Titanic survivors killed on the Western Front

[Hedley Malloch]

Now here's a real teaser I have been asked and I have no idea as to the answer.

Was there anyone who survived the Titanic disaster only to perish a few years later on the Western Front? If so, where are they buried or commemorated? They could be British, Irish, Canadian, US, German, French, or whatever.

The laws of probability suggest that there must have been some. But who?

[Guest Hill 60]

Hedley - I had a quick look on www.encyclopedia-titanic.org but couldn't find anyone identified as dying in WWI.

I did find the following of interest:

1. (Crew) Second Officer Charles Herbert Lightoller. He served in WWI and was involved in ramming a U-Boat and downing a Zeppelin with his ship's machine-guns. He was awarded the DSC + Bar.

He later sailed his boat 'Sundowner' to Dunkirk for the evacuation in WWII.

2. (Crew) Able Bodied Seaman William Chapman Peters. Later served on, and survived the sinking of, the Lusitania.

3. (Passanger) Bernard McCoy. Served in the US Army from 3 April 1918 until 12 June 1919. Army # 1747065.

4. (Passanger) Jean Scheerlinckx from (?) Haaltert, Belgium. Served in the Belgian Army from 1914 to 1918.

5. (Passanger) Julius Sap, born at Rek near to Zwevezele in Belgium. Served in the Belgian Army from 1914 to 1918. Titanic Baording Ticket: 345768, paid £9.10s.

Not quite what you wanted but I suspect if you search through and cross reference everthing there might be survivors who weren't so lucky in WWI.

[ianw]

Extraordinary that someone had the misfortune to be on the Lusitania's fateful voyage as well - although I suppose Big Ship crew members are not that big a group of men.

Was one of the survivors of the epic 1914 Shackleton expedition also killed on the Western Front ?

[Myrtle]

Of the fifty-three men who survived the Shakleton Expedition three were killed in WW1 and five were wounded.

McCarthy "was killed at his gun in the channel."

Cheetham was drowned when the vessel he was serving in was torpedoed.

Ernest Wild, was killed while mine sweeping in the Mediterranean.

Mauger was badly wounded while serving with the NZ Inf.

McIlroy a surgeon was badly wounded at Ypres.

Frank Wild was sent to the North Russian Front because of his experience of icey conditions.

Macklin served with the Yorks and then became a Medical Officer with the Tanks. He won the MC

James joined the Royal Engineers, Sound -Ranging section.

Wordie went to France with RFA and was badly wounded at Armentieres.

Hussey was with RGA and in France for 18 months.

Worsley was given DSO for destroying three German subs. and then was sent to Archangel.

Stenhouse was Worsley's second in command and received the DSC.

Clark served on a mine-sweeper.

Greenstreet was employed with the barges on the Tigris.

Rickenson was an Engineer-Lieutenant

Kerr returned to the Merchant Service as an engineer.

Hooke, a wireles operator navigated an airship.

Shackleton was commissioned as Major and went to North Rusia in charge of Artic Equipment and Transport.

Nearly all the crew of tHe Aurora joined the "New Zealand Field Forces."

[Jonathan Saunders]

I didnt see Violet Jessop mentioned above. She served on the Olympic and Titanic as a stewardess and then was aboard the Brittanic as a nurse when it struck a mine in the Aegean. I am sure she was the only person to serve all three sister ships (and survive two disasters whilst she was at it).

[Guest Hill 60]

Stewardess Violet Constance Jessop was on-board the Olympic when it collided with HMS Hawke in 1911.

When the Brittanic was sunk she claimed that he aubern hair helped her being spotted and rescued. She also said of sinking of the Brittanic:

''I leapt into the water but was sucked under the ship's keel which struck my head. I escaped, but years later when I went to my doctor because of a lot of headaches, he discovered I had once sustained a fracture of the skull!''

[Guest Hill 60]

Some more I've found:

1. (Crew) Kitchen Porter, Reginald Hardwick. Died 'at home' 4th March 1918 whilst serving as a Private in the Army Service Corps.

2. (Crew) Lookout, Archibald Jewell. Was serving on SS Donegal, a Hospital Ship operating in the English Channel, when it was sunk by a U-Boat on 17th April 1917. He did not survive and is commemorated on the Tower Hill Memorial in London.

3. (Crew) Fireman, Arthur John Priest. Was also on SS Donegal when it was sunk. Had also served on the Olympic when it hit HMS Hawke, the Brittanic when it sunk in 1916. His other ship, Alcantara was also sunk!

