What did they eat in the trenches?

[daggers]

Just going back again to an earlier question of mine on this thread,

Does anyone have any knowledge of the discovery of corned beef which had either been burried or stored?

I am almost certain that it was from the Boer War, but the exact details I can’t remember, except for the fact that it was in reasonable condition for tins of Bully that had been hanging around for such a long time.

This find was probably sometime in the 60’s.

I cannot believe that I have the longest memory on this forum so I would love to hear of any information on this.

Thanks,

Tony

I Can't help on long-lost bully, but on the general theme I've just read "Twelve Days on the Somme" by Sidney Rogerson, an officer in the West Yorkshire Regiment, which is reviewed on another thread in this Forum.

Page 47 - "...I sat myself down to breakfast ... The difficulty of cooking without detection by the enemy, and the unpleasantness of the petrol-impregnated water led me to eschew tea. Instead, I made a hearty meal of 'Maconachie' - a tinned form of stew with meat and vegetables - eaten cold and washed down with a tea-cup full of rum."

Page 51/2 - "Not long afterwards the ration party arrived panting and sweating with their heavy loads of sandbags full of bread, bully, jam and biscuits, and petrol tins of water...two of their number hit on the way from Battalion headquarters and their loads lost in the darkness. Luckily that most prescious item of the day's rations -the half-jar of rum -had not been lost!"

Page 63 - "What miserable breakfasts we were compelled to during those four days! Bread, whiskery with strands of sand-bag, butter and a dollop of cold 'Maconochie' or bully beef, washed down, if we were lucky, with a half-cup of neat rum. Tea was even harder to go without than bacon, but it was impossible to light a fire during daylight without giving the enemy gunners a fresh target. Lunch, tea and dinner were repetitions of breakfast, except that at nightfall the old-soldier's ingenuity triumphed over circumstances."

The author then describes the ingenious use of whale oil, provided as a preventative against trench foot, and four-by-two to make a stove on which a mug of liquid could be heated, all built into the side of a trench. A later version was made out of a machine-gun belt box. Rogerson pays tribute to the efforts in getting rations delivered to Battalion HQ on a regular basis, but breakdowns in the supply chain were usually between HQ and the front line, where it could take hours to plough through mud for a few hundred yards.

He is also amazed that the common cold seldom if ever appeared in the trenches despite the ghastly conditions, so are we 21st century men all softies?

Daggers

[BeppoSapone]

Hi Beppo,

Many thanks for waking me up to the fact that you can get rose hip jam here in Holland.

I can’t even remember what it tastes like but these discussions have given me a craving and there is an Albert Heijn supermarket only a couple of hundred yards from where I live.

I’ll make a point of popping round this afternoon to see if they have any.

I hope that I don’t get addicted!

Cheers,

Tony

Was it any good?

[A.A.Savery]

Was it any good?

Not bad!

Quite sweet and smooth. The nearest flavour to it that I can think of is lemon.

Not expensive either.

It should put some ink in my pen!

Cheers,

Tony

[CarylW]

Tony, below is a small excerpt from my great uncle Grover Carter's diary. When I transcribed these passages I was very puzzled over the use of the word "roses". I posted on the forum for opinions but I'm still not sure whether he meant "roses" the flower or some kind of food. .......

June 30, 1918 – Not so much work as the epidemic has decreased. Very hot. Went in to Englebelmer and got roses & currents in pm

July 3, 1918 – Stayed about H.Q. all morning. Went to Englebelmer in p.m. & picked currents, roses & cherries.

Wondered if this could mean rose-hips (as I posted earlier) but I've come across a passage in "A Student In Arms - second series", where the Donald Hankey (who was later KIA) writes in the chapter "The Bad side of Military Life":

".....There is no water to wash in. Vermin abound, sleeping and eating accomodation are frankly disgusting. One is obliged for a time to live like a pig. Added to this one is all the time in a state of nervous tension. One gets very little sleep. Every night has it's anxieties and responsibilities Danger and death may come at any moment. So for a week, a fortnight, a month as the case may be. Then comes the return to billets, to comparative safety and comfort - the latter being nothing to boast about though! Tension is relaxed. There is an inevitable reaction. Officers and men alike determine to "gather rosebuds" while they may. Their bodies are fit, their wills are relaxed if they are built that way, and an opportunity offers, they will "satisfy the lusts of the flesh"...."

