Photograph- Staff College Quetta 1911

[mrfrank]

#47 has collar badges in the form of crossed hammers or axes…. not exactly clear. But, possibly Pioneer Regiment?

[mrfrank]

#38’s collar badges are difficult to discern even with a glass, but shape appears distinctive.

#37 appears to have a circular design with something above, but not clear at all unfortunately. 

Edited 2 February , 2023 by mrfrank

[FROGSMILE]

38 minutes ago, mrfrank said:

#10 appears to be wearing collar badges with ‘castle/castellated’ design.

…….and just noticed that #12 is sporting a monocle 

Suffolk Regiment then.  

Edited 2 February , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[mrfrank]

1 minute ago, FROGSMILE said:

Suffolk Regiment then.  

That was my first thought Bob, until I realised there were no Suffolk Regiment students on the College roll at that time. 

[mrfrank]

Last crop is of #33’s collar badges……..with the added bonus of a superb collection of moustaches 

Edited 2 February , 2023 by mrfrank

[FROGSMILE]

4 hours ago, mrfrank said:

That was my first thought Bob, until I realised there were no Suffolk Regiment students on the College roll at that time. 

It’s a typical two-tower Gibraltar pattern castle and that wasn’t associated with any British Indian Army Regiment.

The Suffolks reverted from white back to their original yellow facings between the 2nd Anglo/Boer War and 1914 and adopted a new three-tower pattern collar badge in a standard design for all regiments.

As things stand I don’t see what other regiment it might be.  A double check will be to see if either of their regular battalions were in India at that time.  However, it doesn’t make sense given that it was over a decade since the facing colour changed back from white to yellow.

Afternote:  as at July 1910 the Suffolk Regiments’ foreign service battalion was the 1st, but they were in Egypt.  However, that doesn’t prevent an individual officer being posted on the staff of a headquarters, or as an ADC, or MA, to a general officer in India.

Edited 2 February , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[FROGSMILE]

On 02/02/2023 at 14:23, mrfrank said:

#47 has collar badges in the form of crossed hammers or axes…. not exactly clear. But, possibly Pioneer Regiment?

#47 might be 32nd or 34th Sikh Pioneers I think, as both wore fairly simple crossed axes.  I think they were merged with the 1/23rd to become 3rd Sikh Pioneers in 1922 (with the 32nd and 34th becoming 2nd and 3rd Battalions, respectively).

The other officers with distinctive circular devices on their collars are almost certainly from Sikh units I think, as they appear to be representations of the Sikh martial symbol, a Qoit.  See uppermost insignia on central card and officer at bottom.

Edited 7 February , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[FROGSMILE]

4 hours ago, mrfrank said:

#38’s collar badges are difficult to discern even with a glass, but shape appears distinctive.

#37 appears to have a circular design with something above, but not clear at all unfortunately. 

#38 has the look of the badge topped with a crowned lion that was uniquely favoured by 7th Duke of Connaught’s Own Rajputs.

#37 is I think very likely to be the 14th (King George’s Own) Ferozepore Sikhs, whose collar badge was a Sikh qoit surmounted by Prince of Wales’s feathers (in the once popular ‘cricket stumps’ style).  See also: https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/139785-14th-king-georges-own-sikhs/

This might also be useful for tracking names in the staff college photo: https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/247529-indian-army-officer-group-photos/

And a regimental reference: https://www.britishempire.co.uk/forces/armyunits/indianinfantry/14thsikhs.htm

 

Edited 2 February , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[FROGSMILE]

2 hours ago, mrfrank said:

Last crop is of #33’s collar badges……..with the added bonus of a superb collection of moustaches 

48th Pioneers I think, whose collar badge seems to have been crossed axes surmounted by a number and crown.

Part of our problem is that even with those regiments where a collar badge was worn it was usually only the officers that wore them and so they’re very rare.

Edited 2 February , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[mrfrank]

5 hours ago, FROGSMILE said:

#47 might be 32nd or 34th Sikh Pioneers I think, as both wore fairly simple crossed axes.  I think they were merged with the 1/23rd to become 3rd Sikh Pioneers in 1922 (with the 32nd and 34th becoming 2nd and 3rd Battalions, respectively).

The other officers with distinctive circular devices on their collars are almost certainly from Sikh units I think, as they appear to be representations of the Sikh martial symbol, a Qoit.  See uppermost insignia on central card.