4. (Passanger) Richard Norris Williams II. Served with distinction in the US Army in WWI, won the Chevalier de la Legion and the Croix de Guerre.

[Andrew P]

Sorry to add another group, but how about the Canadian Arctic Expedition which was led by Canadian Vilhjalmur Stefansson?

From what I know of them, I believe they were exploring in the Arctic starting in 1913 and it wasn't till 1916 that they heard that there was a war on.

One member of this expedition, Hubert Wilkins, came back to Australia and enlisted in the Australian Flying Corps, though he soon became(along with Shackleton member Frank Hurley) an official photographer for the AIF.

Does anyone know if the other members of the Canadian Arctic Expedition served in the war?

Cheers

Andrew

[Myrtle]

I thought that this may be of interest.

The Hawke was already known to many, as the vessel that had collided with the Olympic in 1911, the latter being the Titanic's sister ship and the largest ship in the world. At the time of that major collision with the Hawke, the Olympic's Captain was Edward John Smith who was the captain of the Titanic when it sank in 1912. Repairs on the Olympic delayed the fitting out of the Titanic due to the necessary diversion of workers and materials at the shipbuilders Harland and Wolff. This resulted in the Titanic's maiden voyage being delayed by a month.

Myrtle

[Hedley Malloch]

Many thanks to all who contributed.

[Waggoner]

In response to this thread, I would like to state that all of the gentlemen

mentioned in the above posts survived the War except for Archie Jewell. As

was correctly pointed out, he was lost when the Donegal met her end in 1917.

The Reginald Hardwick mentioned as having died in 1918 has not been

satisfactorily linked to the man of the same name who was a survivor of the

Titanic, so I am not sure if he counts.

The only Titanic survivor that fits the criteria is an Irish passenger named

Daniel Buckley who stayed in America after the Titanic disaster, joined the

US Army and was shot and killed in October 1918, in the final weeks of the

War. I have always thought this a tremendous shame.

Several of Titanics' men and women went on to serve in the Merchant

Service as well as the Allied Forces. I would very much like to hear from

anyone who has information or is related to a passenger or crewman

from the Titanic or Lusitania.

Best Regards to All,

Brian

[Desmond7]

Ahoghill couple die on Lusitania

MR. and Mrs. Thomas Agnew were homeward bound on the Lusitania when she was torpedoed by a German submarine.

Mr. and Mrs. Agnew were resident in Monnessen, Pennsylvania, four years and were returning to Ballylummin, Ahoghill. Tom Agnew, carpenter, was son of the late John Agnew, farmer, Ballylummin, who died in September last year.

Walter Agnew, another brother, who has been a motor inspector in the States, and returned to this country six months ago to manage the farm, received a wire from the Cunard Company, stating that the bodies of Mr. and Mrs. Agnew had not been recovered.

Ballymena Observer May 21, 1915

and a pic is on file

[brindlerp]

I am researching family genealogy (Birmingham, UK family) where a maternal great uncle served with the Australian Imperial Force in WW1, a younger brother of his was lost at sea on R.M.S. Titanic (15 April 1912), and another younger brother of his was lost in WW1.

I am trying to prove/find evidence of events/addresses to confirm what has been stated by family members and where they served and were lost.

1.) Alexander WOOD (born 1878)

The hardest one to research has proved to be the easiest so far thanks to the Australian War Memorial website (thanks to a link on this website).

SERN: 173, Lance Corporal, AIF 1st Remounts, Date enlisted: 10/09/1915, Returned to Australia 24/06/1916 from Egypt.

My Mother remembers Alec, he emigrated to Australia before WW1 and after the war returned with his family from Australia to settle back in Birmingham.

2.) Henry WOOD (born 1882)

We believe Henry is the H. WOOD listed as a Trimmer in the Engine Crew lost at sea on the R.M.S. Titanic 15 April 1912 (PRO Ref: BT100/259). The 'Mansion House Titanic Relief Fund booklet, March 1913' lists a pension 'Class "G" Ref No:- C263, May WOOD'. The relationship with H. WOOD is listed as "Sister". My Mother remembers Aunt May. I need to establish Aunt May's address at the time.

3.) William WOOD (born 1894)

Aunt May's son has William's Memorial plaque, but no other information. No details of service number or regiment. We believe William is 4759 Private William WOOD, 1st/6th Battalion Royal Warwickshire Regiment, who died on 01 July 1916, remembered on the Thiepval Memorial. SDGW has 4759 Private William WOOD Enlisted: Birmingham, Residence: Saltley, Birmingham. I need to establish his actual home address, which would probably be the same as Aunt May's.

