c.company 17th west yorkshire regiment

[legendsdiner]

this is the first time i have done anything like this so i hope i get it right...

i am trying to find out what i can about my great grandfather..according to my great grandmothers death certificate(sadley she was only 20 when she died) my g.grandfather occupation was said to be..

colliery (unreadable)private 1069 c.company 17th west yorkshire regiment..i have tried to find out what this means but do not seem to get any where can any one help ..

i also wondered would he be dismissed from the army as he had a small son .

although i was very close to my grandfather i am ashamed to say i never knew about his mother dying when he was so young...i feel i need to know what happenned to michael morley so i can understand why we were never told..

thankyou

susan

[Coldstreamer]

welcome

cant see any one of these name and regiment on the MIC

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documen...mp;mediaarray=*

could be in the engineers as he was a colliery worker but doent always work like that

[mmm45]

Hi susan

Welcome to the forum.

What is the date of the death certificate and could Micheal Morley have been known by any other name?

A Regiment (17th West Yorkshires) was divided into Companies A,B,C and so on basically groups of men they would split down even further into Platoons and sections

His number 1069 was issued when he joined up and im sure a West Yorkshire Regiment expert will be able to point you in right direction.

If you click on the Long long trail link there is lots of info on how to trace your relatives military history.

Do you know if Micheal Morley actually went overseas during the Great War?

Good luck

Ady

[Stebie9173]

The 15th and 17th Battalions of the West Yorkshire Regiment were the 1st and 2nd Leeds Pals, respectively.

Although the following website is devoted to the 1st Leeds Pals (15th Battalion) the two battalions merged in 1917, so it may be worth contacting the author to see if his research has encountered Michael Morley.

http://www.leedspals.co.uk/

Also see:

http://www.1914-1918.net/westyorks.htm

Steve.

[legendsdiner]

welcome

cant see any one of these name and regiment on the MIC

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documen...mp;mediaarray=*

could be in the engineers as he was a colliery worker but doent always work like that

[legendsdiner]

regarding michael morley

all the documents i have say that this is correct name although i cant not find him on a census he was born 1892 but as yet i dont know were...he was married in 1911 in birstall west yorkshire to polly ambrose

polly died in 1915 and on her certificate it says that michael was in c.company west yorkshire regiment...because of pollys death i didnot know if he would have stayed in the army i know my grandfather was only 2 years old when polly died...he must have survived the war because he his mentioned on my grandfathers marriage certificate in 1934...as i have said i knew nothing, until a couple of days ago i didnt know polly had died so young...i was devistated having said that i am also proud at the same time. michael was only young and yet along with so many others he was so brave...i just need to know ..

thankyou for the help so far

susan

[kevin]

Susan

Could the Battalion read 1/7th rather than 17th ?

It's the number 1069 it could be a TF number or a 17th number but if the 17th it would be 17/1069, thats why i thing it might be the 1/7th Battalion, as you say your GGrandmother died in 1915(what Month?), the 1/7th did not leave for France till April 1915, so your GGrandfather may have been released prior to this date.

If at all poss could you post ascan of the info regards Battalion?

Regards Kevin

[legendsdiner]

regarding michael morley

all the documents i have say that this is correct name although i cant not find him on a census he was born 1892 but as yet i dont know were...he was married in 1911 in birstall west yorkshire to polly ambrose

polly died in 1915 and on her certificate it says that michael was in c.company west yorkshire regiment...because of pollys death i didnot know if he would have stayed in the army i know my grandfather was only 2 years old when polly died...he must have survived the war because he his mentioned on my grandfathers marriage certificate in 1934...as i have said i knew nothing, until a couple of days ago i didnt know polly had died so young...i was devistated having said that i am also proud at the same time. michael was only young and yet along with so many others he was so brave...i just need to know ..

thankyou for the help so far

susan

[legendsdiner]

Susan

Could the Battalion read 1/7th rather than 17th ?

It's the number 1069 it could be a TF number or a 17th number but if the 17th it would be 17/1069, thats why i thing it might be the 1/7th Battalion, as you say your GGrandmother died in 1915(what Month?), the 1/7th did not leave for France till April 1915, so your GGrandfather may have been released prior to this date.

If at all poss could you post ascan of the info regards Battalion?

