Help with Military Cross please.................

[dutchbarge]

I'm not up on medals......ribbon bars on tunics are more my thing......however, the MC in the attached photos has come my way and I have a few doubts about it.....

1. At 36.6 MM the ribbon is quite a bit wider than examples in my collection.....however, I burn tested a thread from the ribbon (see fotos) and it does appear to be either silk or cotton. .....the ribbon also displays a nice 'browning' patina. 

2. The suspension bar's ring is circular and appears to be soldered to the bar.......I'm more familiar with the typical 'struck' suspension bar with an integral 'U' shaped ring that is slightly thinner than the bar and, when viewed from the obverse, is lower than the bar and displays with a definite and attractive ridge.  The suspension bar, at 40.8 MM seems a bit wider than I've seen.

3.  The dimensions of the cross are:

width horizontal, (from crown tip to crown tip) 43.1 MM, (from flat to flat) 39.8 MM

width, vertical, (from crown tip to top of ring) 45.8 MM, (from flat to flat) 39.7 MM

width of cross arms, 9.3 MM

thickness (without any embossed features included), 1.9 MM to 2 MM

I have serious doubts about the suspension bar and ribbon.  I don't know what to think about the cross itself.  

I'm sure one of the Forum members can help me suss out what's up.

Cheers, Bill

Edited 19 August , 2022 by dutchbarge

[roselyn2]

I would say it’s a copy.  The holes on the Suspender and the hole on medal that the ring goes through should be chamfered.   Hope this helps .  Lyn.

Edited 19 August , 2022 by roselyn2

[scottmarchand]

Its a copy. The suspension bar is thin a n lacks the 'step' between the eye and the bar. the suspension on the cross is the wrong shape,and thickness. the obverse side is also a 'tell'' the loop for the suspensiosn ring is too big and they typically have a recessed bevel to prevent the ring from binding when moving around on a swing mount.  The thickness of the cross looks too shallow and the details on the front are shallow and not well defined, so a very light stamping - the edges and the points ont he cross are not crisp. Fairly typical of what is generically called a 'tailors copy' - the Ribbons are not indicative or originality - other thant being a nice original style ribbon.

Here is a link to one at a dealers that illustrates the details I've tried to describe. https://www.emedals.com/europe/great-britain/groups-single-decorations-for-gallantry/military-cross/wwi-military-cross-for-actions-at-morchies-1918-gb2617

[dutchbarge]

Hello Scott,

Thank you for your illuminating reply......much as I expected.  What is a 'tailor's copy'?  Do you care to speculate on whether this is a modern reproduction or an older private purchase 'replacement' copy?  Cheers, Bill

[roselyn2]

A copy is a copy. I don’t bother with any.  When you’ve got to apologise for a medal you are in trouble.  It takes away from the genuine medals that could be in the group.  Lyn.

[Ivor Anderson]

A definite copy - as already noted it lacks the 'step' between the eye on the suspension bar as on a genuine MC:

It also lacks a rear recessed bevel on the cross hole, as on genuine MCs (commonly referred to as 'chamfered'):

This thread may help too: https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/236019-military-cross/#comment-2360946

 

Edited 21 August , 2022 by Ivor Anderson