Pte. Alexander J. Riding, 1/19 Lond. Regt.

[alan_42]

Would be most grateful if anyone could help add to my rather sketchy knowledge on my grandads war service or offer any ideas for further research.

I know that he was a Londoner, 16 when he arrived in france on the 3.12.15 and would have served with the 47th Div. I have his medal records and can

therefore follow his movements through div histories etc., but his new year cards from Dec 1918 show him no longer with the 1/19 London but the 1/7

London 'shiny seventh' who in feb 1918 were attached to 58th div from a different brigade of the 47th. I know that at some point he was wounded

(thought shot more than once, prob. machine gunned) but when and where, and if this ultimately led to his transfer from the 1/19 is a mystery.

Following the war he served in the Middlesex (for how long is unknown). His original no. was 4169 and laterly L/19389. If there is anything, however

minor that you feel may be of assistance to me i would appreciate your help. Many thanks.

[Guest]

Would be most grateful if anyone could help add to my rather sketchy knowledge on my grandads war service or offer any ideas for further research.

I know that he was a Londoner, 16 when he arrived in france on the 3.12.15 and would have served with the 47th Div. I have his medal records and can

therefore follow his movements through div histories etc., but his new year cards from Dec 1918 show him no longer with the 1/19 London but the 1/7

London 'shiny seventh' who in feb 1918 were attached to 58th div from a different brigade of the 47th. I know that at some point he was wounded

(thought shot more than once, prob. machine gunned) but when and where, and if this ultimately led to his transfer from the 1/19 is a mystery.

Following the war he served in the Middlesex (for how long is unknown). His original no. was 4169 and laterly L/19389. If there is anything, however

minor that you feel may be of assistance to me i would appreciate your help. Many thanks.

[alan_42]

Many thanks Bembridge for taking time to reply to my post, but as only consisted of quote from original text am not sure is of any help. Being new to forum perhaps my etiquette was wrong. If so i apologise but thanks for taking the time nevertheless.

Alan Riding

[Charles Fair]

Alan,

He would be the following man from my database of 19th Londons:

Pte Alexander John RIDING

* regimental numbers 4169 and 616233

* served overseas with 1/19th Londons

* transferred to 7th Londons (with the same number 616233) and served overseas with them, but I dont know the date of transfer

* he then ended up in the Middlesex Regt (with a new regimental number) L/19399, but I dont believe served overseas with them (but this is why his on their medal rolls)

From his original 4 digit 19th London number 4169 I can deduce that he almost certainly enlisted into the 19th on 1 May 1915. (Numbers 4170-4175 all enlisted on that date.) That in turn implies that he was fairly local to Camden Town. He would have gone initially into the 3/19th in England before being posted to the 1/19th in France.

The only source I have is the BW&VM Rolls of the Middlesex Regiment where he is on page 2878. You would need to track down his service record (if it survives) to find out more.

The 19th London Old Comrades Association is still going strong, though these days run by descendents. We have a battlefield tour which is happening in September if you would like to join us. We will be going to the Somme where it sounds like he would probably have served from the dates that you have been able to supply. Please send me an email via the forum.

Looking forward to hearing from you,

Charles

[alan_42]

Charles,

Many thanks for taking the trouble to reply to my message, the information was both very informative and much appreciated.

Sadly, his service record was one of the many lost but having just started to research him i am determined to take it as far as possible. Having become aware of your extensive work on the 1/19 i was wondering if any is commercially, or otherwise, available, and whether you would be kind enough to suggest any avenues of research that may allow me to shed more light on the reasons and dates for his transfers, change of reg. no. or when he was wounded.

I was also very interested to hear of the Old Comrades Assoc. and your planned trip to the Somme so if your have any further info. i would be even further grateful. Being new to the forum i am as yet unable to use the email facility.

Once again, many thanks.

Alan.

[Charles Fair]

Alan - I will send you a message with my contact details

regards

Charles

[Guest philip4169]

I can add little to Alan and Charles' details of my father's military record. I understood his service record to have been destroyed in 1940 by enemy action.

Alexander John Riding was born in November 1899 in Central London, and lived in and around Great Titchfield Street, not too far from Camden Town as Charles correctly deduces.

His Certificate of Discharge dated 19th February 1919 from 7th London Regiment shows that he joined the 19th London on 1st May 1915 (ie aged 15 years and 5 months). I have a picture of him taken at Tadworth Camp in 1915 when I assume he was in training. He went to France on 3rd December 1915, just after his 16th birthday. Details of his experiences in the war remain sketchy. I don't know when or where he was wounded. Were any records kept that may have escaped destruction of wounded troops, where they were treated and convalescence homes they were sent to? Would soldiers of the same units be treated together? Perhaps he was transferred to the 7th when returning to duty as I believe that both the 7th & 19th were part of 47th Division up to January 1918. Is this a fair assumption?

I was very interested to read of Major Charles H Fair's account of returning to "Old Haunt's Revisted" in April 1920 as it was both fresh in his memory and gives a good idea of where my father served in the same regiment, and actions they were involved in. I would be interested in visiting the areas where they both served.

After discharge from the 7th London he then re-enlisted in the 4th Middlesex for a further 3 years 47 days before being discharged on 31st March 1922 in Gibraltar as a L/Corporal.

Thanks for your efforts,

Philip

[Guest philip4169]

I can add little to Alan and Charles' details of my father's military record. I understood his service record to have been destroyed in 1940 by enemy action.

Alexander John Riding was born in November 1899 in Central London, and lived in and around Great Titchfield Street, not too far from Camden Town as Charles correctly deduces.

His Certificate of Discharge dated 19th February 1919 from 7th London Regiment shows that he joined the 19th London on 1st May 1915 (ie aged 15 years and 5 months). I have a picture of him taken at Tadworth Camp in 1915 when I assume he was in training. He went to France on 3rd December 1915, just after his 16th birthday. Details of his experiences in the war remain sketchy. I don't know when or where he was wounded. Were any records kept that may have escaped destruction of wounded troops, where they were treated and convalescence homes they were sent to? Would soldiers of the same units be treated together? Perhaps he was transferred to the 7th when returning to duty as I believe that both the 7th & 19th were part of 47th Division up to January 1918. Is this a fair assumption?

I was very interested to read of Major Charles H Fair's account of returning to "Old Haunt's Revisted" in April 1920 as it was both fresh in his memory and gives a good idea of where my father served in the same regiment, and actions they were involved in. I would be interested in visiting the areas where they both served.

After discharge from the 7th London he then re-enlisted in the 4th Middlesex for a further 3 years 47 days before being discharged on 31st March 1922 in Gibraltar as a L/Corporal.

Thanks for your efforts,

Philip

[Charles Fair]

Hello Philip, Thanks for the photograph. That would have been taken when he was with the reserve battalion of the 19th Londons, the 3/19th, who were based at Tadworth until mid-November 1915.

The one source that I havent checked is the local paper the St Pancras Gazette which is good at listing the wounded from the battalion. I will see if he turns up in that.

Charles