Barroway Drove War Memorial, West Norfolk

[chrisharley9]

does anyone know where this war memorial is & indeed if there is one. I'm live about 10 miles from Barroway Drove, but can't find out where it is

All The Best

Chris

[Guest Vicki Howling]

Hi

I know your post was a long time ago but I just wondered if you still wanted to know if there was a war memorial in Barroway Drove? The short answer is no, there isn't one. However, last year a History Group was formed in the village and one of the areas of interest for the group is WW1. We know of at least 5 village residents that were casualties of the war and would now like to find out as much about them as possible and to see if we can trace anyone else who has/had connections with the village. There has also been talk of erecting some kind of memorial. One of our members came across your post and forwarded it to me, so I thought I would just say hello and ask about your interest in this subject.

Best wishes

Vicki

[beestonboxer]

Hello Vicki , welcome to the forum I am sure there will be lots of people on here willing to help if you need it with your research. I believe we have already had dealings with each other through a third party, the result being me receiving a lovely image of Barroway Drove post Office the home address of one of my men in my medal collection, it was very gratefully received.

Regards Tim

[KevinBattle]

Hello and welcome, Vicki

You may not know this, but Chris has deservedly built a reputation as the "Gravefinder General" for the In From the Cold Project which has resulted in hundreds of previously unrecorded men and women being included in the CWGC Debt of Honour database.

I assume these are the 5 you know of?

SMITH, RALPH EDWARD. Rank: Private. Service No: 40105. Date of Death: 24/05/1917. Age: 20.

Regiment/Service: Norfolk Regiment 9th Bn.

Grave Reference: II. L. 3. Cemetery: WIMEREUX COMMUNAL CEMETERY.

Additional Information: Son of James and Sarah Ann Smith, of Barroway Drove, Downham, Norfolk.

CROFTS, J. Rank: Private. Service No: 202611. Date of Death: 03/06/1917. Age: 23.

Regiment/Service: Worcestershire Regiment 2nd/7th Bn.

Grave Reference: I. G. 6. Cemetery: TILLOY BRITISH CEMETERY, TILLOY-LES-MOFFLAINES.

Additional Information: Son of Harry Crofts, of Hoston's Row, Barroway Drove, Bardolph, Fen, Norfolk.

CAVE, W. Rank: Gunner. Service No: 74012. Date of Death: 11/04/1918.

Regiment/Service: Royal Garrison Artillery 353rd Siege Bty.

Grave Reference: I. M. 35. Cemetery: GODEWAERSVELDE BRITISH CEMETERY.

Additional Information: Son of Mr. E. Cave, of Barroway Drive, Downham, Norfolk.

HUBBARD, S. Rank: Private. Service No: 24458. Date of Death: 01/05/1918. Age: 37.

Regiment/Service: The Queen's (Royal West Surrey Regiment) 1st Bn.

Grave Reference: LXVII. A. 31. Cemetery: ETAPLES MILITARY CEMETERY.

Additional Information: Son of Henry Hubbard, of Barroway Drove, nr. Downham Market, Norfolk.

WHYBROW, WILLIAM. Rank: Private. Service No: G/81054. Date of Death: 13/04/1918.

Regiment/Service: Royal Fusiliers 2nd Bn.

Panel Reference: Panel 3. Memorial: PLOEGSTEERT MEMORIAL.

Name: William Whybrow. Birth Place: Norfolk. Residence: Barroway Drove. Death Date: 13 Apr 1918. Enlistment Place: Downham

Rank: Private. Regiment: London Regiment. Battalion: 2nd Battalion. Regimental Number: G/81054.

Type of Casualty: Killed in action. Comments: Formerly 5765, 70th Prov. Battn. C. Surreys.

Why not provide the details you do have and we'll see what we can add for you.

Good luck with your History Group and with this project.

Are your Parish Council and Church supporting this?

A newspaper article could also stir up local memories for you.

[Guest Vicki Howling]

Hello and thank you both for your quick responses and warm welcome to the website.

Glad you liked the picture Tim, I was happy to help.

