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Remembered Today:


BarbaraG
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Feel fairly confident that this is the gentleman who served with the Royal Munster Regiment. Any clues/opinions welcomed.

 

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Edited by BarbaraG
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Scotlands' People  have a 52 year old "Daneil" Bryson recorded as having died in the Coatbridge District in 1934. That would give his birth as c1882, so unless he lied about his age that makes it difficult for him to have served "through" rather than "in" the South African War.

Although the name database is far from complete on the Anglo-Boer War site, the only likely candidate there is a D. Bryson who served with the 3rd Battalion Highland Light Infantry. The South African service medal rolls don't appear to have anyone with the surname Bryson serving with the Royal Munster Fusiliers, according to the same website. https://www.angloboerwar.com/

If he had served continuously, even just as a reservist for part of the time, with the Royal Munster Fusiliers, then you would be looking at him having retained his original number, (unless he changed Regiments). But according to Paul Nixons' Army Service number site, the Regular Army Battalions of the Royal Munster Fusiliers would have issued regimental number 3009 at some point between the 10th April 1889, (2814) and the 22nd February 1890, (3344). Given his likely year of birth, no amount of lying by the young Daniel about his age is going to make that a possibility.:)https://armyservicenumbers.blogspot.com/2009/10/royal-munster-fusiliers-1st-2nd.html

I'm not seeing Daniel on any of the British Empire Garrison returns on the 1911 Census of England & Wales - although of course that doesn't rule out him being in transit or recorded on the Census of Scotland or the Census of Ireland.

My best guess at this stage was that he was a time expired pre-war Regular who signed on again in the opening months of the Great War and received a number from the ranges being used by either the 6th or 7th Battalion. Like many units who first saw service at Gallipoli the "qualifying date" shown on the MiC is actually when they sailed from the UK, not the date of arriving in a Theatre of War.

I'm not spotting any surviving service records for Daniel in the pre-war WO97 series, but could be that they were bundled with his Great War papers and both sets went up in flames.

Hope that isn't too many red herrings!

Peter

Edited by PRC
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Many thanks Peter.

Definite link appears to be his brother James in Bellshill.

Found some discharge documents...appear to reference service with H.L.I.

 

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A Pension Index Card at WFA/Fold3 shows that as 3009 on transfer to Z AR 6-2-19 he got a disabilty pension of 6/6 from 7-2-29 to 12-8-19 [Which for a Sgt represented a 20% disability under the then prevailing 1918 Royal Warrant]

M

Edited by Matlock1418
correction of error with number
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18 minutes ago, BarbaraG said:

Found some discharge documents...appear to reference service with H.L.I.

Is there anything else in there that references his earlier military career, as something doesn't seem quite right.

The first page shows him as aged 35 last birthday, previous service being with 4th Battalion H.L.I., regimental (service) number either 1462 or less likely 1762, time expired February 1910.

Age would put his year of birth as circa 1883/84, (assuming the January 1919 date on the stamp on both pages relates), making it even harder for him to have been old enough to have served in the Boer War other than in a non-combat role as a Musician & First Aider.

The 3rd and 4th Battalion in 1910 were Reserve Battalions, made up of Special Reservists. The Special Reserve only came into being in April 1908 and replaced the old Militia Battalions. Because there were new Terms & Conditions of Service, ex Militia men had to sign a new enlistment if they wanted to join the new Reserve. As a result they received a new number. The standard enlistment term was 6 years, although there was a question on the attestation asking the "recruit" how many years they wanted to serve. But even if Daniel had signed up immediately in April 1908 and only opted for two years, he would not have been time expired in February 1910.

Of course he could have been one of the permanent cadre of Regular Army men posted to the 4th Battalion to run training and man the Depot. But the Regular Army Battalions of the HLI issued regimental numbers 1462 and 1762 back in the early 1880's, possibly before Daniel was even born. https://armyservicenumbers.blogspot.com/2014/10/highland-light-infantry-1881-1914-1st.html

If he was Regular Army then a 12 year short enlistment ending in Februay 1910 would have seen him enlisted in February 1898. That would raise the prospect of him seeing service for pretty much the whole of the Boer War but is difficult to square with any of the likely birth years calculated for him.

Hopefully there is something glaringly obvious I'm missing :)

Cheers,
Peter

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His earlier number is 1462, HLI and he attested 9/8/08 and was discharged 15/1/10.

Sourced from his service record, a single page headed 1462, amongst the Munster Fus papers. Aged 26y7m at time of attestation to HLI.

"Ancestry.co.uk - UK, British Army World War I Pension Records 1914-1920" https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/1114/images/miuk1914a_083609-00364?treeid=&personid=&rc=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=nxN649&_phstart=successSource&pId=119657 

And 1462 is the same number for DBryson in the 3rd HLI in South Africa Roll. Entitled QSA with bars Cape Colony and SA 1902. 

"Ancestry.co.uk - UK, Military Campaign Medal and Award Rolls, 1793-1949" https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/1686/images/31794_221482-00716?backlabel=ReturnSearchResults&queryId=2e9405c3ca4a2dd7bcbfe9ac2467b8fe&pId=1320710

 

Edited by charlie962
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