Norfolk Regiment-Essex transfer

[samsearcher]

I am trying to trace the movements of my Grandfather, Samuel Wells from Norfolk, who enlisted for the Norfolk Regiment 11 December 1915 No: 29257 and was mobilised for the Norfolks 10 February 1916.

At some point he transferred to the 15th Battalion Essex regt. X1 Corps. No: 41304 and later believed to the 10th Essex.

can anyone shed any light on when the transfers may have taken place? I have another thread running under the Essex regiment.

Many thanks

John

[Stebie9173]

One way to narrow it down is to identify those in the same batch (look for those with very similar numbers in both Norfolk and Essex regiments) and see if any of these men were killed. If so then the date of death may help narrow down the date of transfer by putting a "latest" date on them.

My own experience of this with a similar transfer from the Bedfords (2xxxx) numbers to the Northamptons (4xxxx) numbers showed men first killed in September 1916, thus narrowing it down to mid-1916, probably as replacements for Somme losses in July 1916. this batch was 300 men so I had a fair bit of scope for research. A smaller batch might take a bit more luck.

Steve.

[samsearcher]

Thanks Steve

where can I look for these numbers?

John

[samsearcher]

My grandfather came from a very small Norfolk village, and I believe may have enlisted with others at the same time, some of whom did not return. Is it likely that they would all have gone into the same regiment/battalion? What is the reason for transferring between regiments?

Thanks

john

[snavek]

John, have you looked for his m-i-c, if not follow the advice given on the Long Long Trail (see above). You have his name and a service number so with a bit of luck you should get the Units he served in and any other service numbers.

If he was in the 3rd Norfolks he may have been at Harwich Garrison with other Reserve Battalions and transferred to the Essex Regt., it happened.

According to James 'British Regiments' 15th Bn. Essex T.F. didn't go to France until May 1918 joining 177th Bde. 59th Div. and remaining with them to the end of the war.

10th (Service) Bn. Essex were in France by the time he joined up, by the end of the war they were with 53rd Bde. 18th Div.

Keith

[kevinrowlinson]

Hi John,

I have had a quick look at a few Norfolk soldiers that was transferred to the Essex, and had close numbers to your grandfathers. It is extremely difficult to say when or how many were transferred at any one time but here' a few;

name Norfolk No. Essex No.

F E Kerrison 29252 41299

A Porter 29255 41302

J Smith 29256 41303

S Wells 29257 41304

J Cook 29259 41305

E W Bell 29274 41310

E A Blyth 29275 41311

J Booty 29276 41312

J Burton 29278 41314

J Collins 29281 41316

H G Cooper 29282 41317

H Dack 29285 41319

Sadly two of these men were killed. J Collins, killed 28 April 1917, and H Dack, killed 3 May 1917, and both commemorated on the Arras Memorial.

Both were serving in the 13th Battalion.

Obviouly it would be easy to say that your grandfather was serving with them but without his service records I feel it would be just speculation.

I would say your grandfather attested under the Derby Scheme, and although he may have gone to the recruiting office with his friends, there is no guarentee that they were mobilised at the same time, or at the same place.

Hopes some of this helps.

Regards Kevin

[nhclark]

John,

Have you tried the Essex Regiment Museum in Chelmsford? The museum has a database on all its men.

The curator, Ian Hook, is most helpful. You could e-mail him on pompadour@chelmsford.gov.uk

Noel

[samsearcher]

Thanks for all this gents, yes, I have tried the Essex regiment museum without any luck for my Grandfather, and I owe Ian a reply with copies of the documents that I have.

I did not expect you all to do my research for me, with answers to my quest, what I really need is WHERE you all seem to find the necessary info.... . I do have a copy of his MIC, where it states Victory and British in the Norfolks, K12/102 B15 page 749....whatever that means!

Regards

John

John,

Have you tried the Essex Regiment Museum in Chelmsford? The museum has a database on all its men.

The curator, Ian Hook, is most helpful. You could e-mail him on pompadour@chelmsford.gov.uk

Noel

[kevinrowlinson]

"WHERE" is at the National Archives to search for your grandfathers records and the medal index role, but the first port of call is The Long, Long Trail linked at the top of this page.

Kevin

[samsearcher]

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Edited 11 January , 2019 by samsearcher

[samsearcher]

An update on Kevins post..... from recently discovered info if that helps anyone else......

 

Norfolk to Essex Regiment transfers:

 

Name             Norfolks ---> Essex            Battalion      

EG Owen       29126              41216             ?10th Essex?  Wounded/missing 18/2/17

F E Kerrison   29252             41299             13th Essex    missing 28/4/17 POW 7/9/17

J Mortlock       29254             41301             13th Essex     transferred 10/11/16

A Porter          29255             41302            

J Smith           29256             41303             1st Essex       wounded 24/8/18  37th Div.

S Wells          29257             41304             13th Essex    wounded 29/4/17 &  30/11/17

J F Cook        29259             41305             10th Essex     KIA 02 September 1918 Rancourt

E W Bell         29274             41310

E A Blyth        29275             41311

J Booty           29276             41312

J Burton          29278             41314             ??th Essex  POW 11/2/18 (from Calthorpe)

J Collins         29281             41316             13th Essex  KIA 28 April 1917 Arras memorial

H G Cooper   29282             41317             13th Essex  POW  7/8/17

H Dack           29285             41319             13th Essex  KIA 03 May 1917   Arras memorial

Edited 11 January , 2019 by samsearcher