docchippy Posted 10 December , 2005 Share Posted 10 December , 2005 Iave just managed to find time to watch "The Last Tommy". Harry Patch recounts being wounded near Pilckem on 22 Sept 1917 and his comrades being killed. Did he Identify them, or has any forum member managed to do so? I have done a text search on the forum site and con't sem to find any discussion ofthe others in his Lewis team? Doc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Marshall Posted 11 December , 2005 Share Posted 11 December , 2005 I've seen a few of the programmes Harry patch has appeared in and read a few supporting articles, but no doubt not all of them. I seem to remember that he said it was one of his greatest regrets that he couldn't recall the names of his mates in the lewis team. He could remember nicknames but nothing more. From what I've seen and read it's not possible to put his team together.. but heres hoping eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPotter Posted 11 December , 2005 Share Posted 11 December , 2005 I would have thought that given the exact date and location of death it would have been possible to narrow down the search to a number of possibles. As they were Lewis Gunners would they still be listed as with their parent unit (7/DCLI?) as opposed to MGC? SDGW or even the MIC will confirm previous service with the DCLI assuming they all came together through the same route? Steve (a great fan of Harry) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docchippy Posted 11 December , 2005 Author Share Posted 11 December , 2005 I think he said he was wounded on 22 Sept 17 at Pilckem, 7th DCLI. Anybody with SDGW Cd able to have a search? Doc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOMMESOLDIER Posted 11 December , 2005 Share Posted 11 December , 2005 There are no 7th Battalion DCLI for that date on SDGW. Also there are no Machine Gun Corps on that date either who have previous service in DCLI. The Plot thickens !!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brigantian Posted 11 December , 2005 Share Posted 11 December , 2005 I’ve checked the new CD version of SDGW and for 22 September 1917 it lists three 7th Bn. Duke of Cornwall Light Infantry casualties: 28783 Pte Ernest Cullingford 34500 Pte James Forrest 28328 Pte Alfred Moyses All three are shown as killed in action. From CWGC, Moyses is named on the Tyne Cot Memorial, whilst Cullingford and Forrest are buried together in the same plot at Cement House Cemetery, Langemark-Poelkapelle. These three might be good candidates for Harry’s comrades. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john w. Posted 11 December , 2005 Share Posted 11 December , 2005 How certain are you that they are the ones.. because if you are and Harry can be contacted, he might be able to confirm their identity if their names jog his memory John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brigantian Posted 12 December , 2005 Share Posted 12 December , 2005 (edited) John I’m not by any means certain, but these three soldiers do fit the basic facts – i.e. they are only ones from Harry’s battalion recorded on SDGW and CWGC as loosing their lives that day; furthermore Cullingford and Forrest are buried where one might expect if they died near Pilckem. Mark Edited 12 December , 2005 by Brigantian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Heavey Posted 12 December , 2005 Share Posted 12 December , 2005 Would the details not be in the 7 DCLI war diary at Kew, which is available online? Just a thought. My gt grandads unit 4 Royal Fusiliers have got theirs at Kew online and I have downloaded it. Surely the names of the boys lost will be there if anywhere. Also what is SDGW? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted 12 December , 2005 Share Posted 12 December , 2005 SDGW is Soldiers Died in the Grteat War available on CD - it is referred to numerous times in various threads on this Forum. Battalion War Diaries are unlikely to give the names of O/R's killed - they usually only to refer to so many O/R's killed, so many O/R's wounded. Diary of 1st East Surreys in Sept. 1914 just lists the ES on my sig. amongst the wounded but does mention him by name some days later when the unit was advised that he had died of wounds. Diary of MGC unit that the MGC man on my sig refers to just says, "A quiet night. Shelling in the usual places. 4 O/R's killed." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOMMESOLDIER Posted 12 December , 2005 Share Posted 12 December , 2005 Hi All, Made a mistake put 22-10-17 instead of 22-9-17. Thats why I got no results !!!!! It might be worth watching the Last Tommy at the point where he talks about them as he says something about what they did for jobs before the war and also I recall he says where they came from !! If anyone does have it on tape, here are the three chaps details:- Ernest Cullingford born, Wayford, Somerset, Enlisted, Taunton Residence Wayford James Forrest Edinburgh London Shepherds Bush Alfred Moyses Newquay, Cornwall Newquay Cheers Tim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BMoorhouse Posted 13 December , 2005 Share Posted 13 December , 2005 As they were Lewis Gunners would they still be listed as with their parent unit (7/DCLI?) Yes. Lewis gunners were integral to the platoon. Vickers guns were withdrawn from the battalion manpower on the formation of the MGC. Brendon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docchippy Posted 13 December , 2005 Author Share Posted 13 December , 2005 Not sure if I have taped over my copy, but will attempt to scan through it to find out where he said his colleagues were from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrtle Posted 13 December , 2005 Share Posted 13 December , 2005 Ernest Cullingford is listed by UKNIWM as commemorated in St Michael's Church, Wayford, Somerset. He is listed as Earnest Cullingford with the online 1901 census