christine liava'a Posted 7 December , 2003 Share Posted 7 December , 2003 Remembering Today: Pte John Robert JOHNSON, 2553 1/5 Bn, Northumberland Fusiliers, who died on 08.12.16. Vaux-en-Amienois Communal Cemetery, France Name: JOHNSON Initials: J R Nationality: United Kingdom Rank: Private Regiment: Northumberland Fusiliers Unit Text: 5th Bn. Date of Death: 08/12/1916 Service No: 2553 Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead Grave/Memorial Reference: A. 8. Cemetery: VAUX-EN-AMIENOIS COMMUNAL CEMETERY Cemetery: VAUX-EN-AMIENOIS COMMUNAL CEMETERY Country: France Locality: Somme Location Information: Vaux-en-Amienois is a small village in the Department of the Somme, 8 kilometres north-west of Amiens along the D933 and left on the D97. Historical Information: During the First World War, the Fourth Army Trench Mortar School was at Vaux-en-Amienois. The communal cemetery contains 15 Commonwealth burials of the First World War. No. of Identified Casualties: 15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christine liava'a Posted 7 December , 2003 Author Share Posted 7 December , 2003 This person will be difficult to research, with no age, a common name, and no address or parentage given The Northumberland Fusiliers Museum , with its records, would probably be the best place to start, for a cost Northumberland Fusiliers Museum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pete Wood Posted 7 December , 2003 Share Posted 7 December , 2003 In the SDGW, it shows us that John Robert Johnson was born in Byker, Newcastle-Upon-Tyne (in the North East of England). So I entered John’s birth place in the online 1901 census records on the PRO’s website. This gave two people with the name John Johnson. One man was aged 30, in the 1901 records, which would have made him 47 in 1916. So, while I didn’t discount him altogether, I concentrated on the ‘boy’ who was 4 years old. This put his birth day as being in 1896 or 1897. I now entered these years in the FreeBMD search to find “John Robert Johnson” in the December quarter of 1896 in the Newcastle T[yne] district. This means that John was almost certainly 20 years old at his death. Normally we have come to accept that the statement in SDGW – Died How: Died, is from natural causes (such as illness). But the CWGC information about the cemetery being a trench mortar school, set the alarm bells ringing. Such cemeteries were sometimes placed there, for deaths caused by training accidents. I decided to look at the information about the cemetery itself. I went to the CWGC site and entered “VAUX-EN-AMIENOIS” into the cemetery enquiry box. This shows you all the people buried at this location. There are only 15, so I knew that looking for people who died on the same date – and/or from the same battalion – would not take long. Sure enough, it quickly became obvious that John Robert Johnson died, along with his pals from the 1/5 Northumberland Fusiliers (which was a Territorial unit) and other NF battalions on the same day: 2 Lt ISHERWOOD, ARTHUR aged 26 6 Bn NF attd. 149 T.M. Bty. 946 Pte BLACKBURN, WILLIAM aged 20 4th Bn NF attd. 149th T.M. Bty. 2074 Cpl BOAL, JOHN EDGAR MM aged 20 7th Bn NF. attd. 149th T.M. Bty. 3391 L Cpl DUNCAN, ROBERT HENRY aged 21 7Bn NF 2295 Cpl FRANCIS, STANLEY aged 26 1/5 NF 2553 Pte JOHNSON, JOHN ROBERT aged 20 (maybe 19 years 11 months) 1/5 NF Lt DIXSON, THOMAS STORIE aged 29 1 Bn Coldstream Guards 2 Lt SIMPSON, JOHN WATT aged 28 7 Bn Border Regiment The SDGW needs to be looked at now, by someone, to see if other deaths might have been caused by this accident, with the soldiers passing away at a later stage as a result of their wounds. What was 149 TM Bty....?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 7 December , 2003 Share Posted 7 December , 2003 It was the battery attached to 149 (Northumberland) Brigade, 50th (Northumbrian) Division, formed in June 1916. I've been through SDGW for 7-12-16, and can't find any further casualties from likely units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_Blanchard Posted 7 December , 2003 Share Posted 7 December , 2003 It was the Trench Mortar Battery of the 149th Brigade, 50th Division. My Great Uncle Pte Tom Williams served in the same unit 1/5 North Fus. In the picture below he is with his brother Sam, a stoker on HMS Lion (he almost certainly served at Jutland from his papers) David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_Blanchard Posted 7 December , 2003 Share Posted 7 December , 2003 While I have posted a photograph of Tom Williams who was taken Prisoner on the 27th May 1918, I also have a photo of a group of soldiers taken prisoner on that day[from IWM photo 9473], I would like to think the soldier on the left is Uncle Tom- similar hands perhaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pete Wood Posted 8 December , 2003 Share Posted 8 December , 2003 A few more questions if you please: 1 Were all these Northumberland Battalions (4, 1/5, 6, 7) in the same Division....?? 