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The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

Commissioned From The Ranks in WW1


PhilB

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My late uncle and godfather Paul Carter, born and brought up at Thorpe in the Ryburn Valley near Sowerby Bridge, W.R. Yorks, attested at Chelsea Town Hall on 9th Feb 1916 . He was a student at St. John's College, Battersea training to become a teacher. He was not called up until 15th August 1916 by which time he had successfully completed his course. He joined the 3rd Reserve Battalion West Yorkshire Regiment based in Halifax, was promoted to unpaid lance corporal on 9th Dec. 1916 and to paid L/cpl. on 12th March 1917. On 6th March 1917 he had applied for a commission with a preference for artillery.He joined the RGA Artillery School at Maresfield Park on 25th May 1917 and on 11th November joined 194 Siege Battery "in the field.

Paul's father was a part-time gardener and nightwatchman. I have some sixty letters which Paul wrote home between November 1917 and his demob ion 25th November 1920. ( He had volunteered to serve with the Army of Occupation). In none of the letters does he ever indicate that he had any social or any other problems . However he did serve late in and after the war, was in the R.A. and not a 'prestigious' regiment, and he was a very self-confident person.

Peter

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Reformbill, you might get a few verbal shells lobbed your way by irate artillerymen for that. Your tale just goes to show that it was a lottery but late on in the war, so many junior officers had been killed that the army could not afford to let snobbery hamper the potential of a good officer, no matter what his background was.

What this also illustrates is how strong the prewar class system was, especially in the officers' mess. Perfectly capable men with good leadership qualities wouldn't have had a cat in hells' chance of gettting a commission. I also think that many such men would not have dreamed of applying for one either.

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Charles Lowe, Professional County Cricketer (Derbyshire) C.S.M. in 1915, 8th Lincolns, wounded at Loos, commissioned September 1917, evidently did his Officer training at Trinity College, Cambridge ( Local Paper report), rejoined his old Battalion 8th Lincolns in France, October 1917.

Cliff.

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T E Lawrence, in 'The Mint' mentions that several ex-officers WW1 vintage, had enlisted as Airmen and were in his (flight?) on training - in with the Hoxton types. They were unable to find suitable employment (or employment of any type) during the depression.

Edwin

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My Grandfather worked (laboured??) on his father's small (90 acres ish), tenant farm in Wensleydale. He had left school at age 14 after spending last 2 years as a pupil teacher. He joined up in August 1914 at age 20 and spent from April 1917 to August 1917 at no 2 RGA Cadet School, Maresfield Park.

He certainly came from humble beginnings, but from what I know of him he must have had something that made him suitable officer material - he became Area surveyor for North Yorks (very proud of the fact that N Yorks was first county to have a dual carriageway A1 all way through it, also of his team being able to tarmac Sutton Bank when it was thought impossible and of dual carriagewaying A64 from Spitalbeck to Kirkham (still the same now!) and he went to Germany to see how the autobahns were built). Also a county councillor.

Sorry if this sounds like boasting but I am trying to say that perhaps the "ordinary man" could make a good officer?? Maybe, even in desperation in 1917 they found some "good stuff"

Sounds rather similar to Peter (reformbill)'s uncle.

Incidentally, Peter, I have 4 group photos of cadets at Maresfield Park - one is dated 31st May 1917 - I wonder if your uncle is on any of them??

PM me with your e-mail address if you would like copies!!

Phil

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"My late uncle and godfather Paul Carter, .He joined the RGA Artillery School at Maresfield Park on 25th May 1917 and on 11th November joined 194 Siege Battery in the field.

Peter"

Peter,

Have uploaded 4 photos of cadets at Maresfield taken between April and August 1917 to

http://s33.photobucket.com/albums/d73/PhilRW/Maresfield/

Have a look to see if your uncle is there.

If you would like higher definition copies please PM me

PhilW

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My father, whose service has been discussed at some length, was the 13th of 14 children, his father a Suffolk farmer.

I think he was one of the few siblings with some academic ability, none of the others (AFAIK) had a college education, nor did they go into a 'profession'.

(I know nothing of their war service)

Father attended St Lukes College, Exeter, until 1913, and was a newly-qualified teacher when he enlisted as a Pvt in the Suffolk Regt in '14.

His intelligence, leadership qualities, and a willingness to take risks probably contributed to his promotion to Sgt, then being commissioned and becoming a tank commander at Flers.

He subsequently spent most of his working life in the teaching profession.... which would probably have been his destiny, anyway!

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  • 1 month later...

My grandfather enlisted as a private in the ASC in 1915. he was posted there because he could drive, and because he could speak french. He was in the East African Force in Voi, and was promoted to 2nd Lt in Sept 1916 and was posted to Kilwa to run the stores section of an RNAS base. He was from a wealthy background, and had been an Art student in Brussels prior to the war. I get the impression that he got on with well with people either commissioned or non commissioned, as I have his cartoon sketch books which show people he served with. He was finally promoted to Lt and ended the war in Edinburgh commanding an ASC reserve section due to ill health/malaria. He apparently at some stage saved General Smuts from a river, but I'm not sure whether this had anything to do with his commission.

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My maternal grandfather Capitan Frederick Veltom was commissioned from the ranks. He was a Sergeant previous to that. He was 34 on the outbreak of the War and served in some capacity in the supply lines. I don't know exactly what role he had in civilian life but I believe he was in some kind of managerial position. As far as I know he didn’t serve in the front lines though.