and said to be 9 years old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest geoff501 Posted 13 December , 2005 Share Posted 13 December , 2005 Ernest Cullingford is listed by UKNIWM as commemorated in St Michael's Church, Wayford, Somerset. He is listed as Earnest Cullingford with the online 1901 census and said to be 9 years old. Any info on the nicknames? Possible matches for others: Wayford Somerset 1901 George Cullingford head 39 Sarah Jane wife 40 Christopher son 17 Frank son 16 Earl son 14 George son 13 Mary Helen daur 12 Charles son 10 Earnest son 9 b. Wayford Somerset Dora daur 8 Wallace son 6 Olive daur 4 Ada daur 3 Rowland son 1 Wallsend, Northumberland 1901 James Forrest head 42 Mary wife 40 Jane daur 19 William son 16 James son 14 Shipyard Labourer b. Scotland Cecilia daur 10 Thomas son 8 Walter son 5 Mary daur 2 St. Columb Minor, Cornwall 1901 William J. Moyses Head 47 Elizabeth wife 49 R.Harry son 19 Alberny son 16 Alfred son 13 b. Newquay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest geoff501 Posted 14 December , 2005 Share Posted 14 December , 2005 Possible matches for others: having checked CWGC, the last two would appear to be wrong.... I wonder if any Cullingford brothers served? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest geoff501 Posted 14 December , 2005 Share Posted 14 December , 2005 having checked CWGC, the last two would appear to be wrong.... I stand corrected (by myself....) CWGC info for Moyses is: Son of Mrs. E. Moyses, of "Kroonstade," Tower Rd., Newquay, and the late John Moyses; husband of Emily Mary Moyses, of Fore St., Tregoney, Grampound Road., Cornwall. The 1901 census address is Tower Road, Newquay: William J. Moyses head Elizabeth Moyses wife There only seems to be one James Forest (or Forrest) born in Scotland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
domsim Posted 14 December , 2005 Share Posted 14 December , 2005 IThere only seems to be one James Forest (or Forrest) born in Scotland. Chances are James Forrest was still living in Edinburgh in 1901, where he was born so would not be on the English census. CWGC entry says he was 20 when he died so would have been born around 1897. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John S Posted 14 December , 2005 Share Posted 14 December , 2005 In the book 'Forgotten Voices' Harry mentions he was attached to C Company Lewis Gun as No 2. The No 1 was 'Bob'. This of course doesn't mean that Bob was the name of one of the three killed. Harry also states that there were 5 in a team, so what happened to the fifth man, if indeed there was a fifth during that particular attack? Regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOMMESOLDIER Posted 14 December , 2005 Share Posted 14 December , 2005 Harry also states that there were 5 in a team, so what happened to the fifth man, if indeed there was a fifth during that particular attack? Regards John Hi John, Very good point, I have always wondered about this !! Cheers Tim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest geoff501 Posted 14 December , 2005 Share Posted 14 December , 2005 Very good point, I have always wondered about this !! Surely the fifth man is Bob, who survived and Harry kept in touch with? Lots of Roberts in DCLI ! Seems our hero made it to The National Portrait Gallery: http://www.npg.org.uk/live/search/person.asp?LinkID=mp71939 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John S Posted 14 December , 2005 Share Posted 14 December , 2005 Surely the fifth man is Bob, who survived and Harry kept in touch with? Lots of Roberts in DCLI ! I wasn't aware that any one other than Harry survived the incident, thanks for pointing this out. A quick Google produced the following http://www.aftermathww1.com/interviews1.asp Regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docchippy Posted 14 December , 2005 Author Share Posted 14 December , 2005 I have had a look through the Last Tommy video again and Harry states that his comrades in the Lewis team were: gunner, a L-Cpl peactime electrician from Henley-on Thames, Harry a plumber, number 3 from Truro, number 4 & 5 both from Falmouth one a shoemaker and one a grocer. These do not seem to fit the ID's given above, but any sound alikes or close geographical proximity to the places mentioned in earlier posts? regards Doc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest geoff501 Posted 15 December , 2005 Share Posted 15 December , 2005 I have had a look through the Last Tommy video again and Harry states that his comrades in the Lewis team were: gunner, a L-Cpl peactime electrician from Henley-on Thames, Harry a plumber, number 3 from Truro, number 4 & 5 both from Falmouth one a shoemaker and one a grocer. These do not seem to fit the ID's given above, but any sound alikes or close geographical proximity to the places mentioned in earlier posts? Very strange, they don't seem to fit. Here is the casualties for August-Sept 1917. Harry mentions capturing the German trench and the service trench behind it. It was going back over the old no-mans-land that they were hit. However he gives no timescale. The shell fell late at night and there does not seem to be any casualties for 23 - so they were not recorded on this day. Anyone in contact with Harry. maybe he remembers the nicknames, or age of his pals, it may help. Did he get the date right. Not being funny about his 'Rememberance Day' but being half his age I get dates mixed up! Here's the graph. Not sure if the 7th were involved in taking the trenches - but it may have been 16th August, looking at casualties. Anyone got a war diary? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrtle Posted 15 December , 2005 Share Posted 15 December , 2005 No soldiers named Cullingford, Forrest or Moyses on the Henley-on-Thames War Memorial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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