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Remembered Today:

Australian Unit Histories


Andrew P

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Hi Chooms,

Just a quick Q.

Is the History of the 14th Bn a very difficult unit history to purchase? (orig or Burridge copy)

(I know they are all quite scarce now)

I have had a request for a copy, & I have not seen a copy of this book for a long time. I sold an original a few years back for $200. (blue boards, preface by Monash, etc) I was told by this bloke only copy on offer was for $750.00 which was much more than he wanted to pay....

Cheers

Geoff S

Edited by Geoff S
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Hi Geoff

I bought my Burridge copy about 6 or more years ago, for quite a reasonable price. But haven't seen any for sale lately even through the military bookdealer I go through who normally has a good collection of histories for sale.

Cheers

Andrew

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I'm very interest in the operations of 44th Battalion. In particular what narrative they have describing their operations and activities June 1-4, 1917.

It is possible they may mention a raid on 'German Wire' and two brothers as casualties (Arch and Ron Barley). These were my great uncles.

It would be of great interest to hear what the unit was doing these days.

In addition, I'm interested in the units location and operations from 25 Nov 1916 up to June 1917.

Thank you in advance for a quick scan of your records!

June 1 - 4 was just prior to Messines but I'll double check the history when I get home as to whether there was any special raids that the 44th was involved in.

Regards

Andrew

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Frev,

The battalion commenced departure from Alexandria on the 31st January and moved to Aerodrome Camp just near Heliopolis.

'On arrival at the new quarters the first step taken was the reorganisation of the battalion on a four or double company system. This new organisation was adopted in all Australian infantry units*. This reform was given effect to, as far as the 14th was concerned, on February 4, and henceforth A and E Companies formed A Company - OC Major Rankine, 2IC Capt FH Wright. B and F Companies formed B Company - OC Capt Baldock, 2IC Capt WR Hoggart. C and G Companies formed C Company - OC Major Steel, 2IC Catp Hutton. D and H Companies formed D Company - OC Capt Connelly, 2IC Capt AH Henry.

* The double company organisation was adopted to bring the AIF units into line with the organisation of the British Army which had adopted this system some time previously. The half-companies were called platoons, four of which went to a the company.

Rgds

Tim D

Thanks heaps for this Tim - I was really hoping that F Coy had in fact become part of B.

Cheers, Frev

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I'm very interest in the operations of 44th Battalion. In particular what narrative they have describing their operations and activities June 1-4, 1917.

It is possible they may mention a raid on 'German Wire' and two brothers as casualties (Arch and Ron Barley). These were my great uncles.

It would be of great interest to hear what the unit was doing these days.

In addition, I'm interested in the units location and operations from 25 Nov 1916 up to June 1917.

Thank you in advance for a quick scan of your records!

From the 44th History by Neville Browning.

'On the 4th of June parties from the 43rd & 44th Battalion were ordered to carry out a daylight raid on the enemy trenches opposite the corner of a communication trench known as Toronto Avenue at 2pm.....

The parties were under orders to enter the German lines and secure prisoners and material for identification purposes.'

The parties of the 44th got into the German trench and dugouts and corpses were searched.

"As the parties withdrew, Private A.R.Barley was wounded by shellfire and fell into a shell hole. His twin brother, Pte A.E.Barley immediately attended to him. H.E. Everington wrote: 'On the way back he was hit by a shell which carried away part of his side. His brother stayed with him until he died and then in the dark returned almost clothesless having used his shirt for bandages and his tunic for covering. When he returned he was taken to the dressing station...He was in a pitiful state, almost demented with grief and beyond giving particulars'

the 44th Battalion as part of the 3rd Division came into the front line in December 1916 in Armentieres and spent much of the next few months in this area as well as at Ploegsteert.

Regards

Andrew

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Awesome Andrew awesome...

It brought tears to my eyes. These two young boys (in 1917) now have nieces spread from England to Canada, to America, Australia and New Zealand and all tell the story of their uncle died and the other destroyed by grief. These details are the first of the actual battle in the 88 years since.

My family thanks you.

bc

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Awesome Andrew awesome...

It brought tears to my eyes. These two young boys (in 1917) now have nieces spread from England to Canada, to America, Australia and New Zealand and all tell the story of their uncle died and the other destroyed by grief. These details are the first of the actual battle in the 88 years since.

