Fred W Posted 2 December , 2006 Share Posted 2 December , 2006 As far as I can make out the Middlesex Regiment were the first to land in France arriving at Havre on the 11th Aug 1914. Did any regiment arrive before them? Fred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil1821 Posted 3 December , 2006 Share Posted 3 December , 2006 2nd Royal Welsh Fusiliers were I think on the same date. Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 3 December , 2006 Share Posted 3 December , 2006 ... and the reason is ... they were both 19th Brigade, whose job it was to secure the lines of communication so that the rest of the BEF could proceed to the area of assembly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldstreamer Posted 3 December , 2006 Share Posted 3 December , 2006 Didnt the germans get there first ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred W Posted 3 December , 2006 Author Share Posted 3 December , 2006 Didnt the germans get there first ? Had they got through Belgium by the 11 Aug? Fred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred W Posted 3 December , 2006 Author Share Posted 3 December , 2006 2nd Royal Welsh Fusiliers were I think on the same date. Neil Arrived Rouen on the 11th. Now we have to find the time of arrival of both the Middlesex and the RWF. Fred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 3 December , 2006 Share Posted 3 December , 2006 No. 2nd RWF did not complete until 13th: A,B and HQ arrived 11th, C and D coys arrived 13th. RWF have never claimed to be first, just the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 3 December , 2006 Share Posted 3 December , 2006 just the best ... until the 7th Division arrived! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GnrEaton Posted 3 December , 2006 Share Posted 3 December , 2006 Don't know if this helps or muddys the waters but I have an MIC to a Northumberland Fusilier man who says that he got there on the 8th August! Can this be right? Incidently he did survive and if you look closely you can see that he served in about 5 other regiments before the end of the war. Dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 3 December , 2006 Share Posted 3 December , 2006 I have no doubt that the British had some soldiers in F&F during the build up .... after all, the war had been declared 4th Aug. They would either have been officers, or attached to officers. Having said that, some strange dates are indeed to be found. For example, there are a slack handful of 2nd RWF [mostly but not entirely officers and SNCOs] who have some dodgy dates around 11th to 13th August. Mistakes happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GnrEaton Posted 3 December , 2006 Share Posted 3 December , 2006 Apologies on my part - having just (for the very first time) noticed the campaign note in the top LH corner I can see the '5'. Assuming that is theatre of war then that would indicate Mesopotamia or India. The 2nd North Fus. were in India at that time. My apologies for being dim and confusing the issue - I thought it might be of some use. Impressive number of regiments nevertheless, and to surviv the lot as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonraker Posted 3 December , 2006 Share Posted 3 December , 2006 The Legion of Frontiersmen was a self governing military organisation which had been in existence since 1904, with branches throughout the Empire and British Isles. On July 24 1914 King Albert of the Belgians asked for volunteers to join the Belgian Army and when 30 Frontiersmen of the Manchester `H' Squadron volunteered, the King made them his bodyguard. The next day they were in Ostend, wearing full Legion uniform. They were the first British troops to engage the enemy. Before the British Army taking the field, the Legion with its "parent" body, the 3rd Belgian Lancers, fought bravely and well and when Britain declared war `H' Troop were paraded by King Albert who gave them the singular honour of wearing his country's colours. He decorated every man with the Medaille de l'Yser, Captain Nowell was awarded the Order of the Chevalier of the Crown and Frontiersman Reading the Order of Leopold. They returned to England to a great welcome, paraded at the Cenotaph and were inspected by the Prince of Wales before joining the British Forces in 1915. With acknowledgments to Jacky Platteeuw, who posted this information on the Forum in 2002. Moonraker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LF Historian Posted 9 December , 2006 Share Posted 9 December , 2006 Moonraker- Well said Lad! Just to back up your statement see att. jpg Regards LF Historian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snavek Posted 9 December , 2006 Share Posted 9 December , 2006 I'm not sure how Hammerton sits with Historian but I've just started to read his 'Popular History of the Great War'. He says the B.E.F. began embarkation on 6th August and completed (that phase) on 16th August. He suggests that 'a handful of that splendid Scottish regiment, the Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders' were the first to be seen in Boulogne. For two weeks they were quartered in the old barracks behind the post office. None knew that they had landed until they came swinging along the road past the tidal dock and the Central railway station, over the bridge and lock gate opened by Napoleon III, and round the little square to the barracks, khaki-clad, and kilted, with knees bare and pipes skirling'. Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred W Posted 9 December , 2006 Author Share Posted 9 December , 2006 Keith, My info says that A and B Companies of the 2nd Bn Argyles landed at Bolougne at 9am on the 11th, so may be they were the first to arrive. Fred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 11 October , 2015 Share Posted 11 October , 2015 No. 2nd RWF did not complete until 13th: A,B and HQ arrived 11th, C and D coys arrived 13th. RWF have never claimed to be first, just the best. Stumbled on this old thread. I think 2nd Bn RWF could have claim to be the first complete infantry battalion to arrive in France. The 1st Bn Midlesex did not arrive until 14th Aug and D Coy of the 2nd Bn Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders did not disembark until 15:00 on the 14th. I believe the 2nd Bn RWF were complete with all four Companies and HQ on 13th. MGs Edit. My mistake. I was confusing 1st Bn with 4th Bn Middlesex. 