Well spotted for #33 having a pioneer badge with what appears to be a crown above. We have two with pioneer badges (#33 & #47). Looking at the Staff College student list at the time for Pioneer units appears to gives us the two candidates and neither had any medal entitlement in 1911. However, units are different to those suggested.

ACSB Ellis - 121st Pioneers

CC Cunningham - 12th Pioneers 

Edited 2 February , 2023 by mrfrank

[mrfrank]

Thanks for the 7th Rajputs tip for collar badge on #38 Bob. Pulled it up and looked again on the photo and I’d say that’s a match. The one 7th Rajputs officer on the roll is Frank Etheridge. 
 

As regards the suggestion for #37, the single 14th Sikhs Officer on the roll has already been identified as #22, Frank Eustice George Talbot and he is on one of those 1913 group photographs. #37 must be another Sikh regiment…definitely a quoit with something indistinct  above. 
 

Edited 2 February , 2023 by mrfrank

[FROGSMILE]

1 hour ago, mrfrank said:

Thanks for the 7th Rajputs tip for collar badge on #38 Bob. Pulled it up and looked again on the photo and I’d say that’s a match. The one 7th Rajputs officer on the roll is Frank Etheridge. 
 

As regards the suggestion for #37, the single 14th Sikhs Officer on the roll has already been identified as #22, Frank Eustice George Talbot and he is on one of those 1913 group photographs. #37 must be another Sikh regiment…definitely a qoit with something indistinct  above. 
 

The simple qoit with POW feathers above was 14th Prince of Wales’s Own Pioneers until he became King and then it was 14th King George’s Own Pioneers with a more elaborate badge, but with the same outline shape.

I’ve scoured through all the other Indian badges and not found the same configuration of qoit with device above.

 

Edited 2 February , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[FROGSMILE]

1 hour ago, mrfrank said:

Looking at the Staff College student list at the time for Pioneer units appears to give us two options, neither of whom had any medal entitlement in 1911. 

ACSB Ellis - 121st Pioneers

CC Cunningham - 12th Pioneers 

 I enclose the pagri badge of the 121st pioneers.  Note pin fastening. The central device might well have also been the collar badge, which seems to have been generic for several but not all of the pioneer units.  The pagri badge was also similar but just with different numerals.

The 12th pioneers pagri badge did not feature crossed axes, but I’m unsure of the precise configuration of their collar badge.

Note collar badge worn during WW1 by the enclosed VCO of 1/23rd Sikh Pioneers. 

 

Edited 2 February , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[PRC]

On 01/02/2023 at 18:19, FROGSMILE said:

Peter that numbering is really helpful, but if you have the time and patience would you mind numbering the four close-ups that mrfrank did early in the thread?  They are the best images in terms of resolution and give me the best chance of identifying the arm, and or unit, of those who you’ve annotated as unclear.

I don't know if it's still of use, but here a numbered version of the officers on the left as we look at them.

From the same area of the original picture we've also had a couple of close-ups posted today.

The officers centred around Officer 10.

And the Officers around 37 and 38.

(No new IP was created in producing the above and all image rights remain with the current owners).

Hope that helps,
Peter

[PRC]

For the numbered individuals shown in the pictures above I believe the current status is:-

1: Thomas Anselan Pollok-Morris, Highland Light Infantry
2: Infantry?, one medal.
3: R.A. or R.E.. two medals.
4: Probably Basil Edwin Crockett, 17th Lancers
5: Arthur Richard Careless Sanders R.E.

9: Francis Duncan Irvine (Royal Engineers), 2nd Queen’s Own Sappers & Miners.
10: Possibly Suffolk Regiment but no one from that regiment known to be attending.
11: Probably Henry Bingham Whistler Smith-Rewse, RFA
12: Infantry? No medals.
13: Officer seems to have the QM with at least 3 clasps (partially obscured) plus KM with 2 clasps. 
14: Native Cavalry?
15: Native Infantry?

20: Probably Henry Charles Swinburne Ward, 2nd Lancers
21: Richard Hope Waller, 38th Dogras
22: Probably Frank Eustice George Talbot, 14th Sikhs. Entitled to the China 1900 medal and clearly visible in the photo as well as 14th Sikhs collar badges in the form of Prince of Wales’s feathers with coronet over scroll. 
23: R.A. or R.E.? No medal.
24: Infantry? One medal – with clasp?
25: Native cavalry?
26: R.A. or R.E.? Two medal.

