This has been an fascinating journey so far from finding a Press and Journal newspaper cutting in the old family Bible recording the death of a relative, unknown and forgotten to recent generations, to being able to start to piece together a dramatic and tragic piece of family history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Allan Posted 29 January , 2010 Author Share Posted 29 January , 2010 I'm sure you will have a great trip, we were there last summer. We too were the first members of family to visit, and it was very moving. If I can offer one bit of advice, plan your photographs, and keep a note of them. I am 99% sure this is Roeux Cheers Mike Sound advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eltoro1960 Posted 29 January , 2010 Share Posted 29 January , 2010 Ah the P+J,a fine paper, as a matter of interest who was your GG Uncle? John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Allan Posted 29 January , 2010 Author Share Posted 29 January , 2010 Ah the P+J,a fine paper, as a matter of interest who was your GG Uncle? John George Chalmers (Private) Service no. 242074. He was 33 years old when he was killed. My maternal Granfather was in the Seaforths but I am struggling for much background info except I believe he was at Beaumont Hamel at some point and served in Germany at Wupertallin (?) in 1919 , I wondered if this would place him in the 4th Battalion ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eltoro1960 Posted 30 January , 2010 Share Posted 30 January , 2010 This aerial picture will give you a rough idea of where the trenches were, the red dots are approximately where where Corona was. This is viewed from the East or German perspective. Edit - I see the red dots did not get saved..oops they should be in the bottom left, between the Triangle where the roads meet and the Chemical Works. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trenchtrotter Posted 30 January , 2010 Share Posted 30 January , 2010 Lets see what the quality is like. If good will scan further parts of map. Original paper map and marked to J Corps..anyone know what they were? TT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trenchtrotter Posted 30 January , 2010 Share Posted 30 January , 2010 From a different map but same series. Very fragile. TT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trenchtrotter Posted 30 January , 2010 Share Posted 30 January , 2010 Eskmill, Let me know if you need more of the maps as I only scanned relevant bits. TT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Allan Posted 30 January , 2010 Author Share Posted 30 January , 2010 Eskmill, Let me know if you need more of the maps as I only scanned relevant bits. TT Thank you very much. They cover the exact area detailed very graphically in the war diary for the two days in question. With everones help over the last two days I can see that my GG Uncle fought and died somewhere to the North of the main railway line and not, as was originally thought, on the site of the Chemical works. The maps have also allowed me to identify the location of the Battalion HQ for the duration of this action - established under the railway arch at the Southern end of Crash trench. I don't suppose evidence of the arch still exists but I will check it out when I make my visit. At this moment in time I could do with a few pointers to help identify the exact Company he served with in this action. Companies A,B,C and D were involved It has been a fascinating and rewarding 24 hours folks, thanks to all This aerial picture will give you a rough idea of where the trenches were, the red dots are approximately where where Corona was. This is viewed from the East or German perspective. Edit - I see the red dots did not get saved..oops they should be in the bottom left, between the Triangle where the roads meet and the Chemical Works. John Thank you John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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