First of all I must tell you that I am not the person behind the research – that credit must go to Janice, another member of the History Group – and I hope she will join in this conversation as some point.

We have the 5 you have listed but we also have the following:

Herbert John Croxford

Birth – Mar1896, Downham, 4b/339 – Herbert John

1901 census in Barroway aged 5 parents George & Ellen

1911 census in Barroway Drove aged 15 parents George & Ellen (farm lab)

Private 30457, 2^nd battalion, Bedfordshire Regiment

Died 28Jul1917 – France & Flanders

Ypres (Menin Gate) Memorial – panel 31 & 33

Herbert John Hudson

Birth – Mar1893, Downham, 4b/347 – Herbert John

1901 census in Hootons Row, Barroway aged 8 parents Henry & Adelaide

1911 census in Hootons Row, Barroway aged 18 son of Henry widr (ag lab)

Private G/8091, 3^rd battalion, The Queen’s (Royal West Surrey Regiment)

Enlisted 29Feb1916

Died 17Sep1918 aged 25 - Home

Stow Bardolph (St Peter) Churchyard – son of Henry & Adelaide Hudson of Bardolph Fen – in south east corner

Frederick William Towson (on Upwell memorial)

Birth – Mar1890, Downham, 4b/353 – Frederick William

1891 census in Barroway aged 1 parents William & Esther

1901 census in Outwell aged 11 parents Frederick W & Esther

1911 census in Barroway Drove aged 21 parents Frederick William & Esther (assisting in business – engine driver threshing machine)

Married to Clara Judd – Dec1914, Wisbech, 3b/1464

Children:

Joyce E – birth Dec1915, Wisbech, 3b/877

Cecil F – birth Mar1918, Wisbech, 3b/738

Lance Corporal 52205, 9^th battalion, Royal Fusiliers (London Regiment) [formerly 10697 12^th R.W.Fus.]

Died 8Aug1918 – France & Flanders

Dive Copse British Cemetery, Sailly-Le-Sec - (Mrs Towson, Town Street, Upwell) – III.F.5

George Brown – 3 possibles 2 are cousins (b & c) (all born Stow Bardolph)

a)

Birth – Dec1895, Downham, 4b/331 – George William

1901 census in Mill Lane, Wimbotsham aged 5 parents John W (born Northwold) & Elizabeth (nee Barton) – George W

1911 census in Ten Mile Bank aged 15 a servant (farm lab) with Howlett family

Per Ancestry trees he married Elizabeth Bailey & died in 1924 in Romford, Essex

b Birth – Mar1898, Downham, 4b/356 – George William

1901 census in Hootons Row, Barroway aged 3 parents Ephraim & Edith Rose – George W

1911 census in Hootons Row, Barroway aged 13 grandson of Ellen - George (school)

c)

Birth – Jun1896, Downham, 4b/341 – George Willis HUBBARD

1901 census in Hootons Row, Barroway aged 4 son (should be grandson) of Henry HUBBARD – Willis HUBBARD

1911 census in Holts Lane, Hilgay aged 15 parents Hubert & Rose Mary BROWN – George BROWN (farm lab)

Did he marry Dora J Laws Dec1919, Downham, 4b/1123 as George W HUBBARD

Military:

Private 28849, 3rd battalion, Grenadier Guards

Died 27Nov1917 – France & Flanders

Cambrai Memorial, Louverval – panel 2

Janice also has a list of names of others from Stow Bardolph parish without a memorial. (Stow Bardolph Parish comprises three villages: Barroway Drove, Stow Bridge and Stow Bardolph). As yet we haven’t asked the parish or church for any help but we will certainly let them know about the project.

Any help, information or suggestions will be gratefully received.

Best wishes

Vicki

[KevinBattle]

Thanks for the additional details.

You say the Parish comprises Barroway Drove, Stow Bridge and Stow Bardolph but West Head (not West Ham!) and Wimbotsham also seems very close.

http://www.roll-of-honour.com/Norfolk/Wimbotsham.html

Have they included any of "your" men from Stow Bardolph, as it seems to include reference, even if not the men you have.

