Rog123 Posted 5 January , 2003 Share Posted 5 January , 2003 Hello, does anyone know the number of troops that were based in Britain throughtout WWI.I understand that at the beginning of 1918 there were some 1.5 million troops still based in britain. I assume that at least a million troops (in administrative,garrison,training roles etc etc) would have never left the shores of Britain.Does anyone know whether this is a correct assumption. Given that total enlistments into the british army was something like 4.9 million , and the BEF at it's peak numbered appox 2 million(not including dominion,commonwealth trops etc), then after casualties, there must still ahve been a good number of troops who did not leave Briatain?? Anyway thanks for any info on this. Regards. Ron Brown P.s I would also be interested if anyone knows approximately what percentage of the british army would have been aged 40 +? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim_davies Posted 5 January , 2003 Share Posted 5 January , 2003 Ron, Can't help you too much but found the following numbers in Middlebrook's "Kaiser's Battle". War Office returns for Jan 1, 1918 showing 38,255 officers and 607,403 men in England, fit, trianed and ready for immediate transfer to F & F. Then there would be all the admin, training, leave etc men on UK garrison strengths in addition. Another avenue for you to examine might be the numebrs of men awarded certain medals. i think that those who didn't serve in a war theatre were not eligable for all the medals. Hopefully one of the experts might be able to point you in the right direction. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin Posted 5 January , 2003 Share Posted 5 January , 2003 Ron I have at hand some infomation that might help? U.K Troops raised 5,704,416 U.K Troops sent overseas at 5,000,000 Leaving 704,416 on British soil, hope this is of interest. This does not include troops from the Commonwealth. Regards Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog123 Posted 6 January , 2003 Author Share Posted 6 January , 2003 Hello Kevin, thanks for your reply. I think your UK numbers (5,700,000) given must include commonwealth troops i.e from Canada,Australia,New Zealand etc.The number of enlistments in Britain(as far as I understand)did not exceed 4.9 million troops(England,Scotland Wales,Ireland), but there were another million from the commonwealth which would tally with your figure.!? Given that most British troops from Britain sent over seas went to France,a nd that the greatest strength in british troops reached in France was approx 1.7 million, then even after allowing for casualties, it seems hard to see how 5 million British ( not British and commonwealth)troos could have gone overseas?I may be wrong though! Regards and thanks for any further information. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AOK4 Posted 6 January , 2003 Share Posted 6 January , 2003 Hello Ron, all those troops aren't raised in one moment, it's over 4 years. There is a steady amount of casualties: dead, wounded or prisoner. Besides that, you also have a certain amount of soldiers on leave. So there is a constant flow of soldiers from the UK to the front (F&F, Near East, Africa, etc) and from the front to "losses" (dead & prisoner) and to the UK. I guess that a maximum of 1,700,000 soldiers in F&F on one moment is quite a lot if you take all this in consideration. Jan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AOK4 Posted 6 January , 2003 Share Posted 6 January , 2003 For a matter of comparison, the German numbers: Total number of soldiers 1914-1918: 13.387.000 September 1916: 8.2 million soldiers of which 5.3 million "im Feldheer" (in the army in the field) and 2.7 million in Germany. 3.4 million were in the West, 0.7 million in Russia, 1 million in the occupied territories (not Russia) and 0.2 million in other theatres of war. In March 1918 there were 4.8 million German soldiers (Feldheer) of which 139,826 officers and 3,514,889 other ranks were in the West. In the East there were 38,400 officers and about 1 million other ranks. (Source: Riebicke, Otto. Was brauchte der Weltkrieg?) Jan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul guthrie Posted 6 January , 2003 Share Posted 6 January , 2003 John Terraine has a lot to say about this in his Haig biography. It has to do with the controversey between Haig and the PM and fault for the great retreat in spring 1918. