Sgt Douglas St Patrick O’Leary (M.M), 1st Battalion King’s Royal Rifle Corps, Service N° 11795

[George Millar]

Hello all,

I’ve just started doing some research on the above soldier. With a name like his you would think he was Irish but in fact he was born in 1887 in Carisbrooke, Isle of Wight, Hampshire.  However, his father John O’Leary was Irish born in about 1838 in Co Cork, Ireland and his mother Rose Ann Taylor was born in 1850 in Brayford, Devon.  Douglas’ father John it seems was a soldier although which regiment he served in isn’t known at this time. Douglas was one of a family of seven children born to John and Rose Ann having three brothers and three sisters.

By the time of the 1881 England Census the family were living in Royal Exchange, Whippingham in the Isle of Wight and John was listed as a “Pensioner” which I presume means that he had been discharged from the Army at this time. However, by the 1891 England census they had relocated to Alma Cottage in Greenville Lane, Carisbrooke, Isle of Wight and Douglas’ father John was now listed as a “General Labourer”.

Douglas’ father John died sometime prior to 1894 and his mother Rose Ann remarried to John Griffiths in 1894 in the Isle of Wight. It seems that Douglas wanted to follow in his father’s footsteps and he decided to join the army. He attested on the 10th July 1902 in Gosport into the King’s Royal Rifle Corps with a Service N° 4502. He was still only fifteen years and ten months old when he attested. He then served in Malta from the 18th November 1902 until the 26th February 1905, then in Cyprus from the 27th February 1905 until the 28th February 1906, then in Egypt from the 1st March 1906 until the 12th February 1909 returning home to the UK and served until the 9th July 1914 when he was discharged on the termination of his 1st Period of Engagement..

It can be assumed that he was called back to the colours when the First World War broke out in August 1914. From his Medal Rolls Index card, Douglas went to France on the 13th September 1914 with the rest of the 1st Battalion King’s Royal Rifle Corps as part of the 6th Brigade in the 2nd Division. Douglas was unfortunately killed in action on the 27th July 1916 during the battalion’s attack on Delville Wood. His body was never found and his name is listed on Pier and Face 13A & 13B of the Thiepval Memorial. Sometime prior to his death Douglas won the Military Medal, he is mentioned in the battalion’s war diary on the 10th June 1916 as being the first man in the battalion to win this award. He is also mentioned in the 2nd June 1916 edition of the London Gazette and 5th June 1916 edition of the Edinburgh Gazette.. Reading past posts where soldiers have won the Military Medal, the actual event is usually three to four months prior to it being mentioned in the London Gazette. However, I have read the Battalion’s War Diary and I cannot find where or for what he would have won the award. I know that the details of winning the award are rarely available but if anyone could at least give me an idea of where or on what date he might have won it would be appreciated.

Serjeant Douglas St. Patrick O'leary - CWGC Certificate.pdf

[AndrewSid]

George,

I did find the below but not much use.

Have you tried the brigade or even division war diary?  you may get lucky there.

I would tag Ivor Anderson for a steer regarding reporting lags for awards but I don’t know how too?

 

 

[charlie962]

Minor point. Your title says 11796 but mic says 11795?

[charlie962]

Twice wounded:

Caslist 8/12/14(report 8/12/14) L.Cpl

 

Caslist 11/6/15(report 25/5/15) L.Cpl

Perhaps his award related to one of these events or even cumulative?

Charlie

 

Edited 3 July , 2022 by charlie962

[charlie962]

Findmypast has a hospital admission showing up that first wounding being perhaps 3/11/14 (or perhaps date of admit to No2 GH?).

With A Coy.

He was gsw left shouder. Disch to conv camp 9/11/14.

[charlie962]

Given the MM was only introduced 25/3/16 but backdated, it could be his award was a backdated one? 

We await words from Ivor.

[RussT]

He is mentioned/listed in the Chronicle of the KRRC, which I suppose is not surprising in the general sense.

