Body Density Maps

[dfaulder]

On the WFA Mapping the Front (Ypres) CDs I have found on image M_5_000756.jpg a body density map. The data are overwritten on a Sheet 28 Edition 3 and shows 26 from sub-square N.10.a (NW), 9 from sub-square N.10.b (NE) and 2 from sub-square N.10.d (SE). How can I (indeed can I?) tie these figures back to some form of dated document like a unit war diary?

The CWGC says of the Suffolk cemetery (in N.10. that it "was not used again until October 1918 when the 38th Labour Group buried men killed during the German advance the previous April". 28 where buried in the Suffolk in October 1918. There were probably other burials in the other three cemeteries nearby, but the CWGC's notes on those cemeteries are not as useful as the note on the Suffolk.

Would these body density maps relate to the Oct 1918 work or to a post war clearance?

TIA

David

[Peter Woodger]

David

The body density maps were prepared by the Directorate of Graves Registration and Enquires (DGRE) in early 1919. They indicated to the Labour companies, about to start clearance, where bodies were registered as buried according to DGRE records. The blue figures do not contain any numbers from “registered” cemeteries within the square even if that cemetery is due for concentration elsewhere. Unburied bodies and bodies whose temporary burial was not notified to DGRE are not included.

Peter

[dfaulder]

Peter

Thanks for your reply. This would seem to indicate to me that the post war groups were in effect being told that there were, for instance, probably 9 bodies to be looked for in N.10.b (NE). It raises a number of further questions

In theory therefore the records of DGRE would contain details of these nine war-time burials (presumably either isolated graves, or trench type group burials). Given that the nearby Suffolk cemetery was established relatively early in the war and that until late April 1918 this area was in British hands, is it reasonable to presume that any pre-April 1918 burials (because they were "behind the lines") would have been into an established cemetery such as the Suffolk (or Klien-Vierstraat, or possibly Kemmel No.1 Cemeteries) and therefore these 9 relate to April 1918 and the period following? Do the DGRE records still exist - possibly at CWGC - and if so does anyone have any experience of accessing them?

Following this particular example, do we have any way of knowing whether the figure (9 in N10 NE) takes account of the October 1918 work of the Labour Corps which recovered a number of bodies from this general area?

Is there any record of the bodies actually recovered from each square by the post-war clearances - or is it the impossible task of working backwards from a grave record to an indication of where the body in that grave was found? I would imagine that the number recovered compared to the number on the body density maps could in some cases be very low due to a combination of natural decay, post-burial shelling, other recovery operations, and just not being able to find bodies due either to them being too deep or the search units being too inexperienced. (This might be counter balanced by finding some unregistered burials or bodies that were never formally buried.)

David

[Peter Woodger]

David

It is not reasonable to assume that the 9 are post 1918 clearance work. No wartime clearance would exhume bodies, the object was always to remove exposed bodies. It is also not reasonable to assume that because the area was behind the lines that all burials would be made in established cemeteries. There are many examples of bodies found after long exposure being buried within 200 yards of an open cemetery and also of burials of identified men where they fell even as another group were finding and removing bodies to a new cemetery.

WE must put into context the size of the square that has the blue number applied. It is 500 yards square so that if you stood in one corner it is the length of 5 football pitches and a width of 10 pitches. When I saw one with over 900 burials my thought was that they must lie very closely packed but then I realised that buried side by side and head to toe there would be 125,000 bodies per square.

The accuracy of the blue figures is very suspect. The accuracy of the map reference of the person who buried them was not always good in fact often no map reference was given, instead the location could be given as a shellhole between the German 2nd and 3rd line. The labour companies also gave suspect map references for their finds so that comparison of expected to results is difficult.

What then was the use of the blue figures? They were for planning purposes. If the figure was 9 the search was not repeated if only 8 were found or stopped when 9 were found. The commander of the search party could plan the order of the number of markers required and also asses the time required for exhumation based on the expected number of burials.

Peter

[dfaulder]

>><<It is not reasonable to assume that the 9 are post 1918 clearance work. No wartime clearance would exhume bodies, the object was always to remove exposed bodies. It is also not reasonable to assume that because the area was behind the lines that all burials would be made in established cemeteries. There are many examples of bodies found after long exposure being buried within 200 yards of an open cemetery and also of burials of identified men where they fell even as another group were finding and removing bodies to a new cemetery.>><<

Peter

Thanks for this. Presumably by "exposed" you mean those that were "not buried"; as presumably partially covered/exposed bodies were removed. The majority of bodies recovered from this area in October 1918 were identified and the regiment and rank (or both) of the unknowns was also established (with two exceptions, where somehow they infer that they were "not Y&L"). Would this have been the case if the body had been lying exposed on the surface for close to six months?

Your final sentence in the paragraph somehow amazes me and yet somehow seems entirely credible!

David

[Peter Woodger]

David

I used exposed to mean both unburied and previously buried bodies that had been accidentally exhumed by shellfire.

Although there are cases, post war, where inference is used in the identification of bodies I believe that during the war the criterion for identification or partial identification was strict. You must ask yourself what was it that identified a body as Y&L but could not name him. Whatever that was was missing in the unidentified cases. This could be because too much of a recent casualty was missing or a body that had lain there a long time had lost the effects that would identify him.

Peter

[DRIFTER]

Having never seen a Body Density Map I might well be asking the impossible but if those with greater knowledge could have a look at my two topics regarding map reference 28.1.7a. 5,3 and it's follow-up directly under this topic on the forum I'd appreciate any assistance in identifying whether or not the location was a semi-official burial area and if possible how many bodies were located there.

Suspect it's a long shot but any help will be well received.

John

[claymore]

I've purchased the Western Front Association CD of Ypres maps and photos - great CD,by the way, lots of info - found the aerial photos taken by my relative's sortie on the day he was shot down.

I looked at the body density map for the area where his pilot was exhumed in 1921, and there's no markings for bodies anywhere near that location, although I have documents that give the grid references for at least a dozen bodies recovered in that area.

Where, if anywhere, would I find a map showing actual locations where bodies were recovered? Thanks.

[gregirving]

Does anyone have a body density map covering the R31a region just south of Thiepval (Leipzig Salient) ?

Greg

[jay dubaya]

Greg, I have a copy but I'm out and about for the rest of the day so if no one else responds in the meantime I'll post later

Jon