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Remembered Today:

Charles William BARTRUP (RFA)


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Ladies & Gents,

Pal's,

a friend of mine informs me that her Great Uncle Charles William BARTRUP died on 27/6/1915 in Malta whilst serving with the RFA.

I checked the CWGC site and can only find 3 Bartrups died during the Great War, sadly they appear to be brothers killed within 4 months of each other and none ident with Charles! (Albert, Alfred & Walter)

Any Pal's out there come up with info on this Gent please?

Regards,

Scottie.

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Steve,

thank you for your interest and help, however not sure it is the man as the surname on this MIC is spelt Bartrop and my friend is sure that the correct spelling is Bartrup!

There appear to have been only 9 MIC for Bartrups and none of them a Charles!

The plot thickens!

Think i will have to get her to seek more info, strangly she is adamant that he died in Malta on 27th June 1915, perhaps a phone call to the CWGC may help, dont know if they can do a date search for a casualty?

Thanks for your help,

Regards,

Scottie.

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Nobody called Bartrip, Bartrup or Bartrop is listed by CWGC as dying on that day. Nor are there any men of those names and with a forename of Charles in the GRO Overseas Military Death Index listed on any date.

Family stories are often unreliable - as are memories. Is there any documentary evidence?

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With a wobbly memory, this could be him..... 'Mikra' could be misunderstood as 'Malta'.

Name: BARTRAM, CHARLES WILLIAM

Initials: C W

Nationality: United Kingdom

Rank: Private

Regiment/Service: Worcestershire Regiment

Unit Text: 11th Bn.

Age: 31

Date of Death: 09/05/1917

Service No: 34735

Additional information: Son of Benjamin Bartram, of Rockwell Green, Wellington; husband of H. Phillips (formerly Bartram), of Higher Mynhead, Wellington, Somerset.

Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead

Grave/Memorial Reference: 10.

Cemetery: MIKRA BRITISH CEMETERY, KALAMARIA

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Terry,

thank you very much for your work on this, it is very much appreciated. You are so right about family memories. I had considered this Gent but my friend gave a birth year of 1893 which I think makes him 24 in 1917 and he came from the East End of London, so dont think he is ident.

She has taken the dates from a family members hand written papers so no real provenance there, I will have to get back to her and tell her it appears 'No trace' at the moment!

Thanks again,

Regards,

Scottie.

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Scottie,

The only Charles William BARTRUP in the BMD records was a brother of the three casualties on CWGC.

1901 Census

33 Ascot St, Canning Town, West Ham

BARTRUP Eliza, Head, Married, 39, Trouser Machinist (Tailor), b Mile End

BARTRUP Eliza, Dau, 18, Best Hand, b Stepney (?Eliza Jane, b Stepney Q2 1883)

BARTRUP William, Son, 16, b Stepney (William Charles, b Stepney Q1 1885, died W.Ham Q1 1906 age 21)

BARTRUP Alice, Dau, 14, b Limehouse (Alice Mary, b Stepney Q4 1886)

BARTRUP Henry, Son, 9, b Canning Town (Henry, b W.Ham Q4 1891)

BARTRUP Charles, Son, 8, b Canning Town (Charles William, b W.Ham Q2 1893)

BARTRUP Frederick, Son, 5, b Canning Town (Frederick John, b W.Ham Q1 1896)

BARTRUP Alfred, Son, 3, b Canning Town (Alfred, b W.Ham Q2 1898)

BARTRUP Walter, Son, 3, b Canning Town (Walter, b W.Ham Q2 1898)

BARTRUP Rose, Dau, 8 months, b Canning Town (Rosina Violet, b W.Ham Q4 1900)

From comparing other census, there were also 2 older sons who had left home by 1901:

BARTRUP Joseph, born Stepney Q1 1878 (age 3 in 1881)

In 1901 Joseph was staying with the CLARK (or CLACK) family (he was their nephew) at 51 Bulwark St, Dover, age 23, Contractor's Labourer.

BARTRUP Albert, born Stepney Q3 1880 (age 8 months in 1881)

In 1901 Albert was Lodger at a boarding house full of dock workers at 65 Bow Lane, Poplar, age 21, Ship Painter.

Possibly another son who died in infancy:

BARTRUP Charles Henry, born Mile End Q2 1889, died Stepney Q3 1889

And the father, according to the 1881 census, was:

BARTRUP Joseph, born Bromley, Mdx, c.1855 (Ship Labourer, age 26 in 1881)

No sign of Charles William after 1901. With the family's nautical background, maybe he was a sailor?

Adrian

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BARTRUP Charles, Son, 8, b Canning Town (Charles William, b W.Ham Q2 1893)

I guess Canning Town in West Ham could be interpreted as 'the East End of London'? Seems a quite possible match to me.

Remember also that the spelling of surnames on MIC's, CWGC, and SDGW isn't always correct.

cheers

Steve

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I've also just checked the SDGW and there are no soldiers by that name that died on that date with that surname. The soldier mentioned by Terry 'Died of Wounds' in Salonika so I doubt it's him.

I've also tried BARTROP, BARTRUP, BARTRAP, BARTRIP, BARTROPH, BARTRUM, BARTRAM, BURTRUM and BURTRAM and nothing apparent comes out.

There is a Charles BARCOCK from Kentish Town but he was killed in 1914 in Flanders, this is him:

Name: BARCOCK, CHARLES

Initials: C

Nationality: United Kingdom

Rank: Gunner

Regiment/Service: Royal Field Artillery

Unit Text: 51st Bty.

Age: 20

Date of Death: 20/11/1914

Service No: 70766

Additional information: Son of William and Angelina Barcock.

Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead

Grave/Memorial Reference: III. H. 27/34.

Cemetery: SANCTUARY WOOD CEMETERY

Steve

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Gents,

thank you all very much for your help on this, it is appreciated.

Adrian,

I passed your info on and that is the Charles my friend is interested in! so he is a brother to the three men on the CWGC site.

She was compltetly unaware about the Clack connection and she is really pleased to know this and given her another avenue of research, thank you!

(Sfayers) Steve

yep the Canning Town/west Ham connection is regarded as 'East London' but as a 'Norf Londoner' i don't venture that way much, especially after dark!!!!!!!!!!!!

Steve,

thanks for trying the combination of names, i spoke to my friend earlier and she informs me that the 'death penny' for one of the brothers mentioned is actually in the family possession and that is spelt Bartrip!

Ian,

I will pass that onto her as she has just purchased a subscription to the site so she can follow this up!

thanks for all your help Pal's no closer to solving what/where/why Charles was thought to be buried in Malta but stacks of helpful stuff forthcoming,

Cheers,

Scottie.

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Hi Scottie,

Just did a quick check for you GRO Army Death Indices (1881-1955), and the GRO War Deaths Army Officers and Other Ranks Indices (1914-1921).

The closest match is Terry's Charles William Bartram died 9/05/1917. Other than that I couldn't find any remotely likely matches for Charles William Bartrup (or any variations on the name spelling) at all.

Seem to have drawn a blank I'm afraid!

Steve

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