There sister, Lillian WOOD (1887 - 1970), my maternal Grandmother, married Walter BARNETT (1880 - 1980) in 1911. He was 6323 Private Walter BARNETT of the 1st/2nd/3rd/4th Battalions Royal Warwickshire Regiment from 05/10/1898 to 24/11/1906 and 05/08/1914 to 04/10/1915. Prior to enlisting he was in the Militia but no further details have yet been found. He was in the Mounted Infantry in the Boer War and served in Malta, India, Belgium and France as well as South Africa. I remember as a child my Grandfather saying he was in military manoeuvres with 90,000 others on Salisbury Plain when news of Kitchener's victory at Omdurman (September 1898) was announced. My Grandfather must have been in the Militia at the time, but we have no record of it.

There is much to research!

Regards

Richard

[ypresman]

Hi

But did any of the people actually survive the Flu epedemic of 1918/19/20?, as I heard( on good authority) that a 'person' survived the Titanic, The Great War, then succumbed to the flu virus in 1919, anyone heard of it?

[Guest Pete Wood]

Today marks the anniversary of when Titanic departed Queenstown, bound for New York.

[Guest Pete Wood]

Exactly 92 years ago, the Titanic struck an iceberg and began to sink. The radio operators used the new, international distress call:

S.O.S. ... --- ...

[brindlerp]

Two sugars please........

[brindlerp]

Interesting R.M.S. Titanic sites:

http://www.titanic-titanic.com

http://www.encyclopedia-titanica.org/

[brindlerp]

Locatation of sinking.

[brindlerp]

More pictures.

[Greyhound]

Reviving this ancient thread since I don't see a mention of this man, who was an AB on the Titanic.

Name: BULEY, EDWARD JOHN

Initials: E J

Nationality: United Kingdom

Rank: Able Seaman

Regiment/Service: Royal Navy

Unit Text: (RFR/PO/B/5041). H.M.S. "Partridge."

Age: 32

Date of Death: 12/12/1917

Service No: 213566

Additional information: Son of the late John Buley, of Southampton.

Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead

Grave/Memorial Reference: 24.

Memorial: PORTSMOUTH NAVAL MEMORIAL

The OP did specify Western Front, but the replies seem to have strayed a bit geographically. I just happened to notice Edward while looking up something else, as you do. Wonder if there are any more.

[Mark Hone]

At the WFA AGM at the Merseyside Maritime Museum a couple of years ago, the featured talk was on the Lusitania. The lecturer referred to a persistent legend that a crewman from Liverpool survived the 'Titanic', 'Empress of Ireland' (in the St Lawrence seaway) and 'Lusitania' sinkings , three of the greatest British maritime disasters, in a four year period. Unfortunately this has not been possible to verify, largely because for tax and other reasons sailors served under a variety of names, and sometimes assumed each other's identities.

The Empress of Ireland is now largely forgotten, but in fact more passengers died on her than the Titanic or Lusitania. Taken together these sinkings were a body blow for Liverpool, which provided a large proportion of the crewmen for all three.

[Marnik]

Hedley - I had a quick look on www.encyclopedia-titanic.org but couldn't find anyone identified as dying in WWI.

I did find the following of interest:

4. (Passanger) Jean Scheerlinckx from (?) Haaltert, Belgium. Served in the Belgian Army from 1914 to 1918.

5. (Passanger) Julius Sap, born at Rek near to Zwevezele in Belgium. Served in the Belgian Army from 1914 to 1918. Titanic Baording Ticket: 345768, paid £9.10s.

Not quite what you wanted but I suspect if you search through and cross reference everthing there might be survivors who weren't so lucky in WWI.

Titanic survivors 1912.

Jules Sap on the left side & Jean Scheerlinckx on the right side.

[MACRAE]

Did the Captain Rostrum of the California not distinguish him self during the evacuation at Dunkirk I am sure that I read this some place , I think he died a few years later.

Dan

[Gibbo]

Dan, Arthur Rostron was captain of the Carpathia, not the California. He died in Nov 1940 at the age of 71 & I can't find any mention of him being at Dunkirk. Possibly you're thinking of Charles Herbert Lightoller, the senior surviving officer of the Titanic who, as mentioned in posting no. 2 of this thread by Hill 60, took his small yacht, Sundowner, to Dunkirk.