31: Native Cavalry?
32: Infantry? One medal – with clasp(s)?
33: Possibly 48th Pioneers
34: Gerald Farrell Boyd DSO, 2nd Leinster
35: Harold Lewis, 37th Lancers (Baluch Horse). NW Frontier of India medal+clasp
36: Infantry? One medal – with clasp(s)?
37: Very likely to be the 14th (King George’s Own) Ferozepore Sikhs
38: Probably Frank Etheridge, 7th Rajputs
39: Native Cavalry? No medals

50: College Staff?
51: Matthew Percival Buckle , RWKR
52: Probably George de Symons Barrow, 4th Cavalry
53: Probably Col John Emerson Wharton Headlam DSO
54: Possibly College Commandant?
55: Douglas Haig

Cheers,
Peter

[PRC]

The central group of officers from the Staff College picture, now with numbers.

(No new IP was created in producing the above and all image rights remain with the current owner).

Current status is I believe:-

2: Infantry?, one medal.
3: R.A. or R.E.. two medals.
4: Probably Basil Edwin Crockett, 17th Lancers
5: Arthur Richard Careless Sanders R.E.
6: Infantry? No medals.
7: Infantry? No medals.
8: Probably Edward Douglas Giles, 35th Horse (ex 5th Bombay Cavalry).

11: Probably Henry Bingham Whistler Smith-Rewse, RFA
12: Infantry? No medals.
13: Officer seems to have the QM with at least 3 clasps (partially obscured) plus KM with 2 clasps. 
14: Native Cavalry?
15: Native Infantry?
16: Possibly Charles Richard Foster Seymour, 13th Rajputs. QM+4 clasps.
17: Infantry? No medals.
18: Infantry? No medals.

23: R.A. or R.E.? No medal.
24: Infantry? One medal – with clasp?
25: Native cavalry?
26: R.A. or R.E.? Two medal.
27: Gurkha ? No Medal.
28: Walter Lloyd Sinclair Meiklejohn, 106th Hazara Pioneers
29: Henry Clare Duncan, 1st Battalion, 9th Gurkha Rifles

35: Harold Lewis, 37th Lancers (Baluch Horse). NW Frontier of India medal+clasp
36: Infantry? One medal – with clasp(s)?
37: Very likely to be the 14th (King George’s Own) Ferozepore Sikhs
38: Probably Frank Etheridge, 7th Rajputs
39: Native Cavalry? No medals.
40: Harold Hereward Hughes-Hallett, 2nd North Staffs
41: Probably Thomas George Jameson Torrie, 27th Light Cavalry
42: Possibly George Hutchison, 122nd Rajputana Infantry. China 1900 Medal

52: Probably George de Symons Barrow, 4th Cavalry
53: Probably Col John Emerson Wharton Headlam DSO
54: Possibly College Commandant?
55: Douglas Haig
56: Haig Staffer?
57: Haig Staffer? Two medal ribbons

Cheers,
Peter

[FROGSMILE]

1 hour ago, PRC said:

For the numbered individuals shown in the pictures above I believe the current status is:-

1: Thomas Anselan Pollok-Morris, Highland Light Infantry.  Agreed.
2: Infantry?, one medal.  Yes, Indian regiment given absence of collar badge and his tunic is of pre 1903 pattern with a higher collar. 
3: R.A. or R.E.. two medals.  Definitely RA, as evidenced by plain gold laced pouch belt.
4: Probably Basil Edwin Crockett, 17th Lancers.  Agreed.  White plastron of Imperial style (the Indian was different).
5: Arthur Richard Careless Sanders R.E.  Agreed, as evidenced by wavy line pouch belt.

9: Francis Duncan Irvine (Royal Engineers), 2nd Queen’s Own Sappers & Miners.  Definitely RE officer, attached to Sappers & Miners but retained parent uniform. 
10: Possibly Suffolk Regiment but no one from that regiment known to be attending.  I know of no Indian regiment with Gibraltar castle badge, but Suffolk’s white facings were changed at turn of century, so it implies he’s been away from regimental duty for some time.  
11: Probably Henry Bingham Whistler Smith-Rewse, R.F.A. Agreed.
12: Infantry? No medals.  Agreed, again from an Indian regiment and pre 1903 tunic with higher collar.
13: Officer seems to have the QM with at least 3 clasps (partially obscured) plus KM with 2 clasps. Probably Imperial infantry regiment going by what can be seen of his tunic.
14: Native Cavalry?  Agreed, regiment styled as Hussars, special pouch belt design along with tunic style strongly suggests Corps of Guides.
15: Native Infantry? Agreed, a regiment styled as rifles, and possibly Corps of Guides infantry, but I’m unsure.

