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Remembered Today:

searchin for Sergeant Richard (Ginger) Bell


Jarvis

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Hello

I am currently researching Segeant Richard Bell aka Ginger of Barnard Castle.

It would appear he also served in the Boer war. I believe he became a regimental Sergeant Major at some point.

Any help would be appreciated. I know he has a group of 5 medals and was mentioned in despatches, not sure which war this was from. Any 10th Hussars experts can help me out in this one.

Jarvis

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MICs dont show a MID for ww1

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I know absolutely nothing about the 10th Hussars, but there is a Richard Bell's records on Ancestry. Enlisted 5 Jan 1893, born Barnard Castle, no.3268, promoted to sergt. 1 May 1913 and discharded Jan 1914. Served most of his time with the 18th. Whether he is the same Richard Bell, no 15837, I cannot say as there are no re-enlisted papers.

If you would like the records then PM me your email address.

Regards Kevin

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Thanks for the reply Coldstreamer, just been chatting with a friend who is a relative of Regimental Sergeant Richard Bell 10th Hussars.

The serial number is not definite, but my friend, remembers selling the medals about 20 years ago and has requested a little info on what he had (or has done!).

Just going off his statements at the moment and hoping to throw some light on the matter. The chap in question 'Ginger' survived the great war and died in the 60s.

I could certainly do with some Hussars input here and possibly gazette (if he was mentioned in despatches, not once but twice, according to my friend, 'Rusty'. Which war is also important. I am told he served in both.

Jarvis

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Kevs find sounds promising

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Hi Jarvis

There is a 3268 Private R Bell listed in the 10th Hussar’s Queen South Africa medal roll (for the Boer War) with six clasps for Paardeberg, Dreifontein, Johnnesburg, Diamond Jill, Wittenbergen and Relief of Kimberley.

This link - http://www.stephen-stratford.co.uk/boer_war.htm - gives a good introduction into the QSA as well as the clasps entitlement.

Maybe the MID was for the Boer War.

The 10th Hussars landed in South Africa in early December 1899. It seems that they were there until the end. As they took part for more than 18 months, they would be entitled to the Kings South Africa medal, with date clasps SA1901 and SA1902, as well.

There is a WW1 MIC for 15837 Sgt Richard Bell of the 10th Hussars. If the same man, this could suggest a break in service, in which case it would be worth looking in WO97 in Kew for his pre WW1 service papers. With a break in service he may have missed out on a LSGC medal (and a MSM), leaving us with the QSA, KSA and WW1 trio as the five medals.

Pure speculation of course.

Regards

Pete

PS...I wrote the above before seeing the last few posts. If he was discharged in January 1914 his papers would be in WO363/364 unfortunately. WO97 includes discharge between 1900 and the end of 1913. If he was discharged in January 1914, then re-enlisted I am pretty sure he would have been given a new number.

Maybe his relative can remember that one medal had six clasps and another had two.

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Pete your information and speculation sounds close to what my friend is telling me, apart from he doesn't remember a star, so perhaps no trio for ww1 ??

Dreifontein, Diamond Jill, and Relief of Kimberley are names he has mentioned to me from his family tree (which I have asked him to dig out from his attic and he should be doing this as we speak).

All sound very promising so far and I am now awaiting the ancestry info from kevrow to see what becomes of it all. I am enjoying helping my friend and the bonus to it all, of course, is Ginger Bell is a Barny Lad and can be added to my 'those who served' lists.

Good work chaps.

Jarvis

Also, just been told there is a full page article in the Hussars Gazette (date unknown) entitled Gingers Tale. Any Hussars experts know of such a publication ?

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the MIc will confirm a star

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Jarvis there is no indication on these records that he served in the Great War. I would have thought that it he is highly likely to be 15837 Richard Bell on the MICs, so downloading it may be worthwhile.

I cannot send you the records without your email address.

I was going to add his medal entitlements, IDCM,LSGC,QM and 6 clasps, but given they are not for 1914-1918 I thought better of it.

Regards Kevin

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Hi Jarvis

3268 R Bell received only four medals.

He did not get the KSA, as he was only in SA for 1 year and 106 days. He did however receive the QSA with seven clasps (the six previously mentioned plus the ‘South Africa 1901’ to go on the QSA);

LSGC awarded in 1911 (after 18 years service)

The Delhi Durbar medal, and

The 1911 Coronation medal.

The papers on Ancestry say that in January 1914 he was a widower, and gives the names and dates of birth of his two children, so your friend should be able so say if it the right one.

Regards

Pete

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Hi Jarvis

3268 R Bell received only four medals.

He did not get the KSA, as he was only in SA for 1 year and 106 days. He did however receive the QSA with seven clasps (the six previously mentioned plus the ‘South Africa 1901’ to go on the QSA);

LSGC awarded in 1911 (after 18 years service)

The Delhi Durbar medal, and

The 1911 Coronation medal.