JERMANY, Frederick William. [spelt GERMANY on SDGW] Lance Corporal 28095, 6th Battalion, Bedfordshire Regiment. Died of wounds 19th March 1918 in France & Flanders. Born and resident Stow Bardolph, enlisted Norwich.

NEWBORNE, Albert J. Private 3060, 16th Lancers (The Queen's). Killed in action 26th January 1916 in France & Flanders. Born and resident Stow, Norfolk, enlisted Downham Market.

You might want to check Downham Market for any with links to your Parish, local knowledge will help here!

http://www.roll-of-honour.com/Norfolk/DownhamMarket.html

(I hope this doesn't ignite some sort of Parish feud, just asking!)

[janice52]

Hi, I'm Janice who Vicki mentioned.

The two men you mention were from the east of Stow Bardolph which is very close to Wimbotsham. The memorial in Wimbotsham is for Wimbotsham and Stow Bardolph (East) but does not include Stowbridge or Barroway Drove.

West Head is not a village as such but an area between Stowbridge and Barroway Drove which I believe is classified as Stowbridge.

I have looked at other memorials and two of the people on our list are recorded elsewhere:

- Ralph Edward Smith on Nordelph memorial (possibly because one end of Barroway Drove is in Nordelph parish or he moved there after 1911)

- Frederick William Towson on Upwell memorial (moved there after 1911)

Is it okay to record people on two memorials?

Janice

[KevinBattle]

I don't see any problem with recording Names on more than one Memorial, where a link can be shown.

Often families moved from one parish to another (often just a cottage or two along took them into another Parish!

As you have NO Memorial and appear to wish to rectify that, YOU can set the Rules!

Well done for wanting to do this, just remember that there always seems to be someone you miss, so perhaps a Roll Of Honour, giving as much background details you can for each casualty.

Local newspapers of the time also often recorded letters from men at the Front, woundings, how many serving from one family etc, so that may be a worthwhile exercise, if you haven't already done so.

I have no personal interest (except for a small mention in the credits) but I would recommend "The Brave Remembered Battle at War 1914-1919" by George Kiloh ISBN 978-1-903099-01-8 available at £12.50 plus postage from Battle & District Historical Society email neil@clephane-cameron.com for a really well laid out way of presenting casualties in a chronological order with a wealth of local details. With only a few (hopefully) you may want to produce a small booklet to help raise funds towards your project. The local RBL and other Service groups might also help in providing resources, if not actual cash.

Good luck!

[chrisharley9]

Thanks for the info provided on this thread.

Chris

[KevinBattle]

Well, it's taken over 10 years to give you something!

[PRC]

To cut a long story short. I was originally misdirected that the C.Nicholls recorded on the Blakeney War Memorials was a Private Charles Nicholls of the Yorkshire Regiment, however no amount of digging could turn up a link between this Stow Bardolph born man and Blakeney, plus I also identified a much more likely candidate.

My next thought was that I might still use the information on the Yorkshire Regiment man when (if !) I have got round to tracking down a war memorial with him on. A quick google search brought me here :-). Hope its helpful.

NICHOLLS, CHARLES

Rank:………………………………Private

Service No:……………………..35217

Date of Death:………………..11/04/1918

Regiment:……………………….Yorkshire Regiment, 5th Bn.

Panel Reference:…………….Panel 4.

Memorial:

PLOEGSTEERT MEMORIAL

CWGC: http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/1642972/NICHOLLS,%20CHARLES

Soldiers Died in the Great War records Private 35217 Charles Nicholls was Killed in Action on the 11^th April 1918 whilst serving with the 5^th Battalion Alexandra Regiment. He had previously been 35210, 9^th T.R. Battalion. He was born and resident West Head, Downham Market, Norfolk and enlisted Attleborough, Norfolk.

No obvious Soldiers Will or Civil Probate.

No Picture at the County Archive.