20: Probably Henry Charles Swinburne Ward, 2nd Lancers
21: Richard Hope Waller, 38th Dogras
22: Probably Frank Eustice George Talbot, 14th Sikhs. Entitled to the China 1900 medal and clearly visible in the photo as well as 14th Sikhs collar badges in the form of Prince of Wales’s feathers with coronet over scroll. 
23: R.A. or R.E.? No medal.
24: Infantry? One medal – with clasp?
25: Native cavalry?
26: R.A. or R.E.? Two medal.

31: Native Cavalry?
32: Infantry? One medal – with clasp(s)?
33: Possibly 48th Pioneers
34: Gerald Farrell Boyd DSO, 2nd Leinster
35: Harold Lewis, 37th Lancers (Baluch Horse). NW Frontier of India medal+clasp
36: Infantry? One medal – with clasp(s)?
37: Very likely to be the 14th (King George’s Own) Ferozepore Sikhs
38: Probably Frank Etheridge, 7th Rajputs
39: Native Cavalry? No medals

50: College Staff?
51: Matthew Percival Buckle , RWKR
52: Probably George de Symons Barrow, 4th Cavalry
53: Probably Col John Emerson Wharton Headlam DSO
54: Possibly College Commandant?
55: Douglas Haig

Cheers,
Peter

Thank you for all that hard work Peter.  I will methodically annotate your list above with whatever I am able to add.

1: Thomas Anselan Pollok-Morris, Highland Light Infantry.  Agreed.
2: Infantry?, one medal.  Yes, Indian regiment given absence of collar badge and his tunic is of pre 1903 pattern with a higher collar. 
3: R.A. or R.E.. two medals.  Definitely RA, as evidenced by plain gold laced pouch belt.
4: Probably Basil Edwin Crockett, 17th Lancers.  Agreed.  White plastron of Imperial style (the Indian was different).
5: Arthur Richard Careless Sanders R.E.  Agreed, as evidenced by wavy line pouch belt.

9: Francis Duncan Irvine (Royal Engineers), 2nd Queen’s Own Sappers & Miners.  Definitely RE officer, attached to Sappers & Miners but retained parent uniform. 
10: Possibly Suffolk Regiment but no one from that regiment known to be attending.  I know of no Indian regiment with Gibraltar castle badge, but Suffolk’s white facings were changed at turn of century, so it implies he’s been away from regimental duty for some time.  
11: Probably Henry Bingham Whistler Smith-Rewse, R.F.A. Agreed.
12: Infantry? No medals.  Agreed, again from an Indian regiment and pre 1903 tunic with higher collar.
13: Officer seems to have the QM with at least 3 clasps (partially obscured) plus KM with 2 clasps. Probably Imperial infantry regiment going by what can be seen of his tunic.
14: Native Cavalry?  Agreed, regiment styled as Hussars, special pouch belt design along with tunic style strongly suggests Corps of Guides.
15: Native Infantry? Agreed, a regiment styled as rifles, and possibly Corps of Guides infantry, but I’m unsure.

20: Probably Henry Charles Swinburne Ward, 2nd Lancers
21: Richard Hope Waller, 38th Dogras
22: Probably Frank Eustice George Talbot, 14th Sikhs. Entitled to the China 1900 medal and clearly visible in the photo as well as 14th Sikhs collar badges in the form of Prince of Wales’s feathers with coronet over scroll. 
23: R.A. or R.E.? No medal.
24: Infantry? One medal – with clasp?
25: Native cavalry?
26: R.A. or R.E.? Two medal.

31: Native Cavalry?
32: Infantry? One medal – with clasp(s)?
33: Possibly 48th Pioneers
34: Gerald Farrell Boyd DSO, 2nd Leinster
35: Harold Lewis, 37th Lancers (Baluch Horse). NW Frontier of India medal+clasp
36: Infantry? One medal – with clasp(s)?
37: Very likely to be the 14th (King George’s Own) Ferozepore Sikhs
38: Probably Frank Etheridge, 7th Rajputs
39: Native Cavalry? No medals

50: College Staff?
51: Matthew Percival Buckle , RWKR
52: Probably George de Symons Barrow, 4th Cavalry
53: Probably Col John Emerson Wharton Headlam DSO
54: Possibly College Commandant?
55: Douglas Haig

Below is the uniform of #14, the iconic QVO Corps of Guides (Frontier Force).