Ann I wonder if your ancestor wrote about "roses" in this way as a euphemism for just enjoying himself as above, or just having a good old time and non of the above, as Englebelmer was a billeting area

Not wishing to cast aspersions but who could blame them. Can't see them going to billets after time in the trenches and going off in the evening to pick roses, currants and cherries, so maybe more euphemisms, although, "cherries", hmmm but "currants" ???? Or maybe they were just picking roses, cherries and currants after living in trenches where nothing fresh would be growing, might have been just pleasurable outings to pick a few fresh things to eat and a few flowers

Did anyone else suggest any possible euphemisms in other posts?

Anyway just a thought (hope it doesn't offend)

Caryl

[A.A.Savery]

Hi Caryl,

I’ve been looking into this further but can’t quite see that this would fit in with Ann’s Great uncle, Grover Carter and his diary.

Donald Hankey (who was later KIA) writes in the chapter "The Bad side of Military Life":

Officers and men alike determine to "gather rosebuds" while they may. Their bodies are fit, their wills are relaxed if they are built that way, and an opportunity offers, they will "satisfy the lusts of the flesh"...."

Ann I wonder if your ancestor wrote about "roses" in this way as a euphemism for just enjoying himself as above, or just having a good old time and non of the above, as Englebelmer was a billeting area

Not wishing to cast aspersions but who could blame them. Can't see them going to billets after time in the trenches and going off in the evening to pick roses, currants and cherries, so maybe more euphemisms, although, "cherries", hmmm but "currants" ???? Or maybe they were just picking roses, cherries and currants after living in trenches where nothing fresh would be growing, might have been just pleasurable outings to pick a few fresh things to eat and a few flowers

Did anyone else suggest any possible euphemisms in other posts?

Anyway just a thought (hope it doesn't offend)

Caryl

Tony, below is a small excerpt from my great uncle Grover Carter's diary. When I transcribed these passages I was very puzzled over the use of the word "roses". I posted on the forum for opinions but I'm still not sure whether he meant "roses" the flower or some kind of food. July 3, 1918 – Stayed about H.Q. all morning. Went to Englebelmer in p.m. & picked currents, roses & cherries.

In the context of these words I can only take it to mean ‘rosehips’

Funnily enough though, another of Tommy’s Pack Fillers is, “Roses” lime juice cordial.

http://www.tommyspackfillers.com/showitem.asp?itemRef=RL037

Never the less, I still find ‘rosehips’ the more logical choice.

It was worth looking into the other options though.

Cheers,

Tony

[Tony Lund]

Feb 27th 1915.

Lance Corporal J. E. Hobson DCM of Netherthong, wrote home saying he was billeted with five other Royal Army Medical Corps men in an old farmhouse during a period of cold, wet weather that was making things difficult. He continued:

“We are close up to the firing line and as I am writing these few lines, the guns are booming away, but we are quite used to that now. I must say we are living very well, plenty to eat. We had a jam roll for dinner the other day, and the only fault about it was the cook wrapped it in the towel that we wipe the patients feet with, but he said he washed it well before he cooked the pudding. Of course we could not answer for the truth of that, but anyway it went down alright; those little trifles don’t amount to much out at the Front!”

Tony.

[frev]

Some culinary snippets from Aussie soldier’s letters:

Gallipoli:

“We are having a little rest at present, camped in dug-outs just in the rear of the firing line. We will be excellent cooks by the time we get away from here. We have to cook our own breakfast and tea, which consists of porridge and cheese or bacon. The cooks provide tea twice a day, and hot stew for dinner. We powder up biscuits to make porridge, fry the cheese, and then fry biscuits in the bacon fat. Some make puddings from biscuits. It depends a good deal on which they borrow from the stacks of goods on the beach. (They don’t steal them, only borrow.)”