His mother wrote to the International Red Cross asking if they had any additional information. They replied to her, a Mrs H Nicholls, c\o 39 Queen Street, Ashford, Kent , in March 1919 to report they had heard nothing.

http://grandeguerre.icrc.org/en/File/Details/2569657/3/2/

Birth

The birth of a Charles Nicholls was registered in the April to June quarter, (Q2) of 1899 in the Downham district of Norfolk. Currently no online baptismal records that I’m aware of.

1901 Census

The 1 year old Charles Nicholls, born Stow, Norfolk, was recorded at a dwelling at West Head, Stow Bardolph, near the Eel Pie Inn. This was the household of his parents, Henry, (aged 44 and an Ordinary Agricultural Labourer from Merton, Oxfordshire) and Fanny, (aged 44 and from Stow, Norfolk). As well as Charles, other children still at home are:-

Joseph Edward…….aged 21…..born St Mary’s Cross, Kent……Horseman on Farm

Ada Agnes……………aged 13…..born Stow……Ordinary Agricultural Labourer

George Arthur……..aged 10…..born Stow

James Willis…………aged 7……..born Stow

Frederick……………..aged 5……..born Stow

1911 Census

An 11 year old Charles Nicholls, possibly born Stow Bardolph, Norfolk, (the column is actually blank and he is the youngest child, but all his older siblings were born there), was recorded at West Head, Stow Bridge, Stow Bardolph, Downham. This was the household of his parents, Henry Senior, (aged 55 and an Agricultural Labourer from Merton, Oxfordshire) and Fanny, (aged 55 and from Downham Market, Norfolk). The couple have been married 31 years and have had 8 children, all then still alive.

As well as Charles, other children living at home are:-

Harry Junior…..aged 23……born Stow Bardolph…………..Agricultural Labourer

Arthur George…aged 20….born Stow Bardolph…………..Agricultural Labourer

James William…aged 17…. born Stow Bardolph…………..Agricultural Labourer

Frederic Walter..aged 15.. born Stow Bardolph…………..Agricultural Labourer

On the day

1918 - April

9th –

7.00am placed under 1 hours notice to move.
9.00 am. Ordered to assemble at Trou Bayard. Moved off at 10.15 am.
On arrival found the town of Estaires heavily shelled and the main street impassable.
Also informed the enemy were in in Levantie and finally dug in at map position G.19.4.
2.00 pm received orders to move forward in support to 4th East Yorks taking up a line between farms De Bretagne and Quennelle.
3.25 pm In this position with 4 East Yorks in touch with 4th Yorks on Left, but not in touch with 5th DLI on Right.
Patrols sent out by 5th Yorks found the Left flank of 5th DLI and that there was a gap of some 250x.
7.00 pm A Coy under Captain Parker was sent forward and filled the gap, linking with 4th East Yorks on Left and 5th DLI on Right.
This Company was relieved by 4th East Yorks about 10.00 pm and kept in close support.
Casualties - 24 Other Ranks wounded.

10th –

3.05 am. A Coy left in close support to 4th East Yorks. Rest of Coys and Bn HQ moved back to position astride road about G.20.c.1.9,
Took over HQ from the 5th Northumberland Fus, who were then moving up to take over Front Line from 4th East Yorks.
A Coy was then relieved and rejoined the Battn.
4.05 am Orders were received to move up at once in support to 4th Yorks. The Battn moved at once and was in position astride the road at 6,30 am.
At about 11.00 a.m information was received that the enemy having crossed the River Lys at Bac St Maur was then occupying La Boudrelle.
3 Coys were immediately sent forward to form a defensive flank facing East iin G.15.6 [astride road] and through G.10,c. the fourth Company remaining in G.9.d.
The 3 Companies when forward came under direct and heavy Machine Gun and Light Field Artillery fire and suffered casualties.
The enemy advancing along the West bank of the Lys caused the Left flank of the 4th East Yorks at the bridge to give way.
The line fell back to the general line formed by the 3 Coys thrown forward. On the Left the Royal Scots Fusiliers linked up, but the were very weak.
During the the heavy shelling and confusion one Coy became detached, being on the Left of the Middlesex, who were Left of the RSF detachment.
This necessitated moving up the Support Coy to fill the gap and reinforce the Line.
The Right of the Line gave also and a new line was established.
A sharp salient was formed in G.15.b. Here the Line held for the remainder of the day and all night.
There was continuous rifle fire and constant demands for small arms ammunition and heavy casualties were undoubtedly inflicted on the enemy.
Casualties. 6 OR killed, 29 wounded and Capt EW Robson MC, 2nd Lts GH Lawson, TA Williams and WH Allis missing.