Edited 3 February , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[PRC]

And here are the officers on the right hand side of the group picture, now with numbers.

There have also been two close ups posted from this area.

One centred on Officer number 18.

The other around Officer number 47

(No new IP was created in producing the above and all image rights remain with the current owner).

Current status for the men shown in these pictures:-

7: Infantry? No medals.
8: Probably Edward Douglas Giles, 35th Horse (ex 5th Bombay Cavalry).

16: Possibly Charles Richard Foster Seymour, 13th Rajputs. QM+4 clasps.
17: Infantry? No medals.
18: Infantry? No medals.
19: Francis Hamilton Moore, 2nd Berkshire

27: Gurkha ? No Medal.
28: Walter Lloyd Sinclair Meiklejohn, 106th Hazara Pioneers
29: Henry Clare Duncan, 1st Battalion, 9th Gurkha Rifles
30: Francis John Joslin, 2nd Royal West Kent Regiment

40: Harold Hereward Hughes-Hallett, 2nd North Staffs
41: Probably Thomas George Jameson Torrie, 27th Light Cavalry
42: Possibly George Hutchison, 122nd Rajputana Infantry. China 1900 Medal
43: Infantry? No medals?
44: Possibly Walter Mervyn St George Kirke, 59th Company, RGA
45: Cyril Norman MacMullen, 15th Ludhiana Sikhs
46: Possibly Eric Fairweather Harrison, Royal Australian Garrison Artillery
47: Possibly 32nd or 34th Sikh Pioneers
48: Infantry? Two medals.
49: Probably Bertie Drew Fisher, 17th Lancers

56: Haig Staffer?
57: Haig Staffer? Two medal ribbons?
58: Possibly George McKenzie Franks, Royal Artillery (College Staff).
59: College Staff? Three medals, one with clasps.
60: College Staff?

Cheers,
Peter

[FROGSMILE]

Arghhh… you’ve broken the list up.  Was hoping to have just one continuous list I could annotate for you.

7: Infantry? No medals.  Yes, Indian infantry and probably Sikh without Royal appellation/association going by coloured facings and qoit collar badge.
8: Probably Edward Douglas Giles, 35th Horse (ex 5th Bombay Cavalry).  Agreed.

16: Possibly Charles Richard Foster Seymour, 13th Rajputs. QM+4 clasps.  Agreed.
17: Infantry? No medals.  Yes, Indian infantry probably with Royal appellation/association as facings appear to be dark blue.
18: Infantry? No medals.  Yes, probably South Wales Borderers as appears to be a metal sphinx on a darkish (perhaps green) collar.
19: Francis Hamilton Moore, 2nd Berkshire. Agreed, definitely Royal Berkshire Regt, the bullion Chinese collar dragon is clear. 

27: Gurkha ? No Medal.  Possibly also 9th Gurkha Rifles, who favoured a Rifle Brigade style pouch belt badge of the pattern with a ‘Guelphic crown’.  However, could be Garwhal Rifle Regiment as insignia very similar.
28: Walter Lloyd Sinclair Meiklejohn, 106th Hazara Pioneers.  Agreed.
29: Henry Clare Duncan, 1st Battalion, 9th Gurkha Rifles. Agreed.
30: Francis John Joslin, 2nd Royal West Kent Regiment. Agreed.

40: Harold Hereward Hughes-Hallett, 2nd North Staffs. Agreed.
41: Probably Thomas George Jameson Torrie, 27th Light Cavalry. Agreed.
42: Possibly George Hutchison, 122nd Rajputana Infantry. China 1900 Medal. Agreed.
43: Infantry? No medals?  This might be 1st Prince of Wales’s Own Gurkha Rifles.  Another possibility is a 130th King George's Own Baluchis that also featured PoW feathers.  The former seems closer but the scroll under the badge doesn’t chime.
44: Possibly Walter Mervyn St George Kirke, 59th Company, RGA. Agreed.
45: Cyril Norman MacMullen, 15th Ludhiana Sikhs. Agreed.
46: Possibly Eric Fairweather Harrison, Royal Australian Garrison Artillery. Agreed.
47: Possibly 32nd or 34th Sikh Pioneers. Agreed.
48: Infantry? Two medals.  Oxfordshire and Buckinghamshire Light Infantry.
49: Probably Bertie Drew Fisher, 17th DCO Lancers. Agreed.

