AndyBsk Posted 4 September , 2022 Share Posted 4 September , 2022 When the M1887 have same lenght of blade and profile as M1890 so it could be used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 4 September , 2022 Share Posted 4 September , 2022 Yes, should fit! Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 4 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 4 September , 2022 3 hours ago, trajan said: Yes, should fit! Julian Brill ta That's my pocket money gone! Mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 4 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 4 September , 2022 5 hours ago, AndyBsk said: When the M1887 have same lenght of blade and profile as M1890 so it could be used. Thank you Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 4 September , 2022 Share Posted 4 September , 2022 Mick, You might want to let a museum curator have a look at this frog. If it has "red-rot" it will gradually crumble away over the years; may need treatment with"CELLUGEL" to consolidate. Do NOT apply any leather conditioner/saddle soap/cream etc., as they will also eventually damage the leather!! Regards, JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 5 September , 2022 Share Posted 5 September , 2022 With my archaeological hat on it has probably already gone too far... Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peregrinvs Posted 5 September , 2022 Share Posted 5 September , 2022 (edited) I’d have said the frog was a bit of a write off. As regards a replacement, a P08 or P14 frog would be suitable for a WWI appearance or a P37 or P39 frog for a WWII appearance. A P37 would be the easiest to find. Edited 5 September , 2022 by peregrinvs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 5 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 5 September , 2022 13 hours ago, JMB1943 said: Mick, You might want to let a museum curator have a look at this frog. If it has "red-rot" it will gradually crumble away over the years; may need treatment with"CELLUGEL" to consolidate. Do NOT apply any leather conditioner/saddle soap/cream etc., as they will also eventually damage the leather!! Regards, JMB Thank you I am going to seek advice I want to see if the upper broken band can be repaired, there is a leather specialist near me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 5 September , 2022 Share Posted 5 September , 2022 Mick, I think I’d agree with both Trajan and peregrinvs, that frog is beyond saving….If it were mine it would have be in landfill by now, but in theory it could be restored but at what cost…. I think I paid £20 for the last P39, and 37’s regularly turn up for half that. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 5 September , 2022 Share Posted 5 September , 2022 38 minutes ago, Mick M said: Thank you I am going to seek advice I want to see if the upper broken band can be repaired, there is a leather specialist near me... Good luck! We look forward to your report! Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 5 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 5 September , 2022 4 hours ago, Dave66 said: Mick, I think I’d agree with both Trajan and peregrinvs, that frog is beyond saving….If it were mine it would have be in landfill by now, but in theory it could be restored but at what cost…. I think I paid £20 for the last P39, and 37’s regularly turn up for half that. Dave. You are probably right, I do have a problem with binning stuff, but it will depend on cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 5 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 5 September , 2022 10 hours ago, peregrinvs said: I’d have said the frog was a bit of a write off. As regards a replacement, a P08 or P14 frog would be suitable for a WWI appearance or a P37 or P39 frog for a WWII appearance. A P37 would be the easiest to find. Brilliant thank you, I only decided to keep it as it is a ligitimate additional item to a 1913 Bayonet but from what I'm reading my example hasn't got reissue marks for 1939 anyway....I have a lot more to learn but this is a great start. Mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 6 September , 2022 Share Posted 6 September , 2022 On 05/09/2022 at 17:39, Mick M said: You are probably right, I do have a problem with binning stuff, but it will depend on cost. Leather rot is catching on damaged items, IIRC, so keep well away from other items! Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 6 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 6 September , 2022 3 hours ago, trajan said: Leather rot is catching on damaged items, IIRC, so keep well away from other items! Julian Thanks, any signs and symptoms to look out for? There is no mould or anything obvious just cracking and neglect damage. Mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 6 September , 2022 Share Posted 6 September , 2022 Mick, It’s called “red rot” because a leather gets a reddish look, and will eventually crumble away to a red dust. I don’t know whether your frog does have red rot or not, so that is why you might want to check with a professional who will know. Good luck, and let us know any outcomes. Regards, JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 7 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 7 September , 2022 9 hours ago, JMB1943 