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The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

Pte John Paterson 16959 1st Bn Scots Gds


johnnie

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I have been doing some resaerch on Private John Paterson from Ashington, Northumberland.

From his service documents I have found out that he was born in Eyemouth, Berwickshire,

but was a school teacher living at 172 Woodhorn Road, Ashington, Northumberland, when

he enlisted in 1917. He was 36 years old and was married to Ella Cook, and had three children,

Robert, James and Ellen.

He moved to F&F on the 16th of February 1918, however there are a number of thing I do not

understand on his service papers and I was wondering if anybody could help.

I have attached his casualty form below as I do not understand any of it (apart from the

top where it states the date he moved to France.

I was also wondering about his previous service. His short service form seems to suggest

previous service with N.F; N. Fus; and then something else I cannot work out.

His statement of service also states he was:

attested 11/12/1915

to army reserve 12/12/1915

Posted to A 26/06/1917

Scots Guards 26/06/1917

Transfered 16/02/1918

Why would there have been a gap between 1915 and the actual date of joining

in 1917. Could it be due to his age, or the fact he was a School teacher?

Also, why would his medical for disabilities have been carried out in Cologne. Could he

have been based there after the war (it is dated 25/01/1919) or could he have been a POW?

Any help would be great,

Jonathan

post-11843-1198935569.jpg

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I think I can answer one point - the Guards Division were based in Cologne after the war. They returned to London Feb/ March, 1919.

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Johnathan

As a schoolteacher he may have been classed in a 'reserved occupation'. Many police officers joined up at the same time as your man, and were immediately placed on the army reserve as Group 35 (Police). They were then called up when needed, many in 1917, but most in March 1918 during the German 'March' offensive.

John

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Something else which may or may not be obvious to you - the CCS referred to in April, 1918 stands for Casualty Clearing Station and the PUO (especially at that time) generally meant they were victims of the 'flu pandemic - Pyrexia Unknown Origin. So it seems your man was not wounded, just ill.

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Thanks for that. I had no idea what CCS so its a great

help.

Would the sheet seem to suggest he moved from the 1st Bn

Scots Gds to another regiment on the 2/3/18?

Does anybody have any idea what the initials stand

for after he has recovered and returned to duty?

Jonathan

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The card is not too clear but I can't see anything to suggest that he was transferred to another regiment. One of the words in the 2/3/18 entry appears to be 'Coy' - in other words, Company. The 10/4/18 entry seems to say 'Joined at Boulogne'. I have no idea what GDBD stands for. Guards Division ---- Depot?

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Jonathan,

He's a former NF Territorial going off the Attestation Sheet. The other information is as follows;-

12/12/15 - To A Res(To Class 'A' Reserve).

26/6/17 - Mob & Posted(Mobilised & Posted).

17/2/18 - G.D.B.D.(Guards Division Base Depot - Joined & Posted 1st Bn, S.G).

2/3/18 - OC BN( ? Battalion transferred to ? Battalion - to ? F Coy ?).

6/4/18 - 17 CCS(17th Casualty Clearing Station - ? PUO).

9/4/18 - 19 CCS(19th Casualty Clearing Station - ? PUO).

10/4/18 - G.D.B.D.(Guards Division Base Depot - Joined in Boulogne).

19/4/18 - OC BN(? Battalion - rejoined).

The OC BN could actually be Officer Cadet Battalion, thats if I'm reading it right. My suggestion is this is whats probably happend on his arrival in France, being a schoolteacher they put him forward for O.C. Training, but he's been taken ill twice and then transferred back to the GDBD and then back to the O.C. Bn.

Graham.

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Thanks for all of that.

I think it might be F Coy after looking at the sheet again.

I had thought that N F and N Fus would probably stand for

Northumberland Fusiliers, but I was unsure if he would have

been a Territorial or a soldier with the regiment in an earlier

conflict.

The bit after looks like Brig RGA 7 yrs in ? however it is very

unclear.

Jonathan

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Jonathan,

The sheet reads 'T.F. N.Fus', but I cant read the rest. It's the way the scribe has written the 'T', which makes it look like an 'N'.

Graham.

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I have blown up the form and tried to sharpen it on

the computer (although I have to admit I'm not to

good at this kind of stuff).

Thought it might help a little.

Jonathan

post-11843-1199124671.jpg

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Possibly Berwick R.G.A., which probably means he either transferred or left one to join the other.

Graham.

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I though RGA, and it could be Berwick. It would fit in as

he came from Eyemouth, and I am not sure when he

left the area and moved to Ashington (although he married

Ella in Newcastle in 1906).

Jonathan

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Jonathan

The National Union of Teachers War Record has one J. Paterson listed under Teachers Who Joined The Forces. His Association is given as "York".

Myrtle

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I wonder if York might have covered the whole of the North. If not there might have

been another J Paterson who was a school teacher and served in the Army.

Does it give any details of where he worked or who he served with?

Johnnie

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Jonathan

There were further Associations covering Northumberland. Ashington for example would probably have come within Northumberland (East) Association. There were 11 soldiers killed from that particular branch including one J. Patterson, Corporal with D.L.I. who worked at Bedlington County School. Also there was a Cpl. H. Tait D.L.I. who worked at 3, Sixth Row, Ashington.

There are no further details regarding J. Paterson with the York Association as he survived the war and those soldiers who survived are listed with just initial, surname and Association.

Maybe your J. Paterson was not a member of the union.

Myrtle

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Thanks for that.

It seems more the case that he wasn't a member at York seems quite a bit

out (and it there was a group in Northumberland that is where he would have

been a member).

Out of interest are there any men listed from Newbiggin by the sea?

Jonathan

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Jonathan

I suppose there is the possibility that J. Paterson was working at a school in the York area and therefore living in lodgings rather than at home. He would have then given his family home address when enlisting.

There is a Private A. Locke D.L.I. at Newbiggin West County School but not a mention of Newbiggin by the sea.

Myrtle

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That could be it. I was going to try and see if there were any school

registers/log book in the local archives that might mention teachers.

Thought I might be able to track him down that way. There is a school

near his given address that was going then, so could be a good start

point.

Jonathan

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If you find that he worked in a "primary" school it may explain him not being in an NUT Association. Many primary school teachers were not members of an Association.

Myrtle

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I think the 2-3-1918 reference refers to 16 or 76 Field Company Royal Engineers. I can't make out the first part though.

Steve.

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Stebie could be on the right track here as blowing it up seems to reveal "2/3/18 - Trans G.D.R.Battn to 16 F.Coy RE". Which to me speaks for itself - "Transferred Guards Depot Reserve Battalion to 16th Field Company, R.Engineers".

Graham.

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His MIC states he only served with the Scots Guards, but I agree that it does look

like he moved to the RE. Could this be a short term move and not mentioned on the

MIC?

Jonathan

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