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin Posted 6 January , 2003 Share Posted 6 January , 2003 Ron The infomation i have at hand states:- Canada raised 628,964 of416,809 served overseas Australia raised 416,809 of 343,250 served overseas New Zealand raised 105,629 of 97,822 served overseas South Africa raised 228,907 of 228,907 served overseas(92,387 coloured troops used for labour and Transport) Newfoundland raised 11,922 of 11,922 served overseas India raised 1,401,350 of 953,374 served overseas. Regards Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog123 Posted 6 January , 2003 Author Share Posted 6 January , 2003 Hello Kevin, Thanks once again for the reply. Excuse me if I am being a bit vague on this, but if only 4.9 million British (not empire,dominion,commonwealth)troops enlisted into the british army between 1914-18, then how can 5 million have served overseas?I am sure that not all these 4.9 milliontroops did not serve overseas!!? Given that the bulk of British troops(England,Scotland,Wales) and those from Ireland served in France and that at it's peak strength in France and Flanders the British army was 1.7 million, then given total British army casualties in all theatres of approx 743 ,000 (fatal) and c 2million wounded,(a high percenatge of the wounded still capable of performing either front line or line of communication, labouring behind line duties etc, then the most that seems likely to have gone overseas from Britain's shores would surely be been nearer 4 million at most. How many troops were serving in other theatres.I believe that a sizeable number of troops serving in Mesapotamia for example were Indian? Thanks for any more info. Regards Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry_Reeves Posted 6 January , 2003 Share Posted 6 January , 2003 I can't help with the total number of men who served but it is difficult to use the number of casualties in the calculation. A number of those who were fatalities, would have also been wounded before their demise and these were also counted in the number of wounded. Similarly, many men were wounded more than once, and each wound counted as a casualty statistic. Terry Reeves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin Posted 6 January , 2003 Share Posted 6 January , 2003 Ron just afoot note to this(because i am just giving text that i have taken from various sources). Total causualties received by the entire British forces during WW1,both received in battle and other wise totaled 11,096,338, of this total 82% of the wounded and 92% of the sick and injured were returned to duty,of the wounded 64% again returned to the front line. I have the infomation for troops still in the field on the 11/11/1918(France) other than the U.K if anyone has this could there please post it. Regards Kevin. PS, The numbers we are talking about where posted far and wide and not just F&F. Regards again Kevin Just had alook at Chris,s site and the facts and figs are on there so i will sign off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog123 Posted 7 January , 2003 Author Share Posted 7 January , 2003 Hello Kevin, Many thanks for your replies.Do you have Chris site url by any chance? Regards Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 7 January , 2003 Share Posted 7 January , 2003 It's the www.1914-1918.net parent to this forum, and a link appears below my signature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhill Posted 8 January , 2003 Share Posted 8 January , 2003 Some Canadian numbers may or may not provide some insight. At the end of 1916 the Canadian Expeditionary Force numbered 135,220 all ranks in the United Kingdom, compared with 108,176 on the continent. Considering that much of the initial recruitment and administrative functions were in Canada, this seems strange (as it did at the time). The overseas administration for the first couple of years of the war was badly organised, and it was not until the end of 1916 that the political and administrative mess started to get sorted out. (This was a process roughly parallel to the replacement of the Asquith administration in the UK with the LLoyd George administration). However, part of the UK establishment was the Canadian 5th Division. The War Office kept pressuring to have this sent to France, but Ottawa wanted it used for reinforcement. It was eventually assigned to the Home Defence of the UK. Its artillery and engineers went to France, but the infantry stayed on guard in England until it was broken up in 1918. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Sweeney Posted 8 January , 2003 Share Posted 8 January , 2003 Ron, You need to get the book " Statistics of the Military Effort of the British Empire During the Geart War" 1922 (reprinted in 1999). This has most if not all you want by month, by Corps, by location,by medical category to include breakdowns between Terrtorial Force and Regulars, including the Volunteer strength and Nursing services. Is there any particular info you want as the document is 880 pages? Cost of this book is £85 so you might want to try Library loan. Joe Sweeney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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