My family thanks you.

bc

No worries mate. If you want the whole account of the raid just PM me your e-mail address and I'll scan it and send it through.

Regards

Andrew

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Andrew

Would you have anything on the following soldiers movements -

Name: GRAY, ARTHUR

Initials: A

Nationality: Australian

Rank: Private

Regiment: Australian Infantry, A.I.F.

Unit Text: 41st Bn.

Age: 26

Date of Death: 14/02/1917

Service No: 873

Additional information: Son of Alfred and Elizabeth Gray, of The Gatehouse, Stansted Rd., Stansted, Essex England.

Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead

Grave/Memorial Reference: IV. E. 34.

Cemetery: CITE BONJEAN MILITARY CEMETERY, ARMENTIERES

I have got his service records and Roll of honour info from the awm website - What i am really after is any details of action he was involved in leading up to his death.

Kind Regards

Glyn

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Hi Glyn,

I have a relative who was the RSM of the 41st Bn towards the end of the war. A good mate's grandfather (LCPL Bernie Gordon) won the VC with them. There is no mention of what the battalion were doing on the 14th February in the 41st Battalion history. The 42nd and 44th Battalion histories mention that the 41st and 42nd Battalions were in the front line at Armentieres on the 14th February. Before and after this time 11th Brigade was rotating its four battalions (41st, 42nd, 43rd and 44th) in and out of the line in twos. They were heavily involved in raids and the Germans reciprocated on occasion. His Red Cross file shows Gray was shot through the heart, and killed instantly, whilst out on a wiring party on the 14th February.

Bob Doneley lives in Toowoomba...perhaps he might be able to point you in the right direction to see if there is any mention of Gray the local paper?

You may already have some of this. His service papers are here:

http://naa12.naa.gov.au/scripts/imagine.asp?B=4663132&I=1

Red Cross file here:

http://www.awm.gov.au/database/1drl428_dis...=41st+Battalion

Rgds

Tim

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Tim

Many Thanks for that - I had his service record but NOT the red cross info - great stuff mate.

Once again Thanks

Glyn

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  • 4 weeks later...

Tim / Andrew

Ok my old mates sitting in sunny Oz

Any info on the following man

Name: MAYERSBETH, JOSEPH WILLIAM

Initials: J W

Nationality: Australian

Rank: Captain

Regiment: Australian Infantry, A.I.F.

Unit Text: 48th Bn.

Age: 25

Date of Death: 12/06/1917

Additional information: Son of Robert Charles and Rose Matilda Mayersbeth; husband of Doris Lillian Mayersbeth, of 36, Grey St., South Fremantle, Western Australia. Native of Lambeth, London, England.

Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead

Grave/Memorial Reference: Panel 7 - 17 - 23 - 25 - 27 - 29 - 31.

Cemetery: YPRES (MENIN GATE) MEMORIAL

Easy one this for you guys as he is a Captain !!

Cant seem to access the Aussie Archives today to see if his service records are there ?

Anyway - Apparently he was bought up as a child in my village of Stansted by a Mrs F Bedlow.

Looking for that Stansted Connection and any other info on him.

All the best - keep out of the sun :D

Glyn

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Glyn,

He was originally 16th Bn and embarked 31 March 1916 with the 16th Reinforcements. The 16th was split to form the 48th Bn in early March 1916. It appears he marched into the 4th Training Bn, before joining the 4th Pioneer Bn, then the 48th on 25 May 1916.

His service papers are available. There are also a number of other files for him there including a Court Martial for drunkedness and attempting to fight a Pte.

http://naa12.naa.gov.au/scripts/Imagine.asp

He is mentioned in the official history p. 649-652 and 676 in the aftermath of Messines between 8th-11th June. It appears that his company was attached to the 47th Bn in the front line at Messines to assist in consolidating the line. There is no mention of his death apart from a footnote that he was KIA on the 12th (my birthday incidentally).

http://www.awm.gov.au/cms_images/histories/5/chapters/16.pdf

I have looked at both the 16th and 48th histories and there is no mention of him. The 48th Bn history records that the Bn were in the line at Messines on the 12th June but does not mention his death.