11th –

In the early morning of this day the enemy attacked the Left flank heavily.
The Middlesex on the Left withdrew, but the Coys holding the salient in G.15.b. held on till practically surrounded and many were captured or left wounded, it being impossible to get them away.
During the night, 10 to 11th, the 29th Div had dug in on a Line parallel with and on the West side of the road Trou Bayard to Le Pt Mortimer.
When the Line withdrew it fell back on the line of the 29th Div and the Battalion got badly scattered.
Many detachments remained with the 29th Div.
All others were collected and placed in a Support Line which was being dug by the 50th Division Royal Engineers, running South West from Le Cruseobeau.
At 1.00 pm orders from B.g.c of 150th Inf Bde were received from the joint HQ of the 4th and 5th Yorks to proceed to point L.4 Central and there form a stragglers post to collect all men of the 150th Inf Bde.
Men were collected and the 150th Inf Bde formed a Battalion under Lt Col Thomson, though a very weak Battalion.
The force collected was instructed to move to Brigade HQ at Fierhouck.
At about 6.00 pm the amalgamated Battn with several stragglers from other Regiments were passing along the road L.7.a.b. to L.2.c.d. when they were stopped by a representative from the 150th Inf Bde and informed that the enemy were in Neuf Berquin and told to form a parallel to and on the South East side of the road that they were on
This was done, but casualties were severe from a Light Field Gun of the enemy's.
Orders from 150th Inf Bde received about 7.00 pm instructed the force to hold on till darkness at alll costs and then if unable to hold withdraw and move to Vierhouck where 50th Div were forming a Line running towards Merville.
At about 8.30 pm the position having become untenable and both flanks being in the air, Col Thomson ordered the Battalion to move as directed by 150th Inf Bde.
The Battalion reported Brigade HQ at about 10.30 pm.
The B.G.C ordered the Battalion into the houses in K.16.b. there to remain for the night.
Casualties. 4 ORs killed. Capt FB Parker, 2nd Lt H Speight, 2nd Lt GW Brown and 50 ORs wounded.

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/bandl.danby/519.5thBnDiary.html

[PRC]

While looking for possible probate details on a William Whybrew who was killed in action in 1918, I came across a William Whybrow of Barroway Drove, Stow Bardolph, Norfolk, a Private in the East Surrey Regiment who died between the 11^th and 13^th April 1918 in France. Probate was granted in the Norwich Court to Frances Whybrow, widow. His estate was valued at £1,744 12s 6d. (1918 Probate Calendar).

https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/Calendar#calendar

(Note – you need to check that Frances was his widow, as opposed to a widow – I’ve been caught out by that before).

The Medal Index Card catalogue entry at the National Archive shows him as Private 290971 Royal Sussex Regiment before becoming Private GS/81054 in the Royal Fusiliers.

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D5853261

A possible explanation for the Royal Sussex on the MIC \ East Surrey Regiment on the Probate Calendar could come from another Great War Forum post

“The row of 2nd Bn Royal Sussex Regiment graves at Bois Grenier are from a draft of men who got to the IBD and were initially allocated to 2nd Bn. They were then all sent to join 8th Bn East Surrey Regiment, part of 18th (Eastern) Division, who after heavy losses on the Somme needed replacements and were sent to Bois Grenier as it was a 'quiet' sector. Very soon after arrival the companies the draft was sent to were raided by the Germans and a significant number killed, wounded and even taken prisoner. Their records still showed them as 2nd Royal Sussex and were never updated. So they are all shown in Soldiers Died, MICs etc at Royal Sussex. I only found out the truth behind this as I have medals to two of the men who died in this incident and I looked them up on the contemporary 2nd Bn Roll at the WSRO in Chichester which mentions the attachment; the only source to do so.”

http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=209186

(This relates to August 1916 so may be irrelevant if he went to France later)

At some stage he then moved on to the Royal Fusiliers.

