Trying to find records of WW1 WAAC

[liverpool annie]

Here's a request for information that nobody seems to be able to find ..... and I wondered if anybody here could possibly help ?? Violet was born in Bristol and moved to Newport when she was 4 months old !!

Would appreciate any pointing in the right direction ........ as you can imagine time is not on our side !!

Thanking you in advance !!

Annie

"hi....... my grandmother violet rosina borlase (her maiden name) is 106yrs old in january and we have been told by the world war one veterans association she may be the only known living woman left to have served in the waac in ww1, we have been trying find her army service records but sadly it looks like her records were lost in the blitz's and was not one of the 7,000 records saved on the waac in ww1, we have tried the national archive and the waac association but with no luck, is there any other places i could look for her records?

the ww1 veterans association have been most helpful trying to find any info on her and they ask if she would like to come to london one day soon and meet a very very special lady if they could arrange it

the daily paper in south wales did a story of her time in london in the first world war a few weeks back and took a nice photo of her and my dad "

[amb]

Hi - I wonder if you ever managed to find out any information? I too had the same problem with my grandmother who was a WAAC in WW1 but sadly her records don't survive either. All I have is a photo of her with some other WAACs taken at Romford OTC (Hare Hall) in Essex, with 2nd Artists Rifles written on the back. Her name was Mary Jamieson and she was from a small village in Clackmannanshire, Scotland. Around 20 years ago I watched a local news programme featuring one of the remaining WAACs who was a member of their association which met up each year. I contacted the BBC and was put in touch with her, Jean Armour Brown, also from Scotland (Stirling) who had been one of the first 100 or perhaps 1000? to sign up, as had my grandmother. Despite her years, she was still working as a secretary in the House of Commons and invited me up there for a meal. She gave me a copy of Dame Helen Gwynne-Vaughan's book about the WAACs (she had been the Chief Controller for the WAACs) and invited me to attend the annual WAACs memorial service. For one reason or another I didn't go to this and have regretted it ever since. Do you have any information about where Violet served? My grandmother is supposed to have spent some time in France, just outside Lille. Sadly she died several years before I was born so could never ask her about it. If Violet had connections with Hare Hall camp I would be happy to send a copy of my photo in case she is one of the WAACs in it.

[pennyk]

Hi Annie,

My name is Tiffany Chow and I am a research assistant at work with Dr. Penny Kanner. We are currently working on a project about British women who served at the fronts during WW1. I was wondering if you had the contact information of this lovely woman Violet and/or her grandchild. We'd love to try to find out more about her so she gets deserved attention in our work.

Thanks for any help, we can be contacted at kanhist@ucla.edu.

Tiffany Chow

[gmac101]

Hi All

Family legend has it that a cousin of my Great Grandfather (James Macpherson Brown) was WAAC No. 1.

I'm not sure if this true or not. I have just this evening asked my grandfather to write down what he can remember about her and how she joined the WAAC. He has a copy of a book of local history photographs from Galashiels, in the Scottish Borders(Where his family was from). One shows her recruiting in Galashiels. From what I remember of the photograph she seemed very energetic.

It takes a while for my Gramps to fire up but I will keep you informed

All the best

Gavin

[Jim Strawbridge]

Hi All

Family legend has it that a cousin of my Great Grandfather (James Macpherson Brown) was WAAC No. 1.

Gavin

A search of the MICs website shows there are two No.1's to the QMAAC. These were Kathleen M. Mitchell (no rank given) and, more likely, Agnes M. Bell (Deputy Administrator).

[gmac101]

Hi all,

My Grandfather sent this about my first cousin three times removed May Anderson Finlay:

Extract from the “Scotsman” newspaper 26^th January 1952

MISS MAY FINLAY

“No: 1 W. A. A. C.” in France in 1915

The death has occurred in Edinburgh of Miss May Anderson Finlay, M.B.E., for many years President of the Women’s United Services Club, Edinburgh, and No: 1 W.A.A.C. in the 1^st World War. Miss Finlay was born in Edinburgh and educated at St Margaret’s School and at Brussels.

She served in the Women’s Legion in France in 1915, and with the formation of the Women’s Auviliary Army Corps she became automatically No: 1 W.A.A.C. - the first of a body of 50,000. She held the rank of Unit Administrator, serving in various places in France, including the large Echinghen camp near Boulogne.

She became the first secretary of the Women’s United Services Club, Edinburgh, whgen it opened in 1922. In 1926 she became the President of the Club, holding that position until 1945, after which she lived in retirement at Tignabruaich. She continued, however, as Honorary President to take a keen interest in the affairs of the Club.