56: Haig Staffer?
57: Haig Staffer? Two medal ribbons?
58: Possibly George McKenzie Franks, Royal Artillery (College Staff).
59: College Staff? Three medals, one with clasps.
60: College Staff?

 

Edited 3 February , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[mrfrank]

Over the weekend I shall have a look at the names outstanding/unidentified and list their medal entitlements in an effort to match them with those evident in the photograph. 

[PRC]

2 hours ago, FROGSMILE said:

Arghhh… you’ve broken the list up.

Sorry - that's why I tried to merge the three pictures into one so that there was one image and one key.  It also meant there wouldn't be multiple appearances of the same individuals.

Would it help if I struck through the second appearance of a name in the partials lists shown above - for example if you've responded for officer 2 on the left hand picture, you don't need to look at him on the centre picture.

Cheers,
Peter

[FROGSMILE]

7 minutes ago, PRC said:

Sorry - that's why I tried to merge the three pictures into one so that there was one image and one key.  It also meant there wouldn't be multiple appearances of the same individuals.

Would it help if I struck through the second appearance of a name in the partials lists shown above - for example if you've responded for officer 2 on the left hand picture, you don't need to look at him on the centre picture.

Cheers,
Peter

It’s no problem Peter, I’ve done half now and will do the others tomorrow.  Thanks for all your help.  We’re totally stumped for those without collar insignia anyway!

[PRC]

@mrfrank

I see you have added Walter Pipon Braithwaite as the College Commandant to your original post. Unaware of that, I’ve been hung up looking for Sir Thompson Capper, who became Commandant in 1906, only to now discover this evening that he was moved to half-pay in January 1911. (Memoranda, bottom left hand column). https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/28471/page/1638/data.pdf

Interestingly one piece on Sir Thompson Capper says while there he met some of the individuals who would play a key role in the British Army High Command of the Great War era, including Haig, with whom apparently he did not get on. Wonder if it was mutual – hence Capper being moved to half-pay not long after Haigs' appointment.  Would add a certain sub-text to this Quetta Staff College picture – Haig was visiting to see how his newly appointed protege Braithwaite was settling in. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Braithwaite

Probably a good idea to flag any new information like that as it comes up in its’ own post – by the time we get to this many posts it increasingly unlikely that anyone who could contribute will read through from the start, (personal opinion based on life experience, hence why I keep adding the summaries every now and again). I only went back to look after I discovered Capper wasn’t going to have been present, in case I’d missed anything relevant about the members of staff in your original posts

As well as a picture, (No.1 in the panel below), the British Empire website adds this on Walter Pipon Braithwaite:-

“In 1906 he transferred to the Loyal North Lancashire Regiment and was an instructor at the Staff College, Camberley being later appointed commandant of the Staff College, Quetta until it closed down in 1914.

In WW1 he started badly but ended much better. His first posting was to the Dardanelles as Chief of Staff to Ian Hamilton. He was not well regarded by the Australians. One of their officers, John Gellibrand who Walter had taught at staff college was quoted as saying that Braithwaite was arrogant and incompetent, with the 'mind of a waiter' meaning that he was only anxious to please influential people. Hamilton, however, spoke well of him, referring to him as his 'rock'. The expedition was a failure and Braithwaite was recalled and sent to the Western Front in command of the 62nd (2nd West Riding) Division, made up of territorial units. They struggled to make headway in the Battle of Arras but the following year they repelled German advances at Bullecourt and Cambrai.

Braithwaite was given command of IX Corps and at the end of September 1918 they achieved a brilliant victory at Bellenglise. Haig ordered them to break through the Hindenburg Line despite previous unsuccessful effort by the Americans. The spearhead was led by the 46th (North Midland) Brigade who were required to swim across an ice-cold canal. The North Staffords overran the German machine-gun positions and 5,000 prisoners were taken. The division captured 1,000 machine-guns and Braithwaite basked in plaudits from Haig and other high-ranking generals. After the war Haig commissioned him to prepare a report evaluating the performance of staff officers during the war.