[janice52]

Thank you for the info on William.

In 1911 he was single and living with his mother but I have checked on FreeBMD and found him marrying Frances Allcock in 1916 so the widow mentioned was his widow.

I haven't found anything as yet to indicate when William went to France but I will bear your comments in mind when I research further.

[janice52]

Another candidate for our war memorial has been found. This is Robert Turner who left his estate to his brother who was living in Barroway Drove.

Birth – possibly Dec1874, West Ham, 4a/64 – Robert George W

1881 census in 16 King Street, West Ham aged 6 parents Robert & Eliz.

1891 census in Outwell aged 16 a farm servant with Copsey family

1901 census in South Runcton aged 26 with his sister & brother-in-law (ag lab)

1911 census - can’t find

Private 36280, 9^th battalion, Welsh Regiment (formerly 13771, S.Wales Bord.)

Died 10Jun1917 – France & Flanders

Ypres (Menin Gate) Memorial – panel 37

[PRC]

Oh God. a Turner with no additional information on CWGC, nothing useful on SDGW and no trace as yet on the 1911 census - good luck with that one :-)

Seriously - all the best with your research. Let us know how you get on.

regards,

Peter

[janice52]

It's not that bad as he was my gt gt uncle and a cousin has his medals.

[janice52]

I am looking for war diaries covering the Royal Garrison Artillery 353rd Siege Battery on 11th April 1918 when William Cave died. National Archives WO 95/318/7 only goes up to 31st January 1918. On his service record the entry for his death was received from 'OC.11.CCS' which  I believe is a casualty clearing station. His last posting was to 353 on 19th November 1917. His casualty form says he was returned to duty on 2nd March the report being received from 'OC 353 (S)'. Can anyone help please?

[PRC]

Bit of a long-shot, (no pun intended) but I believe 353rd were Second Army troops at this stage and so details of whereabouts could be included there - certainly my experience with Brigade and Division War Diaries is that they contain copies of the diaries for the sub-units. The Second Army were serving with the Canadian's up to the end of November 1917 so their diaries can be seen on line for free for that period at the Canadian National Archive.

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/lac-bac/results/arch?form=arch_adv&lang=eng&FormName=MIKAN+Advanced+Search&PageNum=1&SortSpec=score+desc&HighLightFields=title%2Cname&Language=eng&QueryParser=lac_mikan&Sources=mikan&Archives=&ShowForm=show&SearchIn_1=&SearchInText_1="Second+Army"&Operator_1=AND&SearchIn_2=&SearchInText_2=&Operator_2=AND&SearchIn_3=&SearchInText_3=&Media[]=&Level=&MaterialDateOperator=after&MaterialDate=&DigitalImages=&Source=&cainInd=&ResultCount=10

 

Looking at what's held at our National Archive:-

2nd Army Gun Maps - 1917 Jan 15-1918 Aug 8 and undated (WO 153/1117) 31 sheets

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C1633881

 

regards,

Peter

[janice52]

Many thanks once again. I will see what I can find in these sources.

Janice

[PRC]

Janice,

 

By co-incidence a men I've just started researching also served in a (different) RGA Battery that were Army Troops in the Second Army. While looking into that unit I came across this thread:-

 

 

Might be worth messaging some of the contributors to see if they can help you,

regards,

Peter

[janice52]

Hi

Progress has been fairly slow lately but I have recently found a notice in the Thetford & Watton Times which identifies a brother of Ralph Edward Smith who had died previously. This is John Thomas Smith who died 14th September 1914.