But I couldn't find him mentioned specifically in the Chronicles with respect to how he won the MM.

Regards

Russ

 

[AndrewSid]

Retrospectively awarded back to 1914!

you might need to look at earlier war diaries George…

[Ivor Anderson]

His MM was in the LG on 3rd June 1916: https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/29608/supplement/5595 The very first MM gazette!

Bate & Williamson identify that gazette as being retrospective awards, potentially for actions from 1914 to 1 April 1916. The fact that he is mentioned in the battalion’s war diary on the 10th June 1916 (post the LG entry) as being the first man in the battalion to win this award, indicates that it must be connected to a specific act of gallantry. The MM was only instituted in March 1916, so it must have been recommended soon after that. It may be connected to a downgraded/declined DCM recommendation.

His MM Index Card off TNA shows it had an authorisation ref of 68/121/5 (which may include other MMs in this LG) and an individual schedule number 24293.

I would work back through the WD to see if his name previously appears.

Edited 3 July , 2022 by Ivor Anderson

[Ivor Anderson]

Technically, he was not the first MM awarded to the Bn. as James Larkman's MM has the schedule number before his, and was recommended at the same time (same ref. no.) in the same gazette. Others were in the 21st Oct 1916 L gazette (e.g. A598 G. E. Jones). (TNA image):

Edited 3 July , 2022 by Ivor Anderson

[Ivor Anderson]

1 hour ago, charlie962 said:

Twice wounded:

Caslist 8/12/14(report 8/12/14) L.Cpl

 

Caslist 11/6/15(report 25/5/15) L.Cpl

Perhaps his award related to one of these events or even cumulative?

As Charlie suggests it may be worth checking the WD around Nov 1914 or April-May 1915 first. Look for Larkman too. They must be connected somehow.

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7351981

Edited 3 July , 2022 by Ivor Anderson

[Ivor Anderson]

From British Medal Forum: https://britishmedalforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=569482&hilit=1472+larkman#p569482   DCM recommended 29/09/15!

ALSO here: https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/166951-asgt-james-larkman-mm-1st-btn-krrc/#comment-1624657

 

Edited 3 July , 2022 by Ivor Anderson

[George Millar]

Firstly, many thanks to everyone for their comments and sorry for the delay in replying. Regarding his Service N°, not sure but the title does show the Service N° 11795 unless someone has now updated it.  Ivor, I'll now look back in the War Diaries to 1914 to see if anything crops up. Charlie962, I'll have a look around the dates when he was a casualty the 12/1914 and the 5/1915 to see if there is anything there. Once again, many thanks to all that took the time to comment.

George

[charlie962]

Sad story for Larkman. 

Thus highly probably a DCM downgrade backdated for O'Leary given how he was such an early MM. The reference in war diary to him being first MM might suggest his action pre-dated Larkman's? Thus his second wounding, probably mid May, would be well worth investigation.

Charlie

[George Millar]

Hello all,

I’ve gone through the 1st battalion’s war diary and the only accounts I can find with Sgt O’Leary’s name mentioned are as follows:

31st October 1914

Following the death of Prince Maurice of Battenberg, the grandson of Queen Victoria and a Lieutenant in the 1st Battalion who was killed on the 27th October 1914, Sgt O’Leary was one of those of the battalion who attended his funeral at Ypres Town Cemetery. (see war diary).

 12th November 1914

The war diary quotes the following:

About 6:30 am I looked out of the window of our Headquarter House and saw about 50 Germans, 1200 yards away, in front of and among some houses near the cross roads N of 6th Kilometre on the BEOELAERE road. Apparently they had broken through the French line, near that point and taken up a position just west of the road. Sgt O’Leary, the servants and Headquarter signallers manned the windows and some holes in the roof and opened fire. We told the Artillery Officer who was in charge of two 18 pdr Field guns about 50 yards from our house, he turned his guns round and after he had fired a few shells the Germans got up in a body and ran out of sight from us behind the houses. Our guns continued to fire on the houses but the Germans continued to hold the cross roads and the French failed to dislodge them.

