Artists Rifles

[Chris]

Hi All.

Having established in a previous topic the identity of my great grandfather and that he served in the Artists Rifles (1/28th Londons) from Aug 1914 until late 1915, i set about using the Long Long Trail and other sources to establish where he was in this time span and where he may have seen action. I gather they went to France on 28th Oct 1914, attached to the 2nd London Division. It is here i become confused (i know it dosent take much). As they were not part of 4th, 5th and 6th London Brigades, who formed 2nd London Division, but only attached what does this mean? And what happened to them after this and before they became an officer training Bn. Did they see front line service and if so where?

Regards

Chris

[Geoff Parker]

Chris

My understanding is that 1/28th Bn were ARMY troops attached to

2nd London Div (later to become 47th Div). This Division did not

leave UK for France until March 1915. 1/28th would have moved to

France in October 1914 as an independant unit.

I suspect someone else will give you the full SP, but I will have a look

over the weekend and try and find their movements once they arrived

in France

Geoff

[Malcolm]

1/28th London (Artists Rifles ) were with 2nd Division from August 1914 to October 1914 when they moved to the Officers Training Corps at Bailleul moving to St Omer in April 1915. . Providing Officers for the new army.

The cadre left were then reinforced and reconstituted and sent to 190th Brigade in the 63rd RN Division on 29th June 1917 where they were until 11th Nov 1918. Not sure how many ' Artists ' were in the reinforcements!

They would have been involved with:

Second Battle of Passchendaele. 26 Oct-10 Nov 1917.

Action of Welsh Ridge. 30 Dec 1917.

Battle of St. Quentin. 21-23 Mar 1918.

First Battle of Bapaume. 24-25 Mar 1918.

Battle of the Ancre. 5 Apr 1918.

Battle of Albert. 21-23 Aug 1918, including the capture of Chuignes.

Battle of Drocourt-Queant. 2-3 Sep 1918.

Battle of the Canal du Nord. 27 Sep-1 Oct 1918, including the capture of Bourlon Wood.

Battle of Cambrai. 8-9 Oct 1918, including the capture of Villers Outreaux and Cambrai.

Passage of the Grande Honelle. 5-7 Nov 1918.

Aye

Malcolm

[Tom Morgan]

To add to Geoff's details, "British Regiments 1914-1918" by Brig. E. A. James says that The Artists Rifles landed in France on 28th October, 1914 and became an Officer Training Corps at Bailleul. In April, 1915 they moved to St. Omer, still with the same role.

On 28th June, 1917 they were transferred to 190th Brigade, 63rd (Royal Naval) Division and stayed with this Division to the end of the war.

Tom

Sorry for duplicating some of your info Malcolm - we must have both been typing our replies at the same time.

Edited 21 November , 2003 by Tom Morgan

[Chris]

Thank you ever so much Tom, Malcolm and Geoff, as that info has now stopped the confusion that had set in. I have grasped it now, so thank you very much. I don't suppose there is a way/book/website or any source of that would tell which ship transported them to France on 28th Oct 1914, is there?

Once again thankyuo very much for the clarification.

Chris

[Malcolm]

Sorry for duplicating some of your info Malcolm - we must have both been typing our replies at the same time.

Well Tom, not sure whether it's great minds or fools. Lets go for the former!

Aye

Malcolm

[Annette Burgoyne]

Hi Chris

Here is a little bit of info. from 1st K.S.L.I. War Diary.

2 companies The Artists Rifles were attached for instruction on 3.12.14, while in trenches east of La Flamingerie Farm, Armentieres sector. And on 8.12.14 three platoons of the K.S.L.I. are relieved from the line by Artists Rifles. The whole of the K.S.L.I. were relieved next day by the Buffs. I presume the other platoons of Artists were attached to other 6th Division units. The trenches in this sector at this time were in very bad due to the wet weather and shell fire.

Regards

Annette

[Paul Reed]

1/28th London (Artists Rifles ) were with 2nd Division from August 1914 to October 1914 when they moved to the Officers Training Corps at Bailleul moving to St Omer in April 1915. .

The 1/28th may have been attached to 2nd Division on paper, but they did not serve with them. They were 'Lines of Communication' troops when they first went overseas in 1914, and only detachments were sent off for training. They did not serve in the line as an active unit.

The regimental history gives a little bit more detail about this period, as do the Artist Rifles Gazettes, copies of which may be in the IWM, or with the regimental museum, which I think is still at Chelsea?

[Ken Lees]

I don't suppose there is a way/book/website or any source of that would tell which ship transported them to France on 28th Oct 1914, is there?

Chris,

From Ray Westlake's 'British Battalions in France & Belgium 1914':

26th (October 1914) Left Division and to Southampton. Embarked 'SS Australind' and sailed for France (27th). Arrived Boulogne (28th) and entrained for St. Omer. Occupied French Army Barracks, moving to billets at Helfault (29th).

Hope that helps,

Ken

[Chris]

Thank you to PAul, Ken and Annette for all the additional info.

Chris

[Malcolm]

A book you might find of use is ' War is War ' The Artists Rifles by Ex-private X from the Naval and Military Press, cat No 7061 £ 11.50

unless you already have it.......

Aye

Malcolm

[David Filsell]

Was he commissioned? In 1914 a number of ORs were immediately commissioned to make up for officer losses at Ist Ypres on the express order of French. Their success led to the London based bn (3rd) becoming effectively an OTU (later renumbered 2nd bn)