Did soldiers have to make a will?

[l.harding]

Does anyone know whether soldiers were asked to make a will when they joined up and, if so, whether these were deposited in the UK in the normal way? I was wondering whether a will for one of the soldiers would be accessible here in the same way as other wills.

Lesley Harding

[PBI]

I believe that there was practice for Most of the PBI to write their wills in the backs of their Paybooks.

[Tom Morgan]

PBI is right and in memoirs I have read, completing the will form in the paybook was part of the final flurry of activity before leaving the UK on Active Service Overseas.

Tom

[Black Watch]

Part of E-Mail I received from Amanda Moreno of Royal Irish Fusiliers Museum

The report of his death came from a casualty report dated 13 April 1917 by the Officer Commanding B Company. A copy of his will is on the reverse of this form which was copied from his Army Book 64.

In the event of my death I give the whole of my property and effects to my sister Miss M Fraser 46 Gray St, Lochee by Dundee. Signed by James Fraser on 9 June 1916. It is certified a true copy on 15th June 1917.

Luckily for me he left his effects to my Grandmother which is how they ended up with me.

Neil

[kissack]

and more formally (?) in Canada

http://www.kissack.co.uk/index.php?page=medal-card-will

[jamesmcdonald]

I have a copy of an Army form which is headed "WILL" in the stuff I got about my grandfather.

Army form 5664 or6664, it is hard to read it, but it has my grandfather's name, number, regiment on it, but nothing about leaving effects. The copy is from microfilm, so it won't scan properly. it is a note size form. the form is as follows

Date of...

Receipt....

Transfer....

Final disposal and to whom sent.....

The only box filled in is the last one, and it says "To man on discharge !3/2/19"

Hope this helps.

[John_Hartley]

completing the will form in the paybook was part of the final flurry of activity before leaving the UK on Active Service Overseas.

That said, I have read several officers' files at the NA where there has been no will and there has been discussion between the War Office and the families' solicitors about who was next of kin.

John

[eltoro1960]

There was no compulsion to make out a will , though highly recommended. The Scottish National War Memorial records if a man's will exists, most did not it would appear, the ones that do exist (and can be viewed in Edinburgh) are mostly pay book wills. At the end of the day what would an 18/19 year old laddie have in the way of property, would concur with the officer bit, I haven't seen one yet, but they maybe were left with lawyers.

[Malcolm]

Any wills surviving in Scotland are at the General Register Office. The database on Scottish National War Memorial gives the reference number if a will exists.

http://www.snwm.org/cgi-bin/db_w1.pl?funct...ew&id=86059

gives an example see the botton of the page.

Aye

Malcolm

[Borden Battery]

The following CEF Study Group website includes most of the "paper trail" of a CEF soldier including his Last Will and Testiment.

Borden Battery

*The CEF Paper Trail - Brett Payne Website

An Unofficial Guide to the Official Canadian Army Service Records from the Great War

This project involves collating examples of each type of document found in a soldier's World War 1 Canadian Expeditionary Force Service Records. The guide is designed to show prospective researchers what they may expect in a soldiers' service records. It's important to be aware that you will only find a selection of these records in your particular CEF soldier's file. Brett Payne and other researchers with the CEF Study Group are seeking additional CEF documents. A very well done summary of representative documents and invaluable for any student of the Great War.

[Note: Some images will be slow to load under dial-up access.][CEF Study Group - July 2005]

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~b...rtrail.html#top

[drm075]

Yes they did. Here is an example of the will of Pte. William Bartlett of the 4th battalion Gloucestershire Regiment. As already mentioned it was at the back of the soldier's Pay Book.

Dean

[Pete L]

Interesting discussion.

There are lots of stories of officers and NCOs recovering identity discs from the dead, but I have not heard of them also recovering pay books. So how did the authorities carry out the wishes of a man who was killed in action, if his body was not recovered for final burial?

Would they have left their pay books behind before going into action? Again I have not heard stories to this affect.

I am interested in this as my great uncle left his worldly goods to his sweetheart. At the time of his death his worldly goods consisted only of his Identity Disc, so I do not know what happened to his pay book. Would the pay book be considered the property of the army, and retained by them?

She later received his medals. But his next of kin was sent the Memorial Plague. This could explain why so many medals and plaques are not together. It is not that they were separated. It is that they were never together in the first place.