1st Bn arrived on 11th and 12th and its history claims to have been the first battalion to deploy overseas. MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prussian Posted 11 October , 2015 Share Posted 11 October , 2015 Hello!The german recordings mentioned: GHQ crossing the channel august 13, reached Le Cateau august, 16. 1.Div. rallied at Aldershot and crossed the channel august, 13 at Le Havre. August 15 one Brigade each near Le Nouvion, Boué and Massigny 2.Div. rallied at Southampton. 4th and 6th brigade reached Le Havre august,13, 5th brigade august, 14 in Boulogne. Rallying pof the division near Mennevret 3.Div. rallied at Southampton. Two brigades at Boulogne, two brigades at Le Havre. Rallying at Landrecies 5.Div. rallied with two brigades in Dublin and two brigades in belfast. august 15 and 16 Le Cateau and Landrecies. So, our recording said, the first british troops came to France at august, 13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khaki Posted 11 October , 2015 Share Posted 11 October , 2015 I read somewhere that the first unit in France were elements of a Yeomanry? regiment, Lincolnshire?? I remember thinking at the time 'I have that cap badge', wish I could find the reference, sorry. khaki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Clifton Posted 12 October , 2015 Share Posted 12 October , 2015 Unlikely to be Yeomanry, but both North and South Irish Horse (Special Reserve) had squadrons with GHQ Troops. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 12 October , 2015 Share Posted 12 October , 2015 The 1914 Star Medal roll of Officers shows an Int Corps Officer allegedly disembarking on 27th July 1914. This is the earliest I have found and if substantiated would suggest that some Officers (and probably some ORs as well) were sent over during the Precautionary Period. There is always the possibly that it is a typo on the original, but that aside there are four others with disembarkation dates of 4th Aug 1914 and more on 5th Aug 1914. Mostly Int Corps, RE Railway Transport Establishment of Staff Officers with No.2 Base. For Battalion sized units it is difficult to see any unit arriving before the 1st Bn Middlesex Regt. on 11th-12th shortly followed by the rest of 19th Inf Bde. None of the Yeomanry claim to have been the first to disembark to my knowledge. It would seem unlikely a TF unit would be at the vanguard given they would have the logistical hurdle of signing the Overseas Service Obligation as well as requisitioning horses etc.MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 12 October , 2015 Share Posted 12 October , 2015 I think it is generally accepted that 1 Middx were the first followed by 2 RWF. In most cases there would probably have been a small advance party where feasible. There is not a cat in hells chance that a Territorial unit arrived before regulars. The very thought of it makes me shudder! The only reason that the Frontiersmen got out to mainland europe first is because they were not subject to the same chain-of-command, or under statutory political control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 12 October , 2015 Share Posted 12 October , 2015 Some evidence on the TF's later arrival. Buried deep in the WO 114 files are a few pages with a list of TF units.their disembarkation dates and the units that replaced them. There are three pages. This part covers the Yeomanry. Note the Essex Yeo (handwritten in blue) arrived on 1st Dec 1914. Relatively speaking the earliest Yeomanry Regiment arrived nearly a month after the Regulars. If the 1914 Star medal Roll is any guide, the 2nd Dragoon Guards (Queen's Bays) and 18th (PMO) Hussars were the first Cavalry Regiments to disembark as whole units on 15th Aug 1914. The earliest disembarkation for any Cavalry Officer I can find is Spears of 11th Hussars who arrived on 5th Aug and was detached from his regiment to operate as a liaison Officer with the French, something arranged prior to the outbreak of the war. MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 12 October , 2015 Share Posted 12 October , 2015 Very interesting post Martin. Quite poignant to see a SECRET document of that nature all these years later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 12 October , 2015 Share Posted 12 October , 2015 The only reason that the Frontiersmen got out to mainland europe first is because they were not subject to the same chain-of-command, or under statutory political control. Presumably the Frontiersmen were not part of the Army and were considered civilians. In the same way that the UVF was an armed civilian body not recognised by the War Office in Aug 1914. The 25th Bn Royal Fusiliers was not formed until Feb 1915, so prior to this date I assume they were civilians (albeit armed to the teeth) in the eyes of the law. MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 12 October , 2015 Share Posted 12 October , 2015 Presumably the Frontiersmen were not part of the Army and were considered civilians. In the same way that the UVF was an armed civilian body not recognised by the War Office in Aug 1914. The 25th Bn Royal Fusiliers was not formed until Feb 1915, so prior to this date I assume they were civilians (albeit armed to the teeth) in the eyes of the law. MG Yes, I am sure that is correct. The Frontiersmen had some friends in high places who could influence matters and cleverly used the press to prepare the ground. We would say today that they had good 'PR'. It suited the press to print the byline that a bunch of civilian amateurs could mobilise to a seat of war more quickly and efficiently than the government of the day's armed forces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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