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The Buffs Database is complete


Michael
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Mick and Jonathan

I hope the following is of interest:

Sgt. L. G. Betts served in A Squadron West Kent Yeomanry, he was posted to C Company 10th Buffs. He served in Gallipoli, Egypt and Palestine. He was awarded the the MM 11/17, Lt. RAF

Cpl. J. P Betts served in A Squadron West Kent Yeomanry; he was posted to C Company 10th Buffs. He served in Egypt, Palestine and France. He was wounded Jerusalem 12/17, awarded the the MM 12/17, killed Merville 8/18.

This information comes from the following:

West Kent (QO) Yeomanry and 10th Yeomanry Batt. The Buffs 1914 - 1919

Charles Ponsonby

Andrew Melrose Ltd., London 1920.

Regards

Steve

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Thanks Steve, I must save my pennies and get hold of a copy of Ponsonby.

Jon, Mags - I'm on a nice stretch of nightshifts at the moment so I'll look at the database when I return to the land of sunshine.

mick

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Steve - many thanks. My interest arises from my purchase last weekend of L.J. Betts copy of the Ponsonby history, annotated by him. But I appreciate your time and effort and the same.

Mick - will wait to see if you can add anything.

Regards,

Jonathan

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Mick

Belated congratulations on your achievement.

Could I ask you to see what you have on Sgt Harold Pearce MM, G/6494, 7th East Kents. Harold was a Tipton man (so why East Kents?) who enlisted fairly early in the war and must have been underage as he was only 19 when he died 30 Sept 1917.

His death was supposedly caused by a bomb dropped from an enemy aircraft "behind the firing line" - do you have access to the War Diaries of the 7th for that time? If so does it mention such an incident?

I have details of his MM and the 'obit' from the local newspaper, and will also be getting a decent photograph of him from his great-nephew in about a month's time. Do you want copies of these?

regards

Andy

EDIT A SHORT WHILE LATER..

I found the following from an old post from Steve Smith, this is presumably from a Bn. history, so I think that this answers the 'What happened' question.

On the 23rd Septmeber the Buffs moved by train to St Jan Ter Biezen, where five days afterwards, hostile aircraft dropped bombs into the camp, doing a very great deal of damage. The men were in huts and tents and the area a very congested one, which fact probably tempted the enemy to his enterprise. It was dark when the aeroplane flew over and it dropped six bombs (two of which were blind) right into the camp, resulting in the death of 2nd Lt R E C Mead and twenty six others. and the wounding of Lt and Quartermaster Rye, 2nd Lts Malton and Tyler and sixty three others. This misfortune had the effect of disorganizing the arrangement of platoons and sections just at a time when the regiment was being braced up and perfected in the new method of attack called 'Leap Frog'.

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Mick,

Heres another one of mine for your list:

Surname Hughes

Name Arthur Stanley

Number G/24501

Rank Private

Batt 10th

Reg Buffs (East Kent Regiment)

Dod 21/09/1918

Theater F&F

GWR position Shop Clerk

GWR Dept Loco/Carr

Enlisted Swindon, Wilts

How Kia

Born Charlton, Wilts

Cheers

Grant

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Mags, hopefully you got my reply to your private message

Grant, thanks. The details have been added to the db. It looks like he joined the Buffs in third quarter 1917.

Jon, the only info I can add is that Laurence James Betts was commissioned into the RAF on 17/6/1918. Pre 1917 number was 1440 and he won the MM as a Sergeant.

JP Betts' pre 1917 number was 2355 and his MM was won as a Private.

Andy, Pearce joined the Buffs in early/mid Sept 1914. His only service was with the 7th Battalion and he didn't go overseas before 1/1/1916. The war diary states that the air raid was on 29/9/1917 and that the dead were buried on 30/9/1917 at Nine Elms. Others were buried at Dozinghem and Mendinghem. I reckon the count was in the hgh 30's. I would be very grateful for the info you have offered.

Mick

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Jon, the only info I can add is that Laurence James Betts was commissioned into the RAF on 17/6/1918. Pre 1917 number was 1440 and he won the MM as a Sergeant.

JP Betts' pre 1917 number was 2355 and his MM was won as a Private.

Hi Mick - thanks for the commission date. Will have to try and locate his papers - possibly Hendon. Also I didnt have 4-digit number so thanks for that.

I have a nice little story written by Laurence about JP Betts winning his MM:

My brother Jack Betts was on the right of our line, with a Lewis gun, and was the only one who could return the fire. He continued firing ater having two bullets through the top part of his head, through the scalp. For this, he was awarded the M.M. and probably saved many of our lives through his firing. LJB

Regards,

Jonathan S

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Mick

Thanks for the info re Harold Pearce. If you would PM me your EMail address I'll send you the notes I've put together for his great-nephew, and I'll send you a copy of his photo as soon as I get it - mid Feb probably.

regards

Andy

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Hello Mick,

Would you mind looking up the following soldier for me? His name was Alfred Wyborn and he held the rank of Lance Corporal as of Christmas of 1914. He seems to have been wounded as in his photo, he's standing with the aid of a cane. Also, he seems to have been a member of the Military Foot Police as he has a band with the initials MFP around his lower right sleeve. Many thanks in advance for the help.

John

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Jon, thanks for the info. It's always nice to get info on MM awards. His papers should be in AIR at Kew

John, I can't find an Alfred Wyborn. Are you sure he went overseas?

