Command Structure

[marsid]

Hi ,,

I am researching my fathers WW1 service ,( But whisper it qietly -- I am ex R.N. !!)but find I cannot get my head around brigades/ regiments/ battallions /divisions etc so am unable to find out where he was at any given time . I know he was in the 1st Royal Berkshire Regiment (does that mean the 1st Battallion of the Berks ). I THINK they were part of the 2nd Division in 1914/15 which is when he was in France . He was wounded at Loos ,but don't know if it was the Battle of Loos .

Any kind soul out there care to put this poor matelot out of his misery and describe the command structure of an army please

Thanks

[Greenwoodman]

If he was in 1st Berks, it does indeed mean 1st Battalion Royal Berkshire Regiment. There were indeed in 6th Infantry Brigade (at the start of the war, four battalions to a brigade) which was part of 2nd Division (3 Infantry brigades to the Division, plus pioneers, artillery, MG units, field ambulance and others).

On 13/12/15 1st Berks moved to 99th Infantry Brigade, and this brigade was also in 2nd Division at that time.

At the time of Loos, 2 Div was in I Corps (a Corps is a grouping of divisions), and I Corps was in 1st Army (an Army is made up of a number of corps).

What may further confuse you is that 1st Berks is part of the Royal Berkshire Regiment, but so are some 6 other fighting infantry battalions, as well as reserve and labour and training battalions. The other infantry battalions were allocated to other divisions and may have served in different theatres. I suppose a naval analogy might be that there might be a dozen Type 42 frigates in the Navy (we should be so lucky!), but they don't all sail out of the same port, or when we had fleets spread around the globe they would not all have been posted to the same fleet, although essentially doing the same tasks.

[MelPack]

Hello Titchy

According to your father's MIC his service number was 7039 and not 3079:

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documen...p;resultcount=4

As a pre-war regular/reservist he was probably entitled to the 1914 Star but the MIC will confirm the date of entry. He obviously transferred to the Engineers but, unfortunately, there is no sign of his service papers in WO363 or 364 on Ancestry.

You can follow the daily War Diary of the 1st Battalion Royal Berks on the museum website here:

https://www.thewardrobe.org.uk/wardiary.php

Regards

Mel

[marsid]

If he was in 1st Berks, it does indeed mean 1st Battalion Royal Berkshire Regiment. There were indeed in 6th Infantry Brigade (at the start of the war, four battalions to a brigade) which was part of 2nd Division (3 Infantry brigades to the Division, plus pioneers, artillery, MG units, field ambulance and others).

On 13/12/15 1st Berks moved to 99th Infantry Brigade, and this brigade was also in 2nd Division at that time.

At the time of Loos, 2 Div was in I Corps (a Corps is a grouping of divisions), and I Corps was in 1st Army (an Army is made up of a number of corps).

What may further confuse you is that 1st Berks is part of the Royal Berkshire Regiment, but so are some 6 other fighting infantry battalions, as well as reserve and labour and training battalions. The other infantry battalions were allocated to other divisions and may have served in different theatres. I suppose a naval analogy might be that there might be a dozen Type 42 frigates in the Navy (we should be so lucky!), but they don't all sail out of the same port, or when we had fleets spread around the globem they would not all have been posted to the same fleet, although essentially doing the same tasks.

[marsid]

If he was in 1st Berks, it does indeed mean 1st Battalion Royal Berkshire Regiment. There were indeed in 6th Infantry Brigade (at the start of the war, four battalions to a brigade) which was part of 2nd Division (3 Infantry brigades to the Division, plus pioneers, artillery, MG units, field ambulance and others).

On 13/12/15 1st Berks moved to 99th Infantry Brigade, and this brigade was also in 2nd Division at that time.

At the time of Loos, 2 Div was in I Corps (a Corps is a grouping of divisions), and I Corps was in 1st Army (an Army is made up of a number of corps).

What may further confuse you is that 1st Berks is part of the Royal Berkshire Regiment, but so are some 6 other fighting infantry battalions, as well as reserve and labour and training battalions. The other infantry battalions were allocated to other divisions and may have served in different theatres. I suppose a naval analogy might be that there might be a dozen Type 42 frigates in the Navy (we should be so lucky!), but they don't all sail out of the same port, or when we had fleets spread around the globem they would not all have been posted to the same fleet, although essentially doing the same tasks.

Thanks so much.

I am beginning to get the picture at last .Your anaolgy of the Type 42 s did the trick for me !! On my dads records it shows him being in the Militia from the age of 15 untill he enrolled in theregulars in 1902. Can you tell me what that was about ?

Thanks again

[marsid]

Hello Titchy

According to your father's MIC his service number was 7039 and not 3079:

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documen...p;resultcount=4

As a pre-war regular/reservist he was probably entitled to the 1914 Star but the MIC will confirm the date of entry. He obviously transferred to the Engineers but, unfortunately, there is no sign of his service papers in WO363 or 364 on Ancestry.

You can follow the daily War Diary of the 1st Battalion Royal Berks on the museum website here:

https://www.thewardrobe.org.uk/wardiary.php

Regards

Mel

Thanks Mel ,

You are right about my dads number ,just a slip of the (one)typing finger !!

He was awarde the 1914 Star ,Victory and British War medals according to the MIC. However , in his papers was an entry that showed him awarded these dated 23/7/42 . Any idea why this is dated so long after his WW1 service which ended in 1915 due to wounds in action ??

Thanks

[Robert Dunlop]

Titchy, good luck with the hunt. Just a quick note - try using the FASTREPLY button at the very bottom of the page, not the REPLY button. This will prevent the previous messages being quoted all the time

Robert

[Greenwoodman]

The Militia was originally a trained local part-time force for home defence, dissolved in 1813 and reformed in 1859. By 1881, they became part of the county regiment set-up, being numbered the 3rd Bn of the regiment. Each Regiment at that stage would have had Regular, Territorial, Militia and Volunteer Battalions.

After your father left to join the Regulars, in 1908, the Militia was renamed the Special Reserve.

[marsid]

Thanks Robert.Will do that in future !!

And thanks Greenwoodman for info on the Militia .

I think your date of 1908 as the day he left to join the regulars should be 1902.At least , that is the date on the Attestation form .

Titchy

[Greenwoodman]

Perhaps I should have typed "After your father left to join the Regulars in 1902, in 1908, the Militia was renamed the Special Reserve. "

[Muerrisch]

The transfer in 1908 was not as smooth as implied.

A Militia unit did not wake up next day as SR ...... all men were given the choice of enlisting in the SR or ending their service. A regiment with more than one Militia but due to have a single SR battalion in effect disbanded both Militias and formed the new SR battalion with those who wished to soldier on.

As as for the soldiers' individual Militia regimental numbers ...... some took them into the new unit, and some were given new numbers in the series starting with number 1. A recipe for a bugg*rs muddle.