Western Front:

“The army authorities are looking after us well. Plenty of clothes (gloves, leather waistcoats, socks etc), and plenty of food. Though of a necessity ‘bully beef’ must predominate, still in the hands of our marvelous cooks miracles are wrought. The chief trouble is the absence of fresh fruit and vegetables.”

Bapaume after the German evacuation:

“We had a fairly good time at this place, for we found carrots, parsnips, and young onions in a garden, and as we had several packets of pea soup powder we made some fine bully-beef stews.”

“Our posy is usually reasonably comfortable and safe place – it is often one of Fritz’s ‘pill boxes’……………….. An improvised fireplace is usually set up and it is very much appreciated for cooking and keeping the home cheery and bright. Where the shell fire is not too severe we are often able to gather turnips, spuds and other roots to keep the larder well stocked. Our water is taken from the surrounding shell craters, which of course has to be carefully selected owing to the effects of the poisonous gas and putrid substances lying about.”

“We miss our hot meals and tea very much. Our food has to be brought to us under cover of darkness, and you may guess it is not too warm after being carried several miles.”

“Never did a parcel come in a more opportune time. We had just had a grueling time of it, and the things in the parcel fairly revived us. My two mates and I smoked the cigars (King George V), and they were ‘Tres Bon’, and we ate the lollies to further orders.”

“Have just received more letters, also three parcels, and the contents were just the thing. The butter was much too rich for soldiers, but we soon made short work of it.

“The people follow up as the war progresses, and even within a mile or two of the firing line you have them with their shops, principally ‘estaminets’ (where the chief and only item on the menu is egg, chips and coffee) and also fancy goods shops selling souvenirs”

“The boys saw hard times during this stunt, and never tasted food or water for two days, and we never had a wink of sleep during the whole period.”

And in reference to ‘cherries’:

“France is a great place for cherries, but I have never seen such trees as they are here, all being from 40 to 50 feet high.”

Cheers, Frev.

[A.A.Savery]

Feb 27th 1915.

Lance Corporal J. E. Hobson DCM of Netherthong, wrote home saying he was billeted with five other Royal Army Medical Corps men in an old farmhouse during a period of cold, wet weather that was making things difficult. He continued:

“We are close up to the firing line and as I am writing these few lines, the guns are booming away, but we are quite used to that now. I must say we are living very well, plenty to eat. We had a jam roll for dinner the other day, and the only fault about it was the cook wrapped it in the towel that we wipe the patients feet with, but he said he washed it well before he cooked the pudding. Of course we could not answer for the truth of that, but anyway it went down alright; those little trifles don’t amount to much out at the Front!”

Tony.

I love that story Tony.

I suppose that any germs crawling around in that towel were completely killed off by the steam and it might have even given the pudding a little more flavour.

Cheers,

Tony

[Soren]

Curry

[CarylW]

Our water is taken from the surrounding shell craters, which of course has to be carefully selected owing to the effects of the poisonous gas and putrid substances lying about

The very thought of it Frev!! Horrendous isn't it

Remember reading references to hot tea being sent down the line in old petrol cans and the tea tasted of petrol

Caryl

[A.A.Savery]

Hi Frev,

Many thanks for that excellent insight into eating habits of soldiers in the trenches.

Some of it even reminds me of myself when I am camping.

Tony

[demgbr]

Just going back again to an earlier question of mine on this thread,

Does anyone have any knowledge of the discovery of corned beef which had either been burried or stored?

I am almost certain that it was from the Boer War, but the exact details I can’t remember, except for the fact that it was in reasonable condition for tins of Bully that had been hanging around for such a long time.

This find was probably sometime in the 60’s.

I cannot believe that I have the longest memory on this forum so I would love to hear of any information on this.

