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The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

Cuff rank Great War era tunic


paddyhickey

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Hello all.

I came across the below tunic on an auction site and am thinking of acquiring it. It appears to be an early war khaki drill tunic. Is it possible to tell with such poor photos if it is likely to be an original?

I am happy to take a risk if on it if it's a probable or even a possible but obviously if it's a clear fake I would not touch it.

Many thanks 

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1100300658.jpeg

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A very quick search suggests Wrenn Bennett and Co were founded in 1938 in India.

This obviously doesn’t say whether the garment is genuine or otherwise, simply that it may be later.

The WW1 ribbons could easily have been earned and simply transferred to the new tunic when issued to the original medal recipient. The cuff rank is Lieutenant though you probably know this.

Simon

Edited by mancpal
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Quote

A very quick search suggests Wrenn Bennett and Co were founded in 1938 in India.

It would appear that Wrenn, Bennett & Co were founded long before 1938, see:

http://madrasramblings.blogspot.com/2017/05/old-madras-road-11-wrennbennett-and-co.html

Dave

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I concur with Simon and would suggest that it’s probably a genuine jacket to which cuff rank is most likely to have been added subsequently given that such rank marks were no longer regulation at the time the company was established.  It perhaps suggests a theatrical or movie making usage at some point.

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As I said a “very quick search”. Apologies for the misinformation 

Simon

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16 minutes ago, HERITAGE PLUS said:

It would appear that Wrenn, Bennett & Co were founded long before 1938, see:

http://madrasramblings.blogspot.com/2017/05/old-madras-road-11-wrennbennett-and-co.html

Dave

Brilliant spot Dave!  It’s in a state of remarkable preservation for a garment that must be over a hundred years old assuming a WW1 era provenance.

For @paddyhickey: the construction of the jacket is certainly correct for the time and interestingly KD jackets were the first to be constructed with an open rever collar designed for wear with a shirt collar and tie.  First established by the Guards around the last year or so of the 2nd Boer War, they quickly became emulated by other regiments and grew so much in popularity that they influenced the change in design of the equivalent drab woollen service dress in 1911-12.

 

6F9631DA-FCFE-4DDC-8BB0-683467168681.jpeg

Edited by FROGSMILE
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How relevant it might be to the question I don't know, but the label says Bangalore - although that could be a branch

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4 minutes ago, 6RRF said:

How relevant it might be to the question I don't know, but the label says Bangalore - although that could be a branch

“The business had branches in Ooty and Bangalore.”

Edited by FROGSMILE
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  • 2 weeks later...

From the pictures it looks to be a GW period jacket with post WW1 ribbons added by the owner. Cuff ranks were worn into the early 1920s based on some original photographs I have in my collection 

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I notice the maker’s label looks to have been hand tacked. Was that unusual? I would have expected it to be machine sewn.

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9 minutes ago, PhilB said:

I notice the maker’s label looks to have been hand tacked. Was that unusual? I would have expected it to be machine sewn.

I don’t think so Phil.  A lot more was done by hand then, especially so for officers, who were paying a premium for a bespoke service.  Perceptions were important and the tailors knew that.  Competition was cutthroat.

Edited by FROGSMILE
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Thanks to all again for contributing on this.

The tunic itself was up for auction and had not been recognized as a great war era artifact by the auctioneer, who had put it's opening bid at 10 pounds. I assume that is a reasonable starting price for a modern mass produced tunic. 

Needless to say I was worried it was too good to be true. On the strength of advice here I put in a bid but my maximum was rapidly exceeded since a lot of auction watchers had also realised what had happened. It went for £550. I hope it gives the owner many years of satisfaction! 

 

Rgds

 

Paddy

 

 

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2 hours ago, PhilB said:

I notice the maker’s label looks to have been hand tacked. Was that unusual? I would have expected it to be machine sewn.

As Frogsmile said labels were hand stitched as uniforms were made to each officers requirement. Indeed I would be concerned if I found a machined label of a jacket such as that shown in the original post.

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On 16/01/2023 at 16:38, PhilB said:

As a matter of interest, what were the shoulder titles?

Looks like 2D to me, Royal Scots Greys.    Pete.

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