Miss Finlay was the Chairman, also, for a number of years of the Edinburgh branch of the Queen Mary’s Army Auxiliary Corps Comrades Association, (now the W.R.A.C. Comraddes Association.)

During the late war (i.e. 1939/45) she served with the Church of Scotland Huts and Canteens at North Berwick, Alness, and Cairnryan in Wigtownshire.

AN APPRECIATION

The passing of Miss May Finlay, M.B.E. will be sad news to hun dreds of ex-service women all over the world by whom she was loved and respected. She had a warm, kindly, sympathetic disposition which was combined with considerable organising ability.

The great work which she did in the formation of the Q.M.A.A.C. Comrades Association and the Women’s United Services Club in Edinburgh will not be forgotten.

It was always a source of pride to her that she was the “No: 1 W.A.A.C.”. (It was the W.A.A.C. number allotted to her by virtue of the fact that she was serving in France when the Corps was formed.) She lived up to the title, however, because, throughout her life, she took the greatest interest in the welfare of Servicewomen. By her humour, her cheerfulness, and great good sense she brightened and simplified the lives of many.

Her death will be felt with a keen sense of loss by all her comrades and her many friends in and out of the services. M. I.

Obviously the obit may well be wrong as her name isn't the ones that you gave Jim but I hope this is interesting.

I don't know if the MBE citations are easily available and may confirm her WAAC no.

Regards

Gavin McLelland

[royalredcross]

There seems to be some confusion here. The two MICs quoted are both for workers or "other ranks". May Finlay was a Unit Administrator, an Official or an officer equivalent. As far as I know the officials were not given numbers.

She served in France from 31 March 1917 to 7 November 1919 and was discharged on the termination of her engagement on 16 November 1919. She was MID London Gazette 24 December 1917 and MBE in January 1918 for her work as a Superintendent in the Cookery Division of the Women's Legion.

In 1918 she was in charge of a unit at Ostrohove.

NGG

[gmac101]

Royal Red Cross,

Thank you for the information on her service and I will chase the LG's up.

So the adminstrators were not given numbers. I wonder how it got about that she was WAAC No. 1.

I can imagine these things probably do take a life of their own.

Thanks again

Gavin

[Jim Strawbridge]

Just out of interest I tried the MICs for May Anderson Finlay and found Mary A. Finlay with the glorious, and not seen before by me, for the QMAAC, rank of Victualler's Assistant.

[KevinBattle]

To dredge this out of the depths, I have today been completing my trawl through the Acton Gazette Index for information on servicemen and discovered that Miss Violet Long, Deputy Controller WAAC was drowned in the sinking of the Hospital Transport Warilda on August 3rd 1018 by UC49. She was amongst the 123 who died although the ship stayed afloat for about 2 hours before sinking.

The Acton connection? She lived in Abinger Road, Bedford Park, Acton Green.

She was not included in the Acton Roll of Honour (but I currently have more than 50 in that category) and any further information about her would be appreciated. Is there any MIC or other Service record for her?

I have also a note that Miss Eileen M Underwood of Creffield Place, Acton died in Paris as per news report dated 11/10/1918. Was she a War Casualty? Any info?

One other question: Would someone drowned on the Lusitania be counted as a Casualty for inclusion in a Roll of Honour? I have found 2 brothers, Albert Norris Perry (drowned) and his brother Frederick J Perry and his wife who survived. Would they have been Lusitania crew or passengers and if passengers, in any Service capacity or "just" civilians?

Thanks for any help, Kevin

[Jim Strawbridge]

To dredge this out of the depths, I have today been completing my trawl through the Acton Gazette Index for information on servicemen and discovered that Miss Violet Long, Deputy Controller WAAC was drowned in the sinking of the Hospital Transport Warilda on August 3rd 1018 by UC49. She was amongst the 123 who died although the ship stayed afloat for about 2 hours before sinking.

The Acton connection? She lived in Abinger Road, Bedford Park, Acton Green.

She was not included in the Acton Roll of Honour (but I currently have more than 50 in that category) and any further information about her would be appreciated. Is there any MIC or other Service record for her?

I have also a note that Miss Eileen M Underwood of Creffield Place, Acton died in Paris as per news report dated 11/10/1918. Was she a War Casualty? Any info?