I can find no mention of who raised him in the UK or his address there. Andrew may hopefully have more for you. He was a native of Fremantle.

Rgds

Tim D

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Glyn,

Have you tried the 1901 Census?

Rgds

Tim D

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Tim

Many thanks for all the info

Can't seem to make the service papers link work - but will try again later.

Have checked the 1901 census and found him as an 8 year old Boarder in Mortlake Surrey, which is not much help. He must have come to Stansted some time after then. I will keep digging.

Once again many thanks for your help

Glyn

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Hi Glyn

Tim is right as he is one of my Freo soldiers I'm researching.

I've been searching high and wide for info on him. Despite appeals in the local & state papers I have found no extra info or photos on him.

The only info I so far have is from his service record plus I have a eyewitness account of his death from a fellow officer.

On a chance I had a look at an account at the Australian War Memorial of a fellow officer in the 48th Battalion and he was there when Mayersbeth was killed and describes his last moments. I'll dig this account out in the next day or two.

After his death his wife remarried in the 1920's and moved from Fremantle to the countryside and have been unable to find anything else about her.

Regards

Andrew

P.S - Found that the National Archives site has been playing up badly in the last month or two. Hopefully they'll get rid of their bugs soon.

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Andrew

Got the service records in the end.

Just to add a few details - In my Local newspaper dated 7-7-1917 Mayersbeth was included in the casualty lists and it when on to say ... ex scholar of Stansted Church of England school who was brought up as a Dr Barnados boy by Mrs F.Bedlow of this parish.

Then on 14-7-1917 it said ... Mrs F.Bedlow reports that he was not brought up as a Barnados boy.

I got this info from a friend who spotted it in the papers - I will endeavour to get down there in the next week or so and copy the originals.

Will let you know in due course.

Yours (and Tims) help is always much appreciated

Glyn

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Glyn

Extract from the diary of Captain G.D.Mitchell MC DCM 48th Battalion held at the Australian War Memorial.

At the time of writing they were in the vicinity of Messines.

"June 12th. I soon discovered a concrete blockhouse and dived in. There were several bunks in it. Soon I was on one and sound asleep. The other company officers were in the adjoining one. Many shells landed outside. The blast shook the place. Then the tragedy happened. Captain Mayersbeth dashed in with blood pouring from a hole in his chest. An artery had been cut and there was no possible compression point. I pressed on top of the wound, and the bleeding went on internally. He was doomed. He knew it and said so. I knew it and could not deny it. Such futility would not be right. He said goodbye to his wife, Goodbye to his boys. He asked for absolution, recited a prayer and died like a brave man.

Night came. We buried the Captain and another man who had been killed."

Regards

Andrew

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Andrew

Thats excellent

Thanks very much

Glyn

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Andrew strikes again...well done mate...not a nice way to go.

RIP Captain Mayersbeth.

Rgds

Tim D

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hello Andrew:

My grandfather was in the 7th Battalion, 18th Reinf. and had been in France for since 1st December, 1916 when he was "Wounded in Action" on the 16th September, 1917. Over the years, I've tried to track the movements of the 7th Batt. and had always concluded that he received his injuries at Ypres - or Passchendaele - hope I've spelt that correctly - or it's called something else now, I believe.

I wonder if you'd be able to help in this regard - I'd like to know exactly where he was fighting.... I can remember his telling my father about one particular day - like most old soldiers, he never spoke about the war. But he said that they had "fixed bayonets" and were walking in to meet the enemy - and the young man behind him, only 18 years old, was very frightened and held on to his belt. In the affray that followed, the young man fell on top of my grandfather (who was only 5'3") and I believe he was one of the few who survived the battle. He said he thought he'd been lying in the field where he fell for some two days before he heard an English voice say "there's an Aussie alive over here"....

So my query is: would you be able to verify that he was at Passchendaele on or around the above dates... by reference to the Unit Histories you have?

With every good wish,

Lily

Launceston, Tasmania

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Andrew - hope you don't mind me butting in on this one.

Lily - as your grandfather's Service Record isn't on-line, I assume you have a copy of it to know the specific date of his wounding. If the date is correct, it seems he was wounded - in this case - by a stray bullet/shell etc, before the battle actually started.

Below is a copy of the specific time from the Unit History.