Regards Kevin

hi kevin

i can not scan the document i have at the moment but the information i have is as follows.

polly ambrose death 23rd of feb 1915....when and where died reads:24 feb 1915 18 lime st westgate cleckheaton....

her occupation wife of:michael morley colliery (unreadable)private no 1069 c.company 17th west yorkshire regiment....

signature description and residence of informant reads: widower of deceased present at death.bridge house ilkley...

thats all i have...apart from cause of death which was anaemia perniciosa...

i was not sure what would have happened to micheal after her death my grandfather was only two...would michael have been released ..

i have a full ancestery on polly my g.grandmother...but nothing on michael apart from the marriage certificate and pollys death certificate..i can not find him on the 1901 census even though i believe he was born in 1891/92..his name is on my grandfathers marriage certificate every thing i have proclaims him to be a coal miner and a member of the west yorkshire regiment...i am prosuming he was alive in 1934as my grandfathers marriage certificate names him as his father and does not say deceased...his occupation then was coal miner stone worker...

i visit the graves of my grandparents most weekends but have no special place for michael or pollyi really would like to know what happenned to him and more than that pay my respects in someway..my initial idea was to make sure is grave was well taken care of but i can not find one for him...that why i worry he may have died in the great war...my grandfather was a very quite man you know we stood when the national antham came on etc etc its only as you get older you begin to understand why he was the person he was...we were so close yet he never mentioned any war even though i know he was in ww2.. i never knew about polly dying so young until a couple of days ago and that brings me back to michael.....anyway thanks for reply and info

best wishes

susan

[Stebie9173]

In reference to Kevin's post.

Whilst we would normally associate very low numbers with Territorial battalions, a fair few of the Pals battalions numbered from Zero from the date of establishment in 1914/1915.

The Leeds Pals were one of those units, so his 1069 number will be consistent with the 17th West Yorks.

It would also suggest an enlistment in the original contingent of the battalion. Though his number is just above the level of a full battalion strength we might expect there to be some men rejected on medical grounds, etc.

Incidentally, the 17th was originally raised as a Bantam battalion (i.e. men below regulation height of 5' 3" tall).

Steve.

[kevin]

Steve

You are correct, as the NA -NIC search was not working this morning, i could not carry out asearch.

The 1069 number belongs to a Pte Harold Windle. So it points to Pte Morley been in the 17th and not going overseas.

Regards Kevin

[mmm45]

Putting a 17 Prefix doesnt give any West Yorkshire hits

Nearest was 17/1068 that was Pte James A Butler + William Horner in the West Yorkshires.

Ady

[legendsdiner]

In reference to Kevin's post.

Whilst we would normally associate very low numbers with Territorial battalions, a fair few of the Pals battalions numbered from Zero from the date of establishment in 1914/1915.

The Leeds Pals were one of those units, so his 1069 number will be consistent with the 17th West Yorks.

It would also suggest an enlistment in the original contingent of the battalion. Though his number is just above the level of a full battalion strength we might expect there to be some men rejected on medical grounds, etc.

Incidentally, the 17th was originally raised as a Bantam battalion (i.e. men below regulation height of 5' 3" tall).

Steve.

hi sorry to trouble every one again but if some one else had my g grandfathers number would that mean he left the army???

many thanks a confused susan...

[kevin]

Susan

No one else had your GGrandfathers service number.

If you go to the mother site The Long Long Trail,it explains the numbering system used. What we are talking about here is that tht TF forces had there own numbering system as did the service battalion's and then we have the pals Battalions who where allowed to start at the number 1 and put a prefix number in front of this number as in the 15th Batt West Yorks, it would be 15/1 and in the 17th Batt it would be 17/1 and this was at Regiment level, so if you went to another Regiment you would be given another number, so within the Army say we have say 60 regiments, so we could have 60 men with the number 5000, yes it does get very confusing at times. But to keep it simple your GGrandfather was given the number 1069 and it would of being with a 17/ prefix as in 17/1069 stating that he was from the 17th Battalion West Yorkshire Regiment (The 2nd Leeds Pals), but as we cannot find an MIC at the NA it looks like he never sereved oversea's, and maybe your next step would be to see if you can get hold of his service record at the NA.

Regards Kevin

[legendsdiner]

Susan

No one else had your GGrandfathers service number.

If you go to the mother site The Long Long Trail,it explains the numbering system used. What we are talking about here is that tht TF forces had there own numbering system as did the service battalion's and then we have the pals Battalions who where allowed to start at the number 1 and put a prefix number in front of this number as in the 15th Batt West Yorks, it would be 15/1 and in the 17th Batt it would be 17/1 and this was at Regiment level, so if you went to another Regiment you would be given another number, so within the Army say we have say 60 regiments, so we could have 60 men with the number 5000, yes it does get very confusing at times. But to keep it simple your GGrandfather was given the number 1069 and it would of being with a 17/ prefix as in 17/1069 stating that he was from the 17th Battalion West Yorkshire Regiment (The 2nd Leeds Pals), but as we cannot find an MIC at the NA it looks like he never sereved oversea's, and maybe your next step would be to see if you can get hold of his service record at the NA.

Regards Kevin

thankyou once again for youre advice i will let you know how i get on ..