We now have 13 candidates for the memorial:

George Brown; William Cave; Jesse Crofts; Herbert John Croxford; George William Fisher; Simon Hubbard; Herbert John Hudson; Charles Nicholls; John Thomas Smith; Ralph Edward Smith; Frederick William Towson; Robert Turner and William Whybrow.

Regards

Janice

[janice52]

 A further candidate for the memorial has been found. A memorial notice in the Thetford & Watton Times gave details of Thomas William Sutton son of Mr & Mrs Sutton of Stow Bardolph who was lost at sea on 28th December 1917 on HMS Sapper, a minesweeper. He was living in Gedney, Lincs in 1911 but seems to have emigrated to Canada in 1912, as a farm labourer, where he joined the Royal Naval Canadian Volunteer Reserve as Ordinary Seaman VR/3527. Research shows he was born in Stow Bardolph and in both 1891 & 1901 he was living with his family in Barroway Drove.

[PRC]

There are paper copies of his Service Records held at the Canadian National Archive.

http://collectionscanada.gc.ca/pam_archives/index.php?fuseaction=genitem.displayItem&rec_nbr=1111422&lang=eng&rec_nbr_list=1111420,1111004,1111419,1111423,1111421,1111422

 

Unfortunately, unlike the service records for men in the Canadian Expeditionary Force there doesn't appear to be any plan to digitise them and make them freely available. Could be quite costly to get a copy.

http://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/reproduction-requests/Pages/price-list-service-standards.aspx

 

The Canadian Virtual War Memorial records him as lost on the 29th December 1917 while serving aboard H.M.Trawler Sapper Herbert Bennett.

http://www.veterans.gc.ca/eng/remembrance/memorials/canadian-virtual-war-memorial/detail/4021773?Thomas William Sutton

 

The Canadian Books of Remembrance seem to associate him with Ontario, (judging from the other names on the same page).

http://www.veterans.gc.ca/eng/remembrance/memorials/books/page?page=335&book=1&sort=pageAsc

 

The Naval History Net site shows him aboard the Trawler Snapper, one of two RCNVR aboard the ship when she probably hit a mine in the English Channel.

http://www.naval-history.net/xDKCas1917-12Dec.htm

 

I see father Thomas was still at Barroway Drove on the 1915 Electoral Register.

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2HTF-YPR

 

I also see from the 1901 census that he has a 13 year old brother, Frederick Sutton, born Stow Bardolph, Norfolk, so born circa 1888. The most likely birth was registered in the Downham Market District in Q1of 1888. There is a 29 year old Frederick Sutton, resident Downham Market, who enlisted in 1917. He was Service Number 39332 Northamptonshire Regiment.

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVBP-76R9

 

A second record has a man in the 4th Company Bedfordshire Regiment but with Service Number 40911. He too was resident Downham Market.

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVBR-2Y63

 

The Medal Index Card for a "Fred" Sutton records him as Private 39332 Northamptonshire Regiment and Private 40911 Hertfordshire Regiment.

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D5451319

 

regards,

Peter

[janice52]

Thanks for all that info - it will keep me busy for a while.

The Ontario connection surprised me as his immigration record shows he was headed to Winnipeg, Manitoba but he could well have moved on.

I have found a service record for Frederick who survived the war. He enlisted in Kings Lynn on 1st June 1917 and was Private 39332 in the Northamptonshire Regiment. On 5th September 1917 he transferred to the Bedfordshire Regiment (40911) and was posted to 1/1st Hertfordshire Regiment (still with the Bedfordshire number).

Janice

 

[janice52]

I'm currently working on William Whybrow who was in the 2nd Battalion Royal Fusiliers (or London Regiment) and died on the 13th April 1918. According to the war diary the Battalion was in the 86th Brigade, 29th Division and on the 10th April X Company were permanently attached to the 151st Brigade. 

Is there any way of knowing which company William was with and what became of X Company?

I am further confused as he is described as a private of East Surrey Regiment on the probate calendar.

Also on Ancestry Soldiers died in WW1 he is formerly 5765, 70Th Prov. Battn. C. Surreys which doesn't appear on his medal card (and I'm not sure what the abbreviations stand for).