Thanks,

Tony

My father told me that towards the end of the war there was so much bully beef behind the lines that they used tins of it to fill in the pot-holes. Some of these could still be awaiting discovery. I'm surprised that no mention has been made of a delicacy popular with the troops. Tins of pork & beans. These were baked beans as we know them but with a small cube of pork fat in each tin. These were still available after WW2.

[NedRutland]

Tony, below is a small excerpt from my great uncle Grover Carter's diary. When I transcribed these passages I was very puzzled over the use of the word "roses". I posted on the forum for opinions but I'm still not sure whether he meant "roses" the flower or some kind of food. Anyway, thought you might enjoy reading the entries.

Ann

June 28-29, 1918 – Nothing unusual except I am feeling bum. Very hot day. About 10 p.m. (29th) was bombarded with gas. We went to our dugouts. Got very little [gas].

June 30, 1918 – Not so much work as the epidemic has decreased. Very hot. Went in to Englebelmer and got roses & currents in p.m.

July 1, 1918 – Hottest day of year. Few sick & don’t have to ride to wagon lines.

July 2, 1918 – Very little to do. Had letters from home but none from Louise.

July 3, 1918 – Stayed about H.Q. all morning. Went to Englebelmer in p.m. & picked currents, roses & cherries.

I would take the reference in Grover Carter's diary to "roses" literally - the flowers. In the midst of all that drabness and suffering why would they not appreciate a little colour and beauty as a reminder of better times?

For example here is a quote from my grandfather’s letters home from the Western Front (Lt J.W. Bennett, XIIth Lancers)

“The day before I came down from the line, we were in reserve or support a little way behind first line. I went to what must have once been a very nice little village but now a heap of ruins & in the gardens gathered a few strawberries & plenty of gooseberries, which I took back & had them stewed. We ate them with custard & they were delicious. The roses & other flowers are still growing strong in many of the gardens & we always had some in our dugout, using shell cases as vases.”

June 1917 (between 9th & 22nd)

"Ned"

[auchonvillerssomme]

Bovril chocolate was chocolate, manufactured by Bovril.

Mick

[NedRutland]

And, while I am at it, here is a recipe from Gallipoli (where he served as an OR in the Norfolk Yeomanry)

“ …. I am feeling most awfully filthy; have not washed for several days nor shaved. This morning I did some cooking. I generally make an Anzac pudding or rather cake about every other day. What with making up the fire etc. it is not a very clean job. The cakes are made by beating biscuits up into a fine meal, mixing it with a little water into a dough with a little grease, it sometimes has to be bacon fat, then a little jam, raisins if possible, put it in the lid of a dixie, well greased, & fry or bake whatever you like to call it, for ½ an hour. Not so bad really, altho’ I have had much better. …. "

8th December 1915

[BeppoSapone]

Bovril chocolate was chocolate, manufactured by Bovril.

Mick

The 'blurb' clearly says Bovril flavoured chocolate.

"Early type wrapper for the "Bovril" flavoured chocolate produced by Bovril Ltd.(London) Ideal as a gift for those on "Active Service"."

[zooloo]

My father told me that towards the end of the war there was so much bully beef behind the lines that they used tins of it to fill in the pot-holes. Some of these could still be awaiting discovery. I'm surprised that no mention has been made of a delicacy popular with the troops. Tins of pork & beans. These were baked beans as we know them but with a small cube of pork fat in each tin. These were still available after WW2.

IRC up to WW2 Heinz had a bit of pork (or pork fat?) in their tins of baked beans.

They stopped doing it during WW2 and didn't reintroduce the pig bits again afterwards

[auchonvillerssomme]

The 'blurb' clearly says Bovril flavoured chocolate.

"Early type wrapper for the "Bovril" flavoured chocolate produced by Bovril Ltd.(London) Ideal as a gift for those on "Active Service"."

It was something that sprang me off on a tangent when I was completeing my Post Graduate Diploma in Addiction Studies a while back.

