Guest Ian Bowbrick Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 Although it was a bit tongue-in-cheek, the discussion on bearded or non bearded soldiers prompted me to look through the 'Bowbrick Photographic Archive' for the attached little gem. The flipside side says 'Somewhere in France 1917'. Your views please? Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fleur Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 Excellent piccie! Could he have been an early Hells Angel? I know a few that sport beards just like that! I wonder how he was allowed to have a beard? Could it have been something to do with religion? Fleur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ian Bowbrick Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 Fleur, I have to admit he doesn't 'look British'. But religious wise - I don't think the British Army was that tolerant in 14-18 (?). He looks very continental European. Unfortunately like most pictures there is no name on the back. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Morgan Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 Conscientious objector who refused to shave it off? Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ian Bowbrick Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 Could he be NCC rather than Labour Corps then? Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gem22 Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 It's difficult to see how it could be linked to religion. Generally speaking religions that require men to wear beards do not allow for any part of the face to be shaven. Some forms of Moslem, Jewish and, I think, Hindu religions are included in this. I believe that even the Navy required men to wear a proper full set in those areas where it was allowed. This fellow is decidedly odd. Garth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fleur Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 Could it beeeeeee............ A german in fancy dress?? Just kiddin'! It is a very odd picie indeed Fleur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest FRANKBARTHOLOMEW Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 Hullo, Wahhabi Sunni' Muslims (found in Saudi Arabia) and Hasidic Jews forbid shaving, but our chap will almost definitely not be a Hasidic Jew- as (if I remeber rightly) they are not allowed to serve in military units. Sikhs are also forbidden to shave, and hence were allowed to have beards and serve in the Army. I do recall reading about a British soldier who asked the King for special permission to grow a beard, and actually got it. Frank Bartholomew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munce Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 Something lurking deep in the recesses of my memory says that Pioneer Sergeants are uniquely (in the British Army) allowed to grow beards. Although this chap has only two stripes up, perhaps this peculiar exception to the rule also extended to Corporals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jock Bruce Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 A nasty but localised skin complaint and therefore 'excused shaving' ?? Jock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry_Reeves Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 Ian Certainly an interesting cap badge, but not the Non-Combatant Corps I'm afraid. Their's looked like a shoulder title with letters NCC or NCLC - Non-Combatant Labour Corps. There were no NCC NCO's either. Officers and NCO's were drawn from medically downgraded men from infantry battalions who kept their own insignia. Perhaps it's one of Jock's Intelligence men? Terry Reeves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annette Burgoyne Posted 27 August , 2003 Share Posted 27 August , 2003 The cap badge looks like the Lion and unicorn (I think its a unicorn ?) of the Manchester Regt. ? Would he have be aloud to keep his beard while serveing in UK ? Annette Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate Wills Posted 28 August , 2003 Share Posted 28 August , 2003 Looks more like Bedfordshire Yeomanry to me, though he doesn't look like your average Bedfordshire Yeoman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ian Bowbrick Posted 28 August , 2003 Share Posted 28 August , 2003 One point that has been missed is that he is wearing riding breeches and not trousers. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annette Burgoyne Posted 28 August , 2003 Share Posted 28 August , 2003 Fleur could be right, he's a German in fancy dress. Annette Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ian Bowbrick Posted 28 August , 2003 Share Posted 28 August , 2003 Well as we had a King at the time who was a quarter German, why not! Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivor Lee Posted 28 August , 2003 Share Posted 28 August , 2003 Ian On my screen the badge looks like the General Service one which would be correct for Labour Corps in 1917 (August onwards). As it is dated 1917 you can disregard a man in one of the Russian Companies although there were a number of men of Russian origin in the LC in 1917. The riding breeches made me wonder about either an agricultural or forestry company? I did wonder about one of the alien companies but then he should have been wearing Middlesex Regiment badge. Ivor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Reed Posted 28 August , 2003 Share Posted 28 August , 2003 Curious he is also wearing a signals badge - was there a signals section in the LC? Ian - any chance of a close up scan of head and shoulders, so we can see the shoulder title better. It doesn't look right for LC to me, but agree the badge is correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ian Bowbrick Posted 28 August , 2003 Share Posted 28 August , 2003 Paul/Ivor, I have blown up the head and soldiers and the shoulder title is at the wrong angle to get a clear definition. However I shall post a blow up tomorrow in case someone has greater luck. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 29 August , 2003 Share Posted 29 August , 2003 While the experts are looking for the right answer to this one, can I throw in another example of a bearded soldier: Field Marshal Jan C. Smuts Regards Michael D.R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Posted 29 August , 2003 Share Posted 29 August , 2003 Something lurking deep in the recesses of my memory says that Pioneer Sergeants are uniquely (in the British Army) allowed to grow beards. Isn't the Sergeant who has charge of the Welsh Fusiliers mascot (goat) allowed to wear a beard to mirror that of the goat? Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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