Researching Medal Serial Numbers

[Drafter]

I hoping I am posting this in the right place if not I hope I can get pointed in the right direction. MY great greast uncle Eric James Bate served in WW1 Lance Serjeant CEF 19th Bn A Coy Central Ontario Regiment January 12, 1915 - November 8, 1917. He won the MM July 9, 1917 according to the London Gazette supplement issue number 30172. I was able to get the book MM Canadian Recipients from Library Archives on loan to a local library I found the page he is listed on got the copy of that shows in the back the issue number of the LG plus serial numbers of the medal for the pages in the book. What I was wondering is there anyway of tracking down the serial number of his MM?I don't have the medal itself but I do have the copy of the citation. Is the order that was issued to Eric the serial number or some way of tracking it I just don't know it off hand. I will post a picture of the citation and the supplement page of the LG if it is of any help what I was also wondering if it is possible to get an interpretation of the citation to see if there is a serial number or something could track down the medal number. As I have this book on loan until June 29th. I sent a copy of the citation to a WW1 military padre the only interpretation he made was that he thought that maybe Eric got it April 9, 1917 as I understand they were in Vimy Ridge in April. What he was unsure of was wheather or not it was acknowledged April 9th or physically recieved July9th I also found a MM Medal Index Card of him in the NA as showing July9th. I would greatly appreciate any help on this hoping that I can find the right serial number for the right page if anyone has looked through this book and understandshow it works I would greatly appreciate any feedback on this. Thanks again. Drafter

[Stebie9173]

Drafter,

You might just want to have a look at this page of the 19th Battalion War Diary, appendix 5, page 19.

http://data2.collectionscanada.ca/e/e045/e001105717.jpg

It is part of the Battalion's War Diary online.

http://data4.collectionscanada.ca/netacgi/..._e.html&r=5&f=G

Oh for such quality information for the British Units!

The whole war diary is there as well.

The London Gazette entry is just the announcement to the world of the award. They tend to Gazetted about 3 months after the action, as borne out by this...

Steve.

[Drafter]

Thanks for the reply the links you posted don't seem to work at all do you have any other links you can send me? The links you sent me do you know if there is any other way of getting to them in the collections canada website? I greatly appreciate the info you sent me that gives a better idea how the gazette was entering the info in their paper. Thanks again

[Stebie9173]

The link was supposed to send you to an image of the MMs awarded for 9th April 1917 on which Eric James Bate is included. Therfore he definitely won his MM at Vimy Ridge on 9-4-1917.

I can't get through the links either! I think the Canadian Archive site is having a dodgy moment. Typical... Try again later, I think.

If you can't get at them through the links, then "Google" for Canadian War Diaries. Use the first hit and search for 19th Battalion and 1917.

The MM entries are in the appendices for May 1917, Appendix 5, Page 19. The appendices around them describe a parade at which it looks like the awards were presented.

Of course, April 1917 will include a description of the Vimy Ridge battle from the 19th Battalions point of view.

When the site gets back up, have fun!

Steve.

[Drafter]

I was trying that to after you posted that I forgot that they shut down once in a while will try later on. Thanks for that and for the google suggestion will try that if it comes to that. I have the mm citation and the lg supplement. I was wondering if you might be able to interpret for me the order burnstall. If it says on the NA July 9th it shows July 9th LG and his records to how come it shows April 9th does that mean he won it April 9th for being at Vimy but physically recieved it July9th. Thanks again for the help I appreciate it. Will let you know if I can get to those links or not.

[Stebie9173]

From what I remember of the War Diary appendices he received the MM at a parade in May, probably just after the 17-5-1917 date on his citation. That would have been when the army decided to award him it. It was then later published "for the record" in July.

The appendix page categorically states that the medal was for actions on 9th April 1917 at Vimy Ridge. 100%.

It also looks like the date 15-4-1917, is on the Citation, which is probably the date that an officer recommended him for his brave conduct.

Steve.

[Stebie9173]

Drafter,

Here is the image, just in case the site goes offline again. I bet that was frustrating!

Steve.

[kaisersoffensive]

Hello

You will find this chap extremely helpful with anything to do with Canadian Servicemen.

steven.dieter@rmc.ca

Regards,

Bob

[Drafter]

Thanks for the help I really appreciate I was able to get through to the links you posted Stebie. It was a little frustrating but no worries got the page also found the page before that annoucing the winners of the mm made a copy of that. Was also wondering would it show in the war diaries of the n.c.o.s being KIA was wondering if it might have shown Eric James Bate being recorded somewhere in there as being KIA? Been looking through it nothing so far I would appreciate any help on that but will keep looking. I wasn't sure if I would find anything like the annoucement of Eric being listed there had tried before I guess I didn't keep looking further hehe. Also thanks for the info kaisers I will keep that in mind now that I now who to ask if I have any further questions on Canadian Servicemen. Thanks again for the help.

Drafter

[Drafter]

I was also wondering is there still anyway of finding out what the serial number of his Military Medal might have been? Is there any clues or hints on the M.M. Citation I posted? As far as I can tell I can't see anything that may indicate I am going to go through the service records again that I got from Library Archives Canada to see if there is anything in there. The only reason why I ask this is I got the book Military Medal Canadian Recipiants on Loan through the inter library loan program through Library Archives made a few photocopies of it two weeks ago and got the page that he is listed on, the pages that talks about the London Gazette dates and the introduction talking about what the describes about the Military Medal. I found the pages at the back of the book that lists serial numbers of the M.M. for each soldier of the pages of the bookbut doesn't look like it's in any sequential order. What I was wondering if there is anyway of finding out what the serial number of Eric's M.M. is then tracking it down to one of those serial numbers in the book because I want to find out so I can photocopy it some more as I only have this book on loan until the end of this month around June 29th I think. If the two of you are familiar how that part of the book works I would greatly appreciate any help and incase if the two of you are sure would be able to refer to one of the other members here that could help me. Thanks again for the previous help that tied in very nicely which I thought would never get answered.