Territorial renumbering

[Northern Soul]

When the Territorials were renumbered in early 1917 and given new 6 figure numbers to replace their existing 4 figure ones then men who had been ‘missing’ from mid to late 1916 tended to get renumbered too as they weren’t officially considered to be dead. However, why would three Terriers killed in June 1915, more than eighteen months before the renumbering exercise be issued with 200000 series numbers?

200016, Private Thomas Patrick Blake

200055, Private William Stephens

200698, Private Henry Sprout

All three were 4th K.O.R.L.R and are commemorated on the Le Touret Memorial.

Andy.

[Terry Denham]

Perhaps their deaths were not confirmed until after the date of reallocation.

They may have been still classed as missing at that date.

[Guest Ian Bowbrick]

Terry,

Was there a 'standard' period of time before a missing soldier was regarded as being killed, assuming no remains or personal possessions were found?

Ian

[Terry Denham]

Sorry, Ian, I can't answer that other than to say that I have never heard of one.

[Paul Reed]

From my experience it was around 9 months.

If you look at the 56th (London) Div TF men killed on 1st July 1916 but who were posted 'missing' - many of them were renumbered in early 1917 when they were still missing - but actually of course they were dead and would never have known this number.

[Guest Ian Bowbrick]

So if it was 9 months does that mean that the families or NOK received the soldiers pay until he was officially declared dead?

Ian

[AndrewThornton]

Here is an example of one Territorial soldier who was issued with a new number while listed as missing:

2141 William Crofts, a soldier from Burton-on-Trent serving with ‘A’ Company, 1/6th North Staffords was reported as missing when he failed to return following a night patrol in “No-Man’s Land” on 8th May 1915. His fate remained unknown and in March 1917, when soldiers serving with Territorial Force units were issued with a new six-digit service number, he was allocated a new regimental number (240293) in common with other men then serving with the 1/6th North Staffords.

It was discovered later that Private Crofts had died on the same night that he had been reported missing and had been buried by the Germans in Messines German Cemetery No. 2, which was located at the north-east corner of the village. The Imperial War Grave Commission concentrated a number of graves from smaller cemeteries during the 1920’s and Private Crofts body was removed to Sanctuary Wood Cemetery. He is now buried in Plot II, Row C, Grave 35.

There were also dozens of cases of men reported missing after the failed attack at Gommecourt being issued with new numbers as well.

[Neil Mackenzie]

Which number appears on their grave - the original one or the renumber?

Neil

[Terry Denham]

In the case of Crofts it is the later number.

CWGC would use the number supplied by the military and this presumably would always be the last on record.

[robwilliams]

My work on the Warwicks tended to show that missing became killed after about 12 months, but there was no hard and fast rule.

Rob