I'd suggest you get yourself a copy of this book - it's a very good read, especially for anyone interested in the 7th Battalion.

Cheers, Frev.

“Our Dear Old Battalion” – The Story of the 7th Battalion AIF, 1914-1919.

Ron Austin, Slouch Hat Publications, 2004

Chapter 14: Menin Road.

P.183

“The 7th Battalion remained at Bailleul during the first fortnight of September 1917, and training continued unabated, with conditions enhanced by a spell of lovely sunny weather.”

“On the afternoon of 14 September, the battalion moved up to the area known as Scottish Lines at Reninghelst, where it bivouacked for two days. Meanwhile, Lieutenant O’Connor and his Mining Platoon left their resting comrades, and made their way to the front-line where they were attached for mining tasks. While at Reninghelst, the troops appreciated an informal visit by General Birdwood, who rode through the camp on his horse, frequently stopping to chat to the Diggers. On the morning of 18 September, the battalion moved up to Chateau Segard, and on the next morning the unit, moving by platoons in file, with 100 metres between each platoon, arrived at Zillebeke Bund at 1.45pm, and took over dugouts just vacated by the 6th Battalion in readiness for the attack. Shortly after arriving at Zillebeke, Colonel Herrod called his company commanders together and gave them final details about the imminent attack, for which zero hour had been set at 5.40am on the next morning, 20 September 1917.

The fighting that occurred to the east of the shell-shattered Belgian town of Ypres during September and October 1917, is generally referred to as the Third Battle of Ypres, although the battle embraces the fighting which took place from 7 June through to 10 November and culminated in the capture of Passchendale.”

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Hello Frev:

I don't know if I'm answering this correctly.... but thank you so very much for your answer - and I shall most certainly endeavour to purchase the book you recommended. My grandfather and his brother both served in the 7th.....

Could I be so bold and ask if I can send you a copy (only one page) of his Casualty Form and you can let me know what you think... he'd had three strokes and been imbibing for a while when I heard him tell my father of the incident of being shot in France...

I haven't looked to see if I can send an Attachment on here - or will have to send it my private email - anyway, let me know if you can find time to peruse his Casualty Form (Army Form B. 103) and I'll figure out the best way to send it...

Thank you for your input.... much obliged

Lily

P.S. I think I've just seen something below which says something about Attachments... I should read the small print first, shouldn't I?

Andrew - hope you don't mind me butting in on this one.

Lily - as your grandfather's Service Record isn't on-line, I assume you have a copy of it to know the specific date of his wounding. If the date is correct, it seems he was wounded - in this case - by a stray bullet/shell etc, before the battle actually started.

Below is a copy of the specific time from the Unit History.

I'd suggest you get yourself a copy of this book - it's a very good read, especially for anyone interested in the 7th Battalion.

Cheers, Frev.

“Our Dear Old Battalion” – The Story of the 7th Battalion AIF, 1914-1919.

Ron Austin, Slouch Hat Publications, 2004

Chapter 14: Menin Road.

P.183

“The 7th Battalion remained at Bailleul during the first fortnight of September 1917, and training continued unabated, with conditions enhanced by a spell of lovely sunny weather.”

“On the afternoon of 14 September, the battalion moved up to the area known as Scottish Lines at Reninghelst, where it bivouacked for two days. Meanwhile, Lieutenant O’Connor and his Mining Platoon left their resting comrades, and made their way to the front-line where they were attached for mining tasks. While at Reninghelst, the troops appreciated an informal visit by General Birdwood, who rode through the camp on his horse, frequently stopping to chat to the Diggers. On the morning of 18 September, the battalion moved up to Chateau Segard, and on the next morning the unit, moving by platoons in file, with 100 metres between each platoon, arrived at Zillebeke Bund at 1.45pm, and took over dugouts just vacated by the 6th Battalion in readiness for the attack. Shortly after arriving at Zillebeke, Colonel Herrod called his company commanders together and gave them final details about the imminent attack, for which zero hour had been set at 5.40am on the next morning, 20 September 1917.

The fighting that occurred to the east of the shell-shattered Belgian town of Ypres during September and October 1917, is generally referred to as the Third Battle of Ypres, although the battle embraces the fighting which took place from 7 June through to 10 November and culminated in the capture of Passchendale.”

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