He held various posts after the war, in India and in Britain. He was Adjutant-General to the Forces in 1927 and retired in 1931. The loss of his son, who had served in the Somerset Light Infantry, hit him hard and he burned all his family papers. He was appointed Colonel of the regiment on 30 July 1929 and was Governor of the Royal Hospital, Chelsea from 1931 to 38. In 1933 he held the post of King of Arms of the Order of the Bath until his death on 7 September 1945. He died at his home in Rotherwick, Hampshire.” https://www.britishempire.co.uk/forces/armyunits/britishinfantry/13thltinfwalterbraithwaite.htm

Image marked “2” in the panel. IWM Q 13521 Major-General Walter Braithwaite, the Chief of the General Staff to General Ian Hamilton, and his son Captain Valentine Braithwaite, who was his father's adjutant. Imbros. 1915 https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205248704

Image marked “3” in the panel. At Gallipoli in 1915 with Hamiliton. In the public domain. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Braithwaite#/media/File:General_Walter_Braithwaite_Gallipoli_1915.jpg
Also from The Courier Mail, but image is stated to be from the Australian War Memorial website. https://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/central-queensland/kitcheners-order-too-brief-in-rush-to-the-dardanelles/news-story/6dd8a342cfe3f36a7387c2f2498ba89d

Image marked “4”
1931 – National Portrait Gallery. https://www.npg.org.uk/collections/search/portrait/mw108230/Sir-Walter-Pipon-Braithwaite?LinkID=mp80949&role=sit&rNo=0

So are they a match for officer 54?

(No new IP was created in producing the above and all image rights remain with the current owners).

Cheers,
Peter

[FROGSMILE]

53 minutes ago, PRC said:

@mrfrank

I see you have added Walter Pipon Braithwaite as the College Commandant to your original post. Unaware of that, I’ve been hung up looking for Sir Thompson Capper, who became Commandant in 1906, only to now discover this evening that he was moved to half-pay in January 1911. (Memoranda, bottom left hand column). https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/28471/page/1638/data.pdf

 

Interestingly one piece on Sir Thompson Capper says while there he met some of the individuals who would play a key role in the British Army High Command of the Great War era, including Haig, with whom apparently he did not get on. Wonder if it was mutual – hence Capper being moved to half-pay not long after Haigs' appointment.  Would add a certain sub-text to this Quetta Staff College picture – Haig was visiting to see how his newly appointed protege Braithwaite was settling in. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Braithwaite

 

Probably a good idea to flag any new information like that as it comes up in its’ own post – by the time we get to this many posts it increasingly unlikely that anyone who could contribute will read through from the start, (personal opinion based on life experience, hence why I keep adding the summaries every now and again). I only went back to look after I discovered Capper wasn’t going to have been present, in case I’d missed anything relevant about the members of staff in your original posts

 

As well as a picture, (No.1 in the panel below), the British Empire website adds this on Walter Pipon Braithwaite:-

 

“In 1906 he transferred to the Loyal North Lancashire Regiment and was an instructor at the Staff College, Camberley being later appointed commandant of the Staff College, Quetta until it closed down in 1914.

In WW1 he started badly but ended much better. His first posting was to the Dardanelles as Chief of Staff to Ian Hamilton. He was not well regarded by the Australians. One of their officers, John Gellibrand who Walter had taught at staff college was quoted as saying that Braithwaite was arrogant and incompetent, with the 'mind of a waiter' meaning that he was only anxious to please influential people. Hamilton, however, spoke well of him, referring to him as his 'rock'. The expedition was a failure and Braithwaite was recalled and sent to the Western Front in command of the 62nd (2nd West Riding) Division, made up of territorial units. They struggled to make headway in the Battle of Arras but the following year they repelled German advances at Bullecourt and Cambrai.

Braithwaite was given command of IX Corps and at the end of September 1918 they achieved a brilliant victory at Bellenglise. Haig ordered them to break through the Hindenburg Line despite previous unsuccessful effort by the Americans. The spearhead was led by the 46th (North Midland) Brigade who were required to swim across an ice-cold canal. The North Staffords overran the German machine-gun positions and 5,000 prisoners were taken. The division captured 1,000 machine-guns and Braithwaite basked in plaudits from Haig and other high-ranking generals. After the war Haig commissioned him to prepare a report evaluating the performance of staff officers during the war.