As anyone else come across a soldier leaving his worldly goods to anyone other than his next of kin?

Pete L

[AndyMacdonald]

I asked a couple of NZ vets about this. The response was quite interesting. In many of the NZ pay books the will was on page 13 and supersticiously viewed as bad luck to fill it in. Other editions of the tunic pocket pay book had the will on other pages! Quite apart from that, soldiers could make out a will on a separate piece of paper, which was held with their file at NZ base records. If it's not with those papers today, as many aren't, it pays to check with the Public Trust in NZ as tcopies are held by them. Archives NZ doesn't appear to have filed many of the WW1 wills, although its probate collection is very large.

Andy M

[Muerrisch]

the soldiers 'Small Book' AF B 50, contained advice on Wills, and two pro-forma examples for completion [of one of them!].

Seems unlikely Pay Book encouraged a separate and possibly different Will.

[AndyMacdonald]

the soldiers 'Small Book' AF B 50, contained advice on Wills, and two pro-forma examples for completion [of one of them!].

Seems unlikely Pay Book encouraged a separate and possibly different Will.

No, the pay book will and that fill in seperately were available concurrently and QUITE APART from one another, at least in the NZ system. Obviously, one page in a pay book would be insufficient space for some soldiers. I don't know the official title of the seperate will, sorry.

Andy M

[Muerrisch]

recipe for confusion!

[Tom A McCluskey]

Hi all,

Out of interest, because of the 'Wills Act 1837' British soldiers on active service and British sailors at sea did not have to formally make a will. They had a right of Privileged Will. All they needed to do was to state what they wanted done with their effects and have their testament witnessed. It did not have to be formally recorded; that is to say it could be said and a witness heard it, or it could be written on any piece of paper and witnessed. This law is still extant.

As John quite rightly said what does an 18/19 year old boy have. If his body is recovered the chances are his mates would send back his personal effects. For some of the working class soldiers worldy possessions could be quite humble.

Here is a a sympathetic letter from a Sergeant of the Oxs & Bucks Light Infantry (Sergeant Woodcock) , to Mrs McVicar regarding the death of her husband Private Adam McVicar, 4th Black Watch. I hope it conveys a spirit of cameraderie that transcends regimental rivalries.

I went out between our trenches and the Germans and came across the body of your husband, who was killed in action. I searched his pockets and took all his private property, which I gave up to my officer, who will send it on to you in due course. We buried him, and erected a small wooden cross to mark his last resting-place. I hope you will bear this sad news as bravely as possible. I know it must be a great blow to you, but I think your husband would not have wished to die a more glorious death than fighting for home and liberty. I think you can rest assured that he suffered no pain, as the bullet passed through his head , causing instantaneous death. As you will notice, I belong to a different regiment, but we are all comrades in this terrible war, and we all do our best for one another.

Hope this helps

Aye

Tom McC

[clive_hughes]

Hi,

A few thoughts on soldiers' wills.

Just like any other Will after c1858, whether in the back of a paybook or properly drawn up by a solicitor, they should come into Probate for verification.

If proved, then a digest of the total value of the soldier's estate together with some other general information would be printed in the annual Probate volumes. These are alphabetically arranged and certainly cover England and Wales if not beyond. Sets of these volumes were originally held by the various area Probate Registries, and some still have them - though I know that others have passed on their older volumes to County Record Offices. Major reference libraries may also have sets, eg. the National Library of Wales, Aberystwyth does.

Note the year concerned will be that in which the Will was proved, and not necessarily the year in which he died.

Full copies of each Will should be available for a fixed sum through Somerset House or its outstations.

The volumes also cover applications (usually by close family) for Administration of the property, in the case of those who died intestate (i.e., without making any Will). In this case, there will be little personal detail excepting the names of the deceased and the person applying for Admon., and the date granted.

I have certainly used the annual volumes to research some WW1 and WW2 casualties; but of course they won't be any help in the case of men who never made a Will, or whose kext-of-kin didn't go through the Admon process.

Cheers,

LST_164

[l.harding]

Thank you so much to everyone who has replied to my message and for the interesting discussion that has ensued! It started off really because one of the soldiers I am researching had emigrated to Australia and owned quite a large area of land there, which he was clearing to farm, so he clearly had something worth leaving to someone.

For the British soldiers, it sounds as though I need to get to Kew to see if any of their records survive and perhaps do the normal will search too.

Lesley Harding