One other question: Would someone drowned on the Lusitania be counted as a Casualty for inclusion in a Roll of Honour? I have found 2 brothers, Albert Norris Perry (drowned) and his brother Frederick J Perry and his wife who survived. Would they have been Lusitania crew or passengers and if passengers, in any Service capacity or "just" civilians?

Thanks for any help, Kevin

Kevin, The original enquiry was about a Violet ?. Now that you mention Violet Long I can say that she is well known and well researched as to her history. You say that there is an Acton connection as she lived at Abinger Road, Bedford Park, Acton Green. I have her as 4, Abinger Road, Bedford Park, Chiswick. Is Abinger Road in Acton Green or Chiswick? But this may not have been her main residence as they owned and lived in others.

I have quite an extensive record of female war casualties. I have not come across Eileen M. Underwood and believe that she is most likely to have been a civilian. Not a VAD or similar so far as I can tell.

Not everyone on the Lusitania were classed as war casualties. I have serving women who died off the Lusitania who are not commemorated. I am guessing that only those that were working on the boat were afforded that honour. Passengers, even if service personel, were not. But I am guessing that there will be anomolies.

Lastly, my manuscript is searchable. I have run Acton through the search engine as it seems that you might be interested. I have come across :-

Dolly Crowder (or Crowther), munition worker, died in an accident. She lived at 3 All Saints Road, Acton.

Florence Mary Ellis, WRAF, lived at 141 Acton Lane, Chiswick and is buried in Acton Cemetery.

And from the National Roll of the Great War (not casualties)

Mrs J. Palmer, munition worker lived at 279 Acton Lane, Chiswick.

and not to forget that many of the memorial plaques were manufactured in Acton.

[KevinBattle]

Jim, Many thanks for this information.

I actually live in the Parish of Acton Green which is between Chiswick High Road and Acton High Street, and includes the garden suburb of Bedford Park, which the posh ones describe as Chiswick.

Our local Church had a burst pipe so when the floors were repaired, everything needed moving clear and that's when I found an original grave marker for Penderel-Brodhurst. The Vicar is a good friend so I did the RoH so he could put it in their website, plus the other two local Churches in Acton Green (Dorothy Crowther is on the All Saints RoH)

Acton Green (and Turnham Green) was the battlefield for the Civil War Battle of Turnham Green, from just below Acton High Street along the Bollo Brook to Gunnersbury Station.

I haven't read all the Gazette reports, the Acton Roll of Honour gives little detail, just Dorothy Maude Mary Crowther, Munitions Worker killed in explosion aged 16 (Edition dated10/5/18). I wonder if it is linked to Messrs W E DuCross Munitions Factory – worker killed (Edition dated 4/6/18) ? Dorothy Crowther?

There is also Harriet Jane Date, Munitions Worker died aged 30 Acton Gazette (Edition dated 16/3/17).

Also a Mr J M Steer, St Albans Ave, death by TNT poisoning (edition dated 27/9/18) so seems to be another Munitions Worker.

I have the RoH's for St Peters, All Saints and St Albans as well as the full list from Acton Cemetery, whcih I am cross referencing with the Acton RoH to ensure that none were omitted.

I haven't seen any previous reference to Mrs J Palmer of 279 Acton Lane, so thanks for that!

The Old Brewery in Mill Hill Grove was converted to producing war memorial plaques in Jan 1919.

I appreciate your searching for Acton references, any W3 or W4 will be of interest, as the Boroughs of Hounslow and Ealing split along the District Line tracks. I'm just doing Acton at the moment, but I can feel Chiswick pulling at me too!! Then of course there is no official RoH for WW2 servicemen in Acton, just Civilian War Dead but I'm trying to finish one job before it sprouts even more directions!!

My personal take is that a RoH should contain all who lived, worked or had links with the area, and because of enemy action were killed or died as a result of the war.

With regard to WW1, I would feel inclined to include flu and pneumonia deaths of "service age" as Casualties, as many people had lowered resistance due to wartime privations.

If there is anything I can add, let me know

Cheers, Kevin

[Jim Strawbridge]

Jim, Many thanks for this information.

I actually live in the Parish of Acton Green which is between Chiswick High Road and Acton High Street, and includes the garden suburb of Bedford Park, which the posh ones describe as Chiswick.

Our local Church had a burst pipe so when the floors were repaired, everything needed moving clear and that's when I found an original grave marker for Penderel-Brodhurst. The Vicar is a good friend so I did the RoH so he could put it in their website, plus the other two local Churches in Acton Green (Dorothy Crowther is on the All Saints RoH)

Acton Green (and Turnham Green) was the battlefield for the Civil War Battle of Turnham Green, from just below Acton High Street along the Bollo Brook to Gunnersbury Station.