2 Were the guys in 149 TM Bty the instructors (or being instructed)?? 3 Who were the other officers; trainers or trainees?? 4 How many men are required to operate a Trench Mortar?? 5 Would the Trench Mortar School have a war diary - or will more information (enquiry into cause of death) be found in the officers' records at the PRO?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pete Wood Posted 8 December , 2003 Share Posted 8 December , 2003 I've been through SDGW for 7-12-16, and can't find any further casualties from likely units. Ah-ha, but this is the problem with the Antipodeans getting the 'Remembering Today' info 9 hours before us here in the UK. The date you should be looking at, on SDGW, is 8-12-16 Knowing you, Chris, you probably checked two days before and quite a few days after. But when people read this thread in 70 years time, we wouldn't want to be remembered for getting it wrong..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_Blanchard Posted 11 December , 2003 Share Posted 11 December , 2003 1. These NF Bns were all in the 149th Brigade 50th Div 4.Initially, light trench mortar batteries were formed two per brigade in April 1916, with each battery having four 3.7 inch or 4 inch trench mortars. In June 1916, they were amalgamated in pairs so that each brigade had one battery of 8 guns, and they were standardised on the 3 inch Stokes mortar. Unlike Medium and Heavy Trench Mortar Batteries which were manned by artillerymen, light trench mortar batteries were manned by the infantry. Batteries carried the same number as their parent brigades. There were 50 off and men in each Light Mortar battery operating 8 times 3 inch mortars. 5. WO 95/2831 Brigade Trench Mortar Battery 149th Brigade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bendigonian Posted 8 November , 2014 Share Posted 8 November , 2014 2074 Cpl John Edgar Boal 7th Btn Northumberland Fusiliers was one of those killed on that day 8th December 1916 previously awarded the Military Medal, London Gazette dated 11th October 1916 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bendigonian Posted 21 June , 2022 Share Posted 21 June , 2022 A photo of Cpl John Edgar Boal , Nortumberland Fusiliers that i recently discovered on the internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 21 June , 2022 Share Posted 21 June , 2022 On 07/12/2003 at 17:13, christine liava'a said: Pte John Robert JOHNSON, 2553 1/5 Bn, Northumberland Fusiliers, who died on 08.12.16. Vaux-en-Amienois Communal Cemetery, France On 07/12/2003 at 17:30, christine liava'a said: This person will be difficult to research, with no age, a common name, and no address or parentage given Thanks to the pension cards at WFA/Fold3 nowadays research is a bit easier I think. Image thanks to WFA/Fold3 Pte John Robert JOHNSON, 2553 1/5 Bn, Northumberland Fusiliers - Accidentally killed while on A.S.. Widow: Eleanor Isabella JOHNSON remarried becomng RILEY Originally 220 Parker Street, Newcastle on Tyne, later 218 Parker Street. M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 21 June , 2022 Share Posted 21 June , 2022 On 08/11/2014 at 00:47, The Bendigonian said: 2074 Cpl John Edgar Boal 7th Btn Northumberland Fusiliers was one of those killed on that day 8th December 1916 Similarly thanks to the pension cards at WFA/Fold3 Image thanks to WFA/Fold3 2074 Cpl John Edgar BOAL, Northumberland Fusiliers - Died of wounds Father: Thomas W W BOAL, 12 West Sreeet, Berwick-on-Tweed [Thomas William BOAL] M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 21 June , 2022 Share Posted 21 June , 2022 (edited) On 07/12/2003 at 21:37, Guest Pete Wood said: 3391 L Cpl DUNCAN, ROBERT HENRY aged 21 7Bn NF Pension card: Accidentally killed Father, Alexander DUNCAN, Schoolhouse, Ashington On 07/12/2003 at 21:37, Guest Pete Wood said: 946 Pte BLACKBURN, WILLIAM aged 20 4th Bn NF attd. 149th T.M. Bty. Pension card: Killed Mother, Mary, father, John, BLACKBURN - Orchard Crescent, Corbridge on Tyne On 07/12/2003 at 21:37, Guest Pete Wood said: 2295 Cpl FRANCIS, STANLEY aged 26 1/5 NF Pension card: Accidentally killed Father: Enoch FRANCIS, 7 High Row West, Seaton Burn. Mother: Elizabeth FRANCIS, b.1852 - 8 Coquet Terrace, Dudley, Northumberland [seemingly a later address] M Edited 21 June , 2022 by Matlock1418 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaySearching Posted 21 June , 2022 Share Posted 21 June , 2022 4 hours ago, Matlock1418 said: On 07/12/2003 at 21:37, Guest Pete Wood said: 2295 Cpl FRANCIS, STANLEY aged 26 1/5 NF Pension card: Accidentally killed Father: Enoch FRANCIS, 7 High Row West, Seaton Burn. Mother: Elizabeth FRANCIS, b.1852 - 8 Coquet Terrace, Dudley, Northumberland [seemingly a later address] M Face to a name Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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