'The first “eating chocolate” was marketed by the Fry family in 1849 at a trade fair in Birmingham and was an immediate success. Not to be outdone Cadbury’s introduced the first box of individual chocolates followed by a Valentine’s Day presentation box. Other companies, such as Bovril, began producing eating chocolate and the new confectionery was firmly established'

Mick

[BeppoSapone]

'The first “eating chocolate” was marketed by the Fry family in 1849 at a trade fair in Birmingham and was an immediate success. Not to be outdone Cadbury’s introduced the first box of individual chocolates followed by a Valentine’s Day presentation box. Other companies, such as Bovril, began producing eating chocolate and the new confectionery was firmly established'

Mick

I suppose they experimented a bit? The Mexicans still use chocolate to make a sauce for turkey etc

In the past few years I have myself had chocolate with a hot chilli pepper on top of the slab. Made in Staffordshire, not Tijuana.

Mind you, I would draw the line before Bovril

[Graham Smith]

My GF talked quite a bit about eating tins of jam which were refered to as 'pozzy' (sp?)

Quite good he said for assisting the digestion if you had an unexplained stoppage

On one march he said that many latrines had been built along the roadside. He had a stoppage at the time and after helping himself to copious amounts of pozzy he reported that he managed to visit most of the latrines en-route

[keithfazzani]

Our water is taken from the surrounding shell craters, which of course has to be carefully selected owing to the effects of the poisonous gas and putrid substances lying about

Not quite the same but I well remember as a teenager after a long walk on the Scottish moors taking a drink from a "sparkling stream" only to find several yards up stream a dead sheep lying in the water!

[truthergw]

Not quite the same but I well remember as a teenager after a long walk on the Scottish moors taking a drink from a "sparkling stream" only to find several yards up stream a dead sheep lying in the water!

Ah! Mutton broth, full of vitamins.

[dycer]

Slightly away from the trenches but you may enjoy this.It is from a Pamphlet entitled "Humorists at War" by George Findlay.

"Of course we knew by all these preparations we were soon to be "for it" and it occasioned no surprise when we were called out of bed at one a.m. and,after the usual lot of preliminaries,were marched down to Plymouth town in the darkness of morning.

We had been issued with,among other things,a full day's rations,one item of which was a slab of pork.The pig must have died from fatty degeneration,for,as far as we could see,it did not contain a single streak of lean.

We got down to the station where we found a troop train to Southampton where we were run down to the quay and spent most of the next day in goods sheds,for we were not embarking until dark.

The field kitchens were lit and we had a most delicious stew so our emergency rations were not drawn out.

I remember looking into my knapsack and viewing my slab of pork.Railway travelling,and using the knapsack for a pillow had not improved it.I would have thrown it away there and then but one never knew what sort of inspection might be asked for next so I returned it to my knapsack consoling myself that if it sweated much longer,there would not be much to carry.

Ultimately we embarked and were marched down through the hatches to the holds below which were lit with a few dim,evil-smelling lamps.Soon the roll of the vessel and the clanging of chains informed us we were off to "La Belle France".

I had to thank my stars I was a good sailor as the ship certainly rolled a bit.It was not belong before pale faces under the ghastly light of the oil lamps showed all was not well with the troops and it was not long before I saw fellows whom I had considered to have nothing in them,prove my judgement to have been ill founded.I walked among them and,with my slab of pork stuck on the end of my knife,adjured them to get this into them,it would do them good.It only served to hasten border-line cases,while others scowled at me and gave such baleful glances that it was quite evident to me that my kindly meant ministrations were being misconstrued."

George

[Eirian]

Just saw this post and can add a few mentions of food from a letter sent home by Charles Edward White, when stationed in Northern Italy, dated 5/2/18, which suggests the men were able to buy things in local markets:

". . . we are buying eggs at 2d each, according to the English value of this money, and apples [beauties?] for about 4d or 5d a pound."

I not entirely sure about the word after apples - any ideas?

and later

"We have had some very sour bread since coming to Italy . . . "

and after he signs off . . .

"P.S. Please do not send me parcels as I think we must be doing better for food than you."

Eirian