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I have had a look and see no mention of William Linton Andrews or Joe Lee who were journalists when they enlisted in 4 BW ( TF) both commissioned. I notice some discussion of snobbery in pre war mess. This is undoubtedly true and of course, carried on into the war for a year or two. Graves mentions it. One thing that might be borne in mind is this, in the more prestigious regiments an officer's salary did not suffice to cover his living expenses. An independent income was required to maintain the expected standards. The Indian Army was one place where a man of modest means could maintain himself. Sir John French who came from a modest background, financially speaking, originally joined the Royal Navy because of this. The Navy was open to men of modest means but we have to be careful when we say that. We are talking of middle class rather than upper middle or aristocracy. A working class soldier who could progress through the ranks and obtain a commission, was a rarity. Wullie Robertson being more or less unique in attaining the Rank of Field Marshal. As well known, during the war, the wastage in subalterns in particular, meant that the army was forced to accept soldiers from the ranks for commissioning.

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Maybe the army was happy to see a system in which one needed private income to be able to hold a commission, in the same way that MPs weren`t paid? It makes little sense to us in the modern day, but perhaps there were factors that recommended it to Victorian army minds?

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  • 2 weeks later...

I have been researching my grandfather, EJ Howells, who at 33 was commissioned into the Infantry upon enlistment in 1914. He had been an engineer before the war working at the patent office in Melbourne. Numerous photos given by him to the Australian War Memorial in 1925 also showed a chap named Claydon, who I think, had the camera and also donated photos to AWM.

E S Claydon had prior service with "33d fort. Coy., A.E." (Australian Engineers?) and is listed as a 20 year old electrical engineer on his embarkation roll 1915 - yet was first with the 1st Light Horse, became Sgt then a Signal Sgt. He joined with my grandfather's newly formed First Field Sqdn. AE in Egypt 1917. , and I have the documents signed by my grandfather recommending him for a field commission - which was approved. He and my grandfather served together all the way to Damacus and even as tourists in Luxor while waiting for return to Australia in 1919.

I found a question from Claydon's grandson in an old post about an Albatross shot down by Aussies on this site - but the email address he gave was outdated. It would be nice to know if the old war chums stayed friends after the war.

Hard to say if Claydon was college type. His father was in the clergy and my grandfather notes Claydon's "knowledge of Arabic" and "especially qualified in electrical work".

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I`m not familiar with Australian commissioning procedures in WW1. We`re told that they generally commissioned after service in the ranks but presumably a large number would have been needed initially for 1914 commissions. I`m not sure your man would quite qualify as a typical ranker if he was recommended by his grandad (not something available to most British rankers!) but. once things settled down, I assume the Australian ranker was not much different in background to his British counterpart?

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Sorry Phil;

Craydon was not commissioned by HIS grandfather, but recommended by MY grandfather, who was his CO at the time.

In 1914, my grandfather was 33 years old, and the enlisted chap, Claydon, was 20 - both engineers. Even though the younger man had prior service, the older man was given a commission right out of the gate. The younger man came thru the ranks to Staff Sgt. and was commissioned at age 23 or 24 in Egypt.

While the "class" issue may be assumed far less down under than in England at that time, I would like to know if the other comments about field commissioned persons having problems upon return to their previous "working class" status, applys there too.

- Rod

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Sorry, Rod - I read that bit wrong! Interesting point you raise (If I`ve got it right!) - did Aussie rankers suffer more than British rankers on return to Civvy Street?

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2nd LT WHO Hill , commissioned from the Coldstream Guards was a lawyer prior to joining

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A couple of examples from the 1st South Staffords.

William Cooper, a former tin plate worker from Heath Town (Wolverhampton) and a splendid NCO with eighteen years service, had been appointed Regimental Sergeant Major on 8 November 1914. His reward for being central to the rebuilding of the battalion after the appalling losses at Ypres was a commission in the field. He was killed leading his Company into action at Loos on 25 September 1915.

Percival Emberton enlisted as a ranker in the 6th Battalion of the Black Watch at the age of 24 on 28 March 1913, up to which time he was employed as a civil servant with the Irish Land Commission. He arrived in France with his battalion on 2 May 1915 and soon saw action at Festubert. He was commissioned in the field on 14 June 1916 and joined the 1st South Staffords on that day, having had more than a year’s exposure to trench warfare. He was killed in the attack on Mametz on 1 July 1916.

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There is a wonderful variety of "previous" in these examples. The private life of an officers` mess in 1917/18 must have been a fascinating place and one not well covered in the literature?

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  • 1 month later...

I found some info on this subject in Official Histories – First World War

Volume VII – The Australian Imperial Force in Sinai and Palestine, 1914–1918 (10th edition, 1941) Pages 532-535

H S Gullett

http://www.awm.gov.au/histories/chapter.asp?volume=8

It contrasts the relationship between ranks - Aussie vs. Brit, and the commissioning route in the Light Horse in the Sinai era.

- Rod

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I have a feeling I've been here before but perhaps I'm wrong. Obviously, the criteria for a commission in peacetime not only in the "quality" regiments but also in those that tend to recruit from the 'professional classes' was very different as the war progressed. The very high attrition rates meant that regiments were not only forced to recruit from the ranks and in so doing had to "lower their usual recruiting standards" but had to identify quite different qualities that were needed to qualify someone for officer status.

Those they chose tended to be non commissioned officers who had proved themselves in battle and the ability to handle a knife and fork properly was relegated to a lesser significance. In other words, I'm not at all sure that one's former occupation was that significant.

Kind regards,

Harry

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2nd LT WHO Hill , commissioned from the Coldstream Guards was a lawyer prior to joining

seems its says SAWYER not lawyer!

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  • 8 months later...
Roger Deeks are you out there? If not, I'll contact him. He's just written a dissertation for his MA on the subject of men commissioned from the ranks.

Chris, took me a year to read this. Sorry to have missed you at the Balkans day. Looks like I won't make the reunion either. If I can give up the day job I will write the book that needs to be written about commissioned rankers. Hope you are well,

Roger

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