He held various posts after the war, in India and in Britain. He was Adjutant-General to the Forces in 1927 and retired in 1931. The loss of his son, who had served in the Somerset Light Infantry, hit him hard and he burned all his family papers. He was appointed Colonel of the regiment on 30 July 1929 and was Governor of the Royal Hospital, Chelsea from 1931 to 38. In 1933 he held the post of King of Arms of the Order of the Bath until his death on 7 September 1945. He died at his home in Rotherwick, Hampshire.” https://www.britishempire.co.uk/forces/armyunits/britishinfantry/13thltinfwalterbraithwaite.htm

 

Image marked “2” in the panel. IWM Q 13521 Major-General Walter Braithwaite, the Chief of the General Staff to General Ian Hamilton, and his son Captain Valentine Braithwaite, who was his father's adjutant. Imbros. 1915 https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205248704

 

Image marked “3” in the panel. At Gallipoli in 1915 with Hamiliton. In the public domain. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Braithwaite#/media/File:General_Walter_Braithwaite_Gallipoli_1915.jpg
Also from The Courier Mail, but image is stated to be from the Australian War Memorial website. https://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/central-queensland/kitcheners-order-too-brief-in-rush-to-the-dardanelles/news-story/6dd8a342cfe3f36a7387c2f2498ba89d

 

Image marked “4”
1931 – National Portrait Gallery. https://www.npg.org.uk/collections/search/portrait/mw108230/Sir-Walter-Pipon-Braithwaite?LinkID=mp80949&role=sit&rNo=0

 

So are they a match for officer 54?

(No new IP was created in producing the above and all image rights remain with the current owners).

 

Cheers,
Peter

 

A very interesting rundown Peter.  Thank you for laying it all out and yes, I’m confident that you have correctly identified him in subject staff college photo.

[PRC]

I tried checking out Hart’s for a few of the names who were students at Quetta in 1911 to see when they first appear subsequently with the p.s.c. notation.

Captain Thomas Anselan Pollock-Morris, 1^st Battalion, Highland Light Infantry is not shown as p.s.c. in the 1912 edition. In the 1913 he is shown at the Staff College. Same entry in 1914 https://digital.nls.uk/british-military-lists/archive/100748587

Captains Basil Edwin Crockett & Bertie Drew Fisher, 17th Lancers – both shown in the 1912 edition at Staff College. In 1913 Fisher is still shown as Staff College, but there is no entry for Crockett under 17^th Lancers. On the 1914 edition Bertie Drew Fisher is shown as General Staff Officer, 3^rd Grade, War Office, with effect from the 6^th October 1913 – but not p.s.c. https://digital.nls.uk/british-military-lists/archive/100744663

Captain Francis Hamilton Moore, 2nd Royal Berkshire Regiment. 1912 edition has him at Staff College. On the 1913 edition he is shown as “p.s.c.”

Captain Francis John Joslin, 2nd Royal West Kent Regiment. 1912 edition just has him as 2^nd Battalion. On the 1913 edition he is shown as “p.s.c.”

Reason for checking was to get some sort of steer about the potential Suffolk Regiment man and whether it might be possible to identify him through the entries in Harts , Army Lists, etc, etc.

On the 1913 edition of Harts a Captain George Henry Walford of the Suffolk Regiment is shown as being at Staff College since the 23^rd January 1911. But on the 1912 edition as well as Walford there is a Captain Walter Norris Nicholson who was recorded as studying at Staff College since the 22^nd January 1910. On the 1913 edition Walter Norris Nicholson is shown as “p.s.c.” and Deputy Assistant Adjutant and Quarter Master General, South Africa, with effect from the 14^th June 1912. The 1914 edition has Walford with the 2^nd Battalion, but no reference to “p.s.c.”. https://digital.nls.uk/british-military-lists/archive/100746751

Walter Norris Nicholson would go on to write at least two books, one on administrative staff work in the British Army 1914-18, and another on The Suffolk Regiment 1928-1946. Some versions of the later appear to have a picture of him on the front cover, but the images I could find of it were all too low quality to make a comparison. See for example https://books.google.co.uk/books/about/The_Suffolk_Regiment_1928_to_1946.html?id=Ij4DAAAAMAAJ&redir_esc=y

So I took another look at George Walford. Major George Henry Walford, p.s.c., Suffolk Regiment, was killed in action at Zonnebeke on the 19^th April 1915. The Imperial War Museum has a photograph and obituary for him. https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205390232

The latter includes the information that he was gazetted into the Suffolk Regiment after Sandhurst in February 1898. From January 1903 to January 1904 he was on special service with the Somaliland Field Force, receiving the medal with clasp. That should rule out officer number 10, who does not appear to be wearing any medals. But while there is nothing to indicate where he served or attended Staff College, it does go on to note that he was well-known in India and Ceylon as a big game hunter.

Here’s the facial comparison. I don’t think they are the same man, but there is just enough there to make me hesitate.

(No new IP was created in producing the above and all image rights remain with the current owners).

Cheers,
Peter