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The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

MID Oakleaf


paulowen
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I think I'm one of the lucky ones in that I've have two sets of WW1 medals from two of my great grandfathers. (An Artillery pair and 1914-15 trio Manchester Regiment). The other two seemed to escape the call to arms for various reasons!

The Manchesters one was MID'd in Gallipoli but when his medals came to me when I was about 12 there was no oakleaf. The ribbons were all on the wrong medals (it was a while before I realised why the victory ribbon was too big for the BWM ) and while they were quite tatty there is no sign of an oakleaf ever being stiched to the ribbon. Thers's no doubt that he was mentioned as I have the certificate, a contemporary magazine article, an entry in the Gazette and family stories of the event and a gun-carriage funeral. ( He died in the early 1920s)

BUT his MIC doesn't show any sign of the oakleaf being issued. It shows SWB (I was never given this) but not the EMB note for an oakleaf being issued.

I don't think he ever received his oakleaf. I bought a replacement a while ago and stitched it to a replacement ribbon (orignals still retained!) as shown in the pic.

My questions are;-

Does anyone else know of MID emblems not being issued?

Is my replacement oakleaf the correct one?

post-10653-1193517699.jpg

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The MiD emblem wasnt instituted until well after the end of the War so it is possible it might have been omitted when they were delivered.

It should have its own MiC {usually listed by Initials & surname only rather than full name,so easier to search the online NA files by using Surname,Number & Regt only}

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If you have his medal index card, can you post the codes & pages numbers from it, as I can check the medal rolls & SWB rolls.

I've been trying to resize the National Archive pdf file without success! So I'll just type it..

Pte A MacDonald 2385 Manchester Reg

BWM & Vic 71(?)/1/104/48 Page 9686

14/15 H(?)/1/41/B Page 52

SWB List TH/129 (or 120?)

Theatre of war 2B

date of entry 5/5/15

-it's not terribly legible.

Anything you can tell me would be welcome

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Paul,

It is by no means unusual to find no reference to the award of a Mention either on the Medal Index Card, nor on the dedicated 3 series of microfiches at the National Archives for MIDs either. I have the medals to a man that has the oakleaves on the Victory, and his service papers confirm the issue of the award, but it is not recorded anywhere else: MIC, MID series or London Gazette. I think that the later the award, the less chance there is of finding reference to it.

Regards

Steve

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oak leaf, larger size, to be at angle of sixty degrees from inside edge of ribbon when ribbon on medal, stem to right.

smaller size, transversely on ribbon alone, stem to right.

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Enlistment date 1st Sept 1914.

Discharge date 15th Aug 1916.

SWB No 58889.

Cause of discharge Wound's

He was in the 6th Battalion Manchester Regt.

The MID is not in any of his rolls:

1914 Star Roll.

BWM & VM Roll.

SWB Roll.

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Enlistment date 1st Sept 1914.

Discharge date 15th Aug 1916.

SWB No 58889.

Cause of discharge Wound's

He was in the 6th Battalion Manchester Regt.

The MID is not in any of his rolls:

1914 Star Roll.

BWM & VM Roll.

SWB Roll.

Thanks for that (and to everyone else who responded)

There's a lot there that I didn't know. There's a picture shown in quite a few books (very blurred ) which shows the 6th going into action on the Friday 4th June 1915 when he was injured (and spent the rest of the weekend lying in no mans land). Maybe he's in that picture.

The annoying thing is that his pension records can't be found on Ancestry.co.uk. I've tried the obvious Mac/Mc permutations without luck.

Neither can I find another uncle who lost an arm. Assuming he had both arms when he joined then surely he deserved a pension! There's less detail here as I don't have the medals and my nana doesn't know what regiment other than that it involved horses (hopes of a crack cavalry regiment !) . The MIC s show two with the same name ,both with SWB awarded. One Royal Fusiliers and the other ASC. So I reckon the latter one. But neither show up in ancestry.

What are the chances that the records are there but just incorrectly catalogued or that they were not transferred (sold!) to Ancestry - or even worse bombed by the Jeermans.?

Now to spend the next 5 years trying to find that SWB on ebay!

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You also need to look at PIN 26 & PIN 82 at the NA Kew both are for pensions from WW1. And have you look in WO363 Service records.

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You also need to look at PIN 26 & PIN 82 at the NA Kew both are for pensions from WW1. And have you look in WO363 Service records.

Hi Monster !

Again thanks for your replies and sorry for not adding anything sooner.

These NA records; I'm a bit naive in these respects and I'm not sure how to go about looking at these records. I'd always intended to go to Kew the next time I was in the Smoke but wasn't sure how to go about it.

They're not online ,are they? I really need to go there ,don't I ?

Are there any threads/links on what you actually do when you get there? Do you need to book ahead, take a camera, etc. I can't say how disappointed when Ancestery didn't have the records online.

Just about about to start a thread on P14 gear. Bored of 08now!

thanks again

Paul

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themonstar,

Thanks for the heads up about PIN 82 - I hadn't come across this before. No 'hits' so far, but interesting nonetheless.

Steve

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