I haven't read all the Gazette reports, the Acton Roll of Honour gives little detail, just Dorothy Maude Mary Crowther, Munitions Worker killed in explosion aged 16 (Edition dated10/5/18). I wonder if it is linked to Messrs W E DuCross Munitions Factory – worker killed (Edition dated 4/6/18) ? Dorothy Crowther?

There is also Harriet Jane Date, Munitions Worker died aged 30 Acton Gazette (Edition dated 16/3/17).

Also a Mr J M Steer, St Albans Ave, death by TNT poisoning (edition dated 27/9/18) so seems to be another Munitions Worker.

I have the RoH's for St Peters, All Saints and St Albans as well as the full list from Acton Cemetery, whcih I am cross referencing with the Acton RoH to ensure that none were omitted.

I haven't seen any previous reference to Mrs J Palmer of 279 Acton Lane, so thanks for that!

The Old Brewery in Mill Hill Grove was converted to producing war memorial plaques in Jan 1919.

I appreciate your searching for Acton references, any W3 or W4 will be of interest, as the Boroughs of Hounslow and Ealing split along the District Line tracks. I'm just doing Acton at the moment, but I can feel Chiswick pulling at me too!! Then of course there is no official RoH for WW2 servicemen in Acton, just Civilian War Dead but I'm trying to finish one job before it sprouts even more directions!!

My personal take is that a RoH should contain all who lived, worked or had links with the area, and because of enemy action were killed or died as a result of the war.

With regard to WW1, I would feel inclined to include flu and pneumonia deaths of "service age" as Casualties, as many people had lowered resistance due to wartime privations.

If there is anything I can add, let me know

Cheers, Kevin

Hello Kevin, I would welcome a photograph of the name of Dorothy Crowther off the Roll of Honour in All Saints if at all possible. I have her as Dolly Crowder (or Crowther) so with what you have provided I hope to find her in a census but in view of her age she won't be in the 1901 so will have to await the 1911. Harriet Jane Date is an entirely new one to me. Thank you. Kind regards, Jim

[KevinBattle]

Jim, I'll get as much info for you as possible, but may be a couple of weeks before all to hand.

I've finally got into Geoff's Search Engine and simply searched for the word "Acton" and think I've got over 140 more Names to collate and put forward for cinsideration by the local Council!!

Just did a preliminary search for WW2 and only 600 odd records, which stripping out Clacton, Bacton, Nacton etc should be less than 400 to sort.....

Any female service, or civilians, I'll pass on.

I'll see what else may be around for Dorothy and Mrs Date.

Cheers, Kevin

[Guest rebeccaclaire86]

Jim, I'll get as much info for you as possible, but may be a couple of weeks before all to hand.

I've finally got into Geoff's Search Engine and simply searched for the word "Acton" and think I've got over 140 more Names to collate and put forward for cinsideration by the local Council!!

Just did a preliminary search for WW2 and only 600 odd records, which stripping out Clacton, Bacton, Nacton etc should be less than 400 to sort.....

Any female service, or civilians, I'll pass on.

I'll see what else may be around for Dorothy and Mrs Date.

Cheers, Kevin

Hi Kevin, I was just wondering if you found any more info about Harriet Jane Date - she's my gr-gr-grandmother, who died at the munitions factory in Acton, an inquest was held according to her death certificate (I was searching online to see if there were any newspaper articles about it when I stumbled across your thread)...

Hoping you see this, I know the thread is a little bit out of date!

Becky

[Jim Strawbridge]

Hi Kevin, I was just wondering if you found any more info about Harriet Jane Date - she's my gr-gr-grandmother, who died at the munitions factory in Acton, an inquest was held according to her death certificate (I was searching online to see if there were any newspaper articles about it when I stumbled across your thread)...

Hoping you see this, I know the thread is a little bit out of date!

Becky

Becky, I am researching Harriet Date and presume that she was the 11 year old daughter of Frederick and Louisa Date of Hackney in the 1901 census. I know that the Acton Gazette shows that she died in early 1917 but as you have obtained a copy of her death certificate I should be grateful if you could let me know the precise date and cause of death. Also do you know where she is buried? Also, have you a photograph of her that I might use in my Register that I am preparing re WW1 serving female casualties? Any information will be gratefully received, Jim Strawbridge (jimstrawbridge AT coinsale.fsnet.co.uk)