Andy, PM on its way

Mick

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Hi Mick,

I don't know if he went overseas or not. I don't have a service number for him and like I said, he seems to have been wounded as he has a cane. I was told that he was in the Buffs,maybe he wasn't?

John

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John

I've just seen the other thread with the photo. It certainly looks like a Buffs badge but I'm no uniform expert. I'll keep my eyes open when I'm browsing the pre war Regimental Journals.

Mick

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Mick,

Firstly well done for completing such a project.

A possible suggestion would be to make it available on a disc with a nominal cost (£5). I know you wont stop cheapskates from copying it but it might give you a life away from the forum! Another outlet could be family history fairs; stalls are full of cencus cds; perhaps you could hawk it round your local family history group and sell them a bulk order.

Hope this email does'nt breach forum rules.

Well done again

Steve Binks

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Mick,

I have now published my Sturry website. I'm still waiting for my domain name to come through but it can be accessed here http://web.mac.com/ivhgarnett . Thanks for all your help on this and I guess there may be more you can offer.

Is there anywhere else on the Forum that I can publicise this?

John

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Is there anywhere else on the Forum that I can publicise this?

Not sure, you'd be better off speaking to Chris.

That's a nice looking website and a fitting tribute to the men of Sturry. Good job

Mick

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Mick

2nd.Lt. later Captain Walter Goode. commissioned into the Buffs 10.01.1916. 4th Battalion. Later served in india 1917 onwards in India. Any chance of a look-up please.

murland@clara.co.uk

Cheers Jerry

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Jerry

As he transfered to the Indian Army he does not appear in the Buffs medal rolls. He doesn't appear in the Regimental History or the war diary so the only refernce I have for him is the Army List as follows

First appears in Army List in April 1916 (2nd Lieut 4th Bn comm 10 Jan 1916). Then attached to the Herts Regt in Sept 1916 until May 1917 then Buffs again until my last list of May 1918 (still as 2nd Lieut 4th Bn).

Mick

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Hope two questions are in order.

The first concerns SR/531 Corporal Alfred Elliott. He reenlisted (formerly 4232 with service in India and South Africa with the 1st and 2nd Btns) in september 1914, but was discharged as medically unfit from the 8th battalion in november 1914. I know this means he has no medal entitlement, but would there be a record of a Silver War Badge issued?

The second is a group to 4475 and later 241850 to F C Bartlett, BWM and VM, IGS clasp afghanistan. 1/5th Buffs, but unsure of what battalion he served with in WWI?

Many thanks,

Lars

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Lars

Early discharges through sickness, etc would normally appear on the SWB rolls but Elliott is not in there. The SWB had to be applied for so maybe he didn't bother. I've traced him in the QSA roll. He was entitled to the QSA only with bars "South Africa 1902" and "Transvaal". It also notes that he was transferred to Army Reserve. I estimate his enlistment in the Buffs to be in the 4th quarter of 1893. He was also on the India Medal roll and was entitled to the clasps "Punjab Frontier 1897-98" and "Relief of Chitral 1895". His WW1 service number for the Special Reserve indicates an enlistment date of mid Sept 1914 (the 14th to 17th).

Bartlett served with only the 5th Buffs during WW1. The closest I can get to an enlistment date are 4415 and 4418 who enlisted on 1/3/1916. The 5th Battalion did not go to Afghanistan as a unit but there were some men out there who were attached to other units. He doesn't appear in the Buffs roll for the medal but that isn't unusual.

Hope this helps

Mick

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Mick,

Thank you, the information is a great help. I am now certain I have Elliotts full entitlement, the two medals you have quoted. For your information he attested on 19th june 1893 the first time. In WWI his esxact date was 15th september 1914. Hope this is of use to you, in case you are interested in anything else I have copies of his papers and can scan if you like.

Thanks also for the enlistment date on Bartlett and confirming my rather loose assumption that he was 1/5th in WWI. I hope to get confirmation on what btn he served with in Afghanistan, and will send you the details if you like.

For your information I until recently held the IGS with Relief of Chitral & punjab 97-98 clasps to pte 3833 Frederick Ellicock, also 1st battalion. I believe that this was his full entitlement, no records of WWI service has been found. I have just been able to reunite his medal with his brothers group, he was RSM in the 15th hussars, commissioned in WWI and earning a MSM and Croix de Guerre.

Kind regards,

Lars

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Hi,

Do you have my Great-Great Uncle listed?

He was Robert James Harris Pte G/10688 3rd Bn., Queen's Own (Royal West Kent Regiment) attd. 22nd Coy. , Machine Gun Corps (Infantry).

He died on 27th august 1916 aged 19.

There is a little excerpt about him in the Deal Roll of Honours book. It reads:-

"When going into action for the first time, Private Robert James Harris, fourth son of Mr. and Mrs. William Harris, 4, Alfred Square, Deal, was killed by a shell near a wood famous in the Battle of the Somme. He enlisted on 1st November 1915, in the Royal West Kent Regiment, and was attached to a Machine Gun Company, going to the front on 16th July 1916. He was engaged as spare man in the dangerous work of bringing up ammunition, when the fatal shell burst. No news being received of him after 24th August, steps were taken to communicate with his unit, and his officer then wrote, conveying the news of his death, paying the tribute that he "behaved very well in action, and was a brave man." Pte. Harris who was 19 years of age attended the Central Schools."

If you have any other information on Robert I would love to receive it.

My e-mail is: mazzie@tiscali.co.uk

Thanks,

Darin.

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