We kept the Headquarters with their equipment on all day and some of the Highland Light Infantry and 1st Coldstreams were sent up in the afternoon to fill the gap in the line.

“A” Company still holding trenches had two Riflemen Killed.

Following Charlie962 comments about the casualty lists, I have checked the battalion’s war diary for December 1914 but it jumps from the 4th to the 10th December 1914 without any comment so it is difficult to see how Sgt O’Leary was wounded. Similarly, for the casualty list of the 11th June 1915 (reported 25th May 1915) again nothing to report. The battalion were in billets at Allouagne from the 20th May and over the following days didn’t report any casualties. The battalion took over the trenches on the 30th May and reported one other rank wounded the following day. Three men were then wounded on the 1st June. However, after another stint in the line no casualties were reported and they were back in billets on the 12th June 1915.

I haven’t access to Find my past so cannot confirm Charlie’s findings but one thing I find odd is that in the war diary from 1914 he is listed as Sgt O’Leary but in the casualty lists as a Lance Corporal, are they the same soldier?

[AndrewSid]

George,

it was always a long shot. 

I think you’ve got the wrong end of the stick with regard to casualty lists.  The reports were circa 4 weeks after the wounding incident itself. The problem is that it could be 4 weeks, or 3 or 7.  

It is possible to tie down the very likely incident of wounding by cross referring with the war diary but looking closely at who he was wounded alongside and attempting to find a service record or two to see when wounded and of course  the right Bn .  And also who in the list was killed and looking to see if they were the right Bn, thus giving you a date. It’s not an exact science but I have got it to work more than once. 

For large regiments there is the potentially for  a very long list of casulaties from numerous battalions all listed in alpahabetical and not Bn order. This can be too much to analyse. 
 

 

[George Millar]

Hi AndrewSid,

Many thanks for your comments. I had a good look at the war diary but as you say it's very difficult to tie down if it's a large regiment. i'll have another look and see what I can find.

regards

George 

[charlie962]

For his first wounding, report date 8/12/14 we have the fmp hospital admission showing actual wounding was 3/11/14 or even a few days earlier.

For his second wounding, caslist 11/6/15 I would expect the actual wounding to be about mid may or earlier. With a report date of 25/5/15 this would often be one to two weeks after actual wounding. All in all I suspect c 10-15 May. There were serious casualties about this time. 

But follow up andrewsid's suggestion for others on same caslist.

Charlie 

Edit- looking at fmp newspapers the Dec Cas List is shown with a Report Date of 8/11/14 and names 109 ORs of the KRRC wounded.

Edited 4 July , 2022 by charlie962

[George Millar]

Thanks once again for the information Charlie. With regard to the first wounding, according to the war diary the "Battalion Headquarters and "A" Company were in close support to the Berkshire Regiment in the woods west of Gheluvelt.   Heavy shelling all day but hardly any casualties. Turned out three times during night on account of heavy firing. Casualties : 2 Riflemen wounded." It seems then that Sgt O'Leary could have been one of these men. I'll look into the second wounding and see what I can come up with.

George

[charlie962]

5 minutes ago, George Millar said:

Thanks once again for the information Charlie. With regard to the first wounding, according to the war diary the "Battalion Headquarters and "A" Company were in close support to the Berkshire Regiment in the woods west of Gheluvelt.   Heavy shelling all day but hardly any casualties. Turned out three times during night on account of heavy firing. Casualties : 2 Riflemen wounded." It seems then that Sgt O'Leary could have been one of these men. I'll look into the second wounding and see what I can come up with.

George

The day before there were 9 wounded from A company. The hospital admission has him as A company at this time. 

Edited 4 July , 2022 by charlie962