The papers on Ancestry say that in January 1914 he was a widower, and gives the names and dates of birth of his two children, so your friend should be able so say if it the right one.

Regards

Pete

One of his children should have been called Richard (aka Dickie) not sure of his dob. But beleive he lived in Sydenham in later years.

I would appreciate names and dob's if this is possible.

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Looks like it is him:

post-6536-1174600431.jpg

post-6536-1174600476.jpg

PM me your e-mail address, Jarvis... Or Kevrow, as you wish..

Steve.

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By the way, there are also John bell (b. 1871) and James Bell (b. 1892) from Barnard Castle.

In fact, a list of Barnard Castle men:

Name Estimated birth year Birth Parish Birth County Number of Images

John Henry Armstrong abt 1885 Barnard Castle Durham 4 images

Walter Aspinall abt 1881 Barnard Castle Durham 5 images

Thomas Sowerby Bainbridge abt 1880 16 images

Percival Baxter abt 1895 18 images

James Bell abt 1892 Barnard Castle Durham 6 images

John Bell abt 1871 Barnard Castle Durham 10 images

Richard Bell abt 1875 3 images

Richard Bell abt 1875 Barnard Castle Durham 14 images

Ernest Black abt 1878 Barnard Castle Durham 8 images

Thomas Albert Black abt 1882 Barnard Castle Durham 18 images

John Thomas Bland 4 images

George Bradley abt 1898 Barnard Castle Durham 33 images

Steve.

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Hello Jarvis,

The casualty roll in the regimental history has 3268 Sgt R Bell listed as wounded on 12th November 1914. This was a particularly bad day for the regiment with the deaths of Major Cadogan, RSM King and Pte Adams and the wounding of Captain Palmes and 18 NCO's and men (including Bell).

There are no other mentions of him in the history and he does not appear on a photo's of the members of the Sergeants mess taken in 1921.

Hope this helps.

Martin

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Did you download the MIC for Sgt. R Bell Jarvis? I do not understand why the no 3268 is not showing up unless there has been an omission. He certainly should have been awarded a star.

Regards Kevin

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Steve, a million thanks for your additions, you have just swelled the area I am trying not to research yet, manyfold. Seriously, thanks. These are all new additions for my Those Who Served and I will dutifully have them logged. I'm still trying to find the time to convert 130+ entries of the fallen, mostly only partly researched, but positively ID'ed to a web site, still have around 80 not ID'ed 100% but almost certain. Just reached the letter I on the proven. I'll launch the site when I have finished the fallen and began Those who served... if the missus hasn't disowned me by then.

Martin, a big thank you for this input. I was not aware of any of this information and find it useful for my own research and it will be of great interest to my friend 'Rusty'

Kevin, great input. A fantastic response. I have to arrange this for Rusty onto CD for his own family research and hopefully 'allow' him to pay the 'fee' for the MIC. The offshoot of this is another 5 MICs to Bell that could be available to fellow GWF chaps, who knows, some of Steves additions may feature on them.

Swamped....but still will find the time to post and help where possible. I wouldn't have it any other way... hey look another Inspector Frost repeat is on the TV tonight......must dash.... to change the background music....Steeleye Span tonight.

Jarvis

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I've also checked the regiment's casualty roll for the South African War, wounded and taken prisoner, your man doesn't feature here either.

Do you or 'Rusty' have a photograph of him by any chance ?

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Martin, not sure if there is a photograph yet. I'll be visiting Rusty tomorrow morning and will report back then. Just like to thank you for your efforts and information to-date. Much appreciated.

Jarvis

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Martin, not sure if there is a photograph yet. I'll be visiting Rusty tomorrow morning and will report back then. Just like to thank you for your efforts and information to-date. Much appreciated.

Jarvis

Sorry for the delay in replying....no photograph alas.....just a section on Rustys Family Tree.

Many thanks for all who have added time and input on this one. Hopefully I can add some kind of footnote when more is revealed. He does sound an incredible chap, by all accounts.

Jarvis

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  • 6 years later...

Hi guys, first time poster that just happened across this whilst doing my dissertation. I have found a newspaper written about Sgt. Major Bell, of Barnard Castle, written in 1945. At the end of the article someone refers to him as Ginger. It is pretty tough to read, but what ever you can make from it is probably relevant, even if it is seven years late!

I tried to attach the PDF but it was too big, but you can find it here: http://www.teesdalemercuryarchive.co.uk/

Ginger appears in the paper issued on the 9th of May, 1945.

Hope this is still relevant! Sorry for the crazy thread resurrection too.

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