said: Mick, It’s called “red rot” because a leather gets a reddish look, and will eventually crumble away to a red dust. I don’t know whether your frog does have red rot or not, so that is why you might want to check with a professional who will know. Good luck, and let us know any outcomes. Regards, JMB Will do thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 12 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 12 September , 2022 On 04/09/2022 at 09:24, AndyBsk said: When the M1887 have same lenght of blade and profile as M1890 so it could be used. I've sourced a bayonet but the seller says the blade length is 460mm, my scabbard is about 400 but missing the end cap would that be about right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 12 September , 2022 Share Posted 12 September , 2022 (edited) Mick,, Your Patt. 1913 bayonet is identical to the Patt. 1907, with the exception of the cross-guard. The blade lengths are therefore identical at 17 inches = 432 mm. Don’t buy this scabbard thinking that you will buy the missing metal tip (the chape) later—- you would need to be very lucky to find one! Instead, buy a complete example; I’m sure that @Dave66 will be able to point you in the direction of a source in the UK. Regards, JMB Edited 13 September , 2022 by JMB1943 typos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 12 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 12 September , 2022 1 hour ago, JMB1943 said: Mick,, Your Patt. 1913 bayonet is identical to the Patt. 1907, with the exception of the pommel. The blade lengths are therefore identical at 17 inches = 432 mm. Don’t buy this scabbard thinking that you will buy the missing metal tip (the chape) later—- you would need to be very lucky to find one! Instead, buy a complete example; I’m sure that @Dave66 will be able to point you in the direction of a source in the UK. Regards, JMB Thanks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 12 September , 2022 Share Posted 12 September , 2022 (edited) I can’t help with the scabbard question Mick, but nice to see that the bayonet collecting bug has well and truly bitten😂,…but I do echo JMB’s comment about trying to find a spare Turkish scabbard chape, virtually impossible where we are here. Enjoy the hunt Mick, Edit…how did you get on with the frog problem?? Edit….the Malvern flea is on Sunday…..you never know what you may find……http://www.b2bevents.info/malvern_flea.html Dave. Edited 12 September , 2022 by Dave66 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 12 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 12 September , 2022 1 hour ago, Dave66 said: I can’t help with the scabbard question Mick, but nice to see that the bayonet collecting bug has well and truly bitten😂,…but I do echo JMB’s comment about trying to find a spare Turkish scabbard chape, virtually impossible where we are here. Enjoy the hunt Mick, Edit…how did you get on with the frog problem?? Edit….the Malvern flea is on Sunday…..you never know what you may find……http://www.b2bevents.info/malvern_flea.html Dave. I have the frog separated waiting to see a local leather worker, its just a shame to bin it without making some effort. Re the scabbard I need a metal fabricator shouldn't be 2 hard the basic shape is the scabbard end, I need a guide on length. I just thought the difference between blade length if the Turkish blade and the scabbard without the end cap seemed a bit out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 12 September , 2022 Share Posted 12 September , 2022 4 minutes ago, Mick M said: I have the frog separated waiting to see a local leather worker, its just a shame to bin it without making some effort. Re the scabbard I need a metal fabricator shouldn't be 2 hard the basic shape is the scabbard end, I need a guide on length. I just thought the difference between blade length if the Turkish blade and the scabbard without the end cap seemed a bit out. Best of luck Mick, I think we would all be interested to see the results of both the scabbard and frog restoration, good to have these little projects. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 12 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 12 September , 2022 8 minutes ago, Dave66 said: Best of luck Mick, I think we would all be interested to see the results of both the scabbard and frog restoration, good to have these little projects. Dave. Ta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick M Posted 21 September , 2022 Author Share Posted 21 September , 2022 Just bought my second bayonet to go with my Ottoman scabbard. Following a few other threads, the release button is on the right side but the Arabic writing looks different to other pics in that it is not as high or perhaps not on 2 levels. The scabbard is to short as the blade will not push through, it is clearly designed for a shorter blade, I was wondered if not a shorter design a shortened version of the bayonet perhaps? Any steer to my bayonet would be nice? Mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyBsk Posted 21 September , 2022 Share Posted 21 September , 2022 Looks like a early M1887 bayonet.I assume the maker is WKC Solingen and date in Hijra 1306. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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