How to buy a WW1 rifle

[Guest Pete Wood]

I think I have got to the stage where I would like to buy a rifle. It will mainly be for display purposes, but ideally I would like to be able to fire it (if only with blanks).

Can you tell me if I require a licence and, if so, what's involved.

What is the best rifle to own, in terms of advantages and disadvantages.

What are the likely costs and from whom should I buy one.

I'm based in the UK, if that makes any difference.

If this has been covered before, I apologise. Please just point me in the right direction to the previous thread.

Many thanks, in advance.

[Guest Hill 60]

RT - The following is from the Thames Valley Police Firearm Licensing Manager in reply to a query I had on blank-firers.

Mr Bradbury,

Thank you for your enquiry. In response to your question regarding the law in relation to blank firing weapons; if they capable of firing blanks only (usually the barrel is blocked and the chamber vented) then they are not subject to licensing nor to a minimum age. However, if they are capable of being converted to firing a live round then normal certificate procedures apply and the minimum age to purchase a firearm is 17

Yours,

Mike Lobb

Firearm Licensing Manager

I have an SMLE MkIII*, which I bought at the International Arms Fair at the Motorbike Museum near the NEC. It cost me about £130, with a bayonet, but the prices have gone up now.

It isn't a blank-firer and comes with a de-activation certificate. In my humble opinion, NEVER buy a de-activated weapon unless it comes with a de-activation certificate.

[Annette Burgoyne]

Hi Lee & Teapot

I was very lucky when I got my Lee Enfield, a chap in my town who own a pub that was full of Army stuff was giving up the pub trade and moving to a smaller house and he had to sell a lot of his collection. He let me have the rifle for £60 or £80, I just wished I had more money at the time for he had a German rifle and Pick what ever they are called and many other Great War items.

My rifle is also de-activated with a certificate, which is best, or I may have shot a few people by now

Annette

[Max Poilu]

Under the old law, live single action manual rifles (SMLE's etc) came under Section 1 whereby a certificate is needed for ownership - this only being granted to those with a legitimate reason to own such a weapon - the militaria collector comes way down this list! Rules were strict regarding storage, ammunition etc.

Post Dunblane everything was tightened up still further and with the law as it stands and the world situation we live in I do not think you can own a SMLE capable of firing blanks (or any form of cartridge). I am not up on current law but with talk of de-acts and even replicas facing further control (or banning) I would give up the idea of ever owning a live rifle.

When de-activated the bolt, chamber and barrel are altered to prevent firing of any sort of ammunition.

Semi-de-activation (?) would I suspect be a very grey area - to allow the firing of blanks the bolt must be fully operational but the de-activation guidelines call for the bolt to be chamfered and firing pin removed...

De-activated SMLE's are still available at most good militaria fairs or from dealers advertising in The Armourer or Gun Mart etc. Prices have risen over the last few years but around £175 should secure a good example. All should have 'working-parts' and are thus satisfying to own and display.

As others have said do make sure you obtain the genuine de-act certificate and don't carry the rifle un-wrapped from the fair to your car - some (silly) people do - you risk the wrath of the local rapid response firearms unit called in by a well meaning member of the public...

Worldwide Arms are one of the bigger dealers, they should certainly be able to advise you on the current law or have a look at the Military Odyssey show in September - a must for the Great War enthusisat and collector.

[Guest Ian Bowbrick]

To meet the current law re-deactivated firearms you will not be able to obtain an SMLE or any other genuine firearm that can fire blanks, for the simple reason that the firing pin would have been removed or rendered incapable of striking a round. There are are a number of blank firing models on the market but these are nasty modern repros.

Everyone is correct, it is best to obtain a deactivated weapon with a gunsmiths certifcate stating the weapon has been deactivated in accordance with the law if only for re-sale purposes.

In terms of cost, a WW1 date stamped SMLE Mk III will cost you anything from £175 to £225. If you are looking for a 1916 Luger P08, please e-mail me off Forum.

Ian

[Tom Morgan]

I was advised by Taff Gillingham (Khaki Chums) to get a copy of "Gun Mart" magazine, which has tons of adverts including a deactivated/militaria section, which is where to find the SMLEs. Disadvantage is that you have to be prepared to travel to look at them, but the good point is that you are less lilely to find that the prices have been hyped up as happens at shows. You can also ring the seller to ask questions.

You may also find that someone has made an effort to CLEAN the rifle ready for sale.

I followed Taff's advice and got a 1915 BSA Mk III* (with non-matching numbers) for £170 about a year ago from a dealer not too far from my home.

Click here for an earlier forum discussion on this subject.

Tom

[chris basey]

Just over fifty years ago I joyfully handed in the 303 rifle that the British Army had entrusted me with for the previous two years. I would have refused it if they had offered it to me for free! The ten rounds that I fired during that time certainly did nothing to instil in me a love for that particular weapon or of any firearms - perhaps active service produces a different attitude. Certainly something I can well do without - de-activated or not.

[Guest Ian Bowbrick]

The ten rounds that I fired during that time certainly did nothing to instil in me a love for that particular weapon or of any firearms - perhaps active service produces a different attitude.

The best weapon I ever had the chance to use was an AK 47, you could bury it, drop it water and it would fire first time. The worst was the Lee Enfield Mk 5 that was issued to troops in 1945 and was sometimes known as the jungle carbine, smokey with a recoil like a mule with piles!

I was and still am amazed at the engineering that goes into firearms technology. Misguided? I leave that to the philosophers amongst you.

Ian

[trenchwalker]

£130 for a rifle with bayonet there about £195 Now.

Living in enfield where they were made . I have a couple of contacts.

It all depends on what you want?

[Guest Ian Bowbrick]

Interestingly someone was selling a 1940 Indian manufacture SMLE Mk III on eBay at the beginning of the week, with de-activation certificate, but after 3 days the auction was cancelled by eBay. It had got to £150.

Ian