Pte Evan Lloyd, RAMC/7th Btn SWB - Died as a POW at Radomir, Bulgaria

[GMB]

Hi All,

I am currently researching a local lad who died as a POW in 1918. Pte Evan Lloyd  was initially RAMC (70095), but transferred to 7th Btn SWB (48304).

In the soldiers effects he is marked as dying 'on or around 28th Sept 1918, due to starvation and exposure at Radomir, Bulgaria'.

Is anyone aware of the closest POW camp from Radomir? I have to be honest, this is one area of the war I am very low on knowledge. Searching the forum, I have seen different posts, but a lot relate to soldiers who survived the war, and the war diaries are not digitalised as yet. I have looked in all the usual places for clues, and even the local papers are very sparse on information. I can assume he was captured in the Third Battle of Doiran, however, that is complete guess work.

I have spoken directly to a family member and was told he was initially buried on the side of the road, whilst the POWs were marching. He is now commemorated on the Doiran Memorial.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

thanks

Gavin

Edited 18 January , 2022 by GMB

[Gardenerbill]

Hi Gavin, I have had a quick look in the Official History, 7th SWB only played a minor part in the first battle of Doiran, during the May attack (67th Brigade raid on Kristali). They were much more in the thick of it at the second battle of Doiran but this took place on the 18th September seems odd that he would die of starvation just 10 days later. The war diary would tell you on what occasions, raids minor actions etc. men went missing but as you say not yet digitised. 

[knittinganddeath]

Here are some extracts from the NZ papers in case they help.

Source: https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/TS19190307.2.31

 

 

Source: https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/HNS19181026.2.51

 

[charlie962]

6 hours ago, Gardenerbill said:

18th September

That is the date he was reported missing in the Red Cross enquiry form. Those clippings explain why death followed not long after. I've not read of that pow march before.

The RC enquiry also notes him as A Company, 7 SWB.

Charlie

Edit- link to enquiry transcript on Findmypast.

"Record Transcription: British Red Cross & Order Of St John Enquiry List, Wounded & Missing, 1914-1919 | findmypast.co.uk" https://www.findmypast.co.uk/transcript?id=GBM%2FNMPWW1ENQUIRY%2F147590

Edited 18 January , 2022 by charlie962

[GMB]

thanks both, that is hugely helpful, especially showing him as being reported missing on the 18th September following the second battle.

I was a bit funny with the date, as I would have thought he would have survived for a lot longer before dying due to starvation - however, looking at those articles, I am not surprised & may be more to do with the conditions/weather he was subjected to.

First time I have come across this POW march/battle - so a lot of digging to do.

cheers

Gavin

 

 

[knittinganddeath]

Here's an article from Australia, published in 1919, that gives more details of the 7th SWB at Doiran. Source: http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article12399303

 

An extract from an article about "General Milne's Despatch" concerning British involvement in Macedonia. It also mentions that "climatic disease" (malaria?) and influenza severely reduced the numbers of the troops prior to the battle. Source: http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article12399303

Edited 19 January , 2022 by knittinganddeath

[AndrewSid]

Somewhat late to this but I am currently looking at the 7th battalion after my great uncle was captured with them during their ill fated battalion attack of the 18th of September. 

A few points of note. Sadly the battalion war diary for the month of September is missing from the file at Kew.  In my ignorance I didn’t order the brigade one so I have yet to read a detailed account.  The book “ under the Devils eye” is however a good reference point. The war diary absence may have been because it was lost at the time given the near destruction of the entire battalion. 
 

87 officers and men are listed by CWGC  as being killed on the 18th itself. A further 20 died in the following month.  I’m working through these one by one.   They are mix of those wounded and succumbing in a British hospital and those that died after falling into captivity. 
 

I don’t know how many  were taken prisoner but their captivity  was relatively short. By great uncle was reported back with the battalion on the 26th of November. Of the 146 that joined that day from the war diary report  “ a great proportion” of them were recovered POWs.  My great uncle is not listed as missing on the 13 Nov HMSO casualty list, whereas Lloyd is. I venture the missing list had been greatly reduced after information received on POWs from the Bulgarians.  
 

If the 18th September 460 strength of the battalion is correct as mentioned above in the press article then a very rough breakdown of the battalion on the 19th of September is as follows:
50 survived and fit for duty*, 160 wounded in British hospitals , 87 killed, 160 as POWs of the Bulgarians. NB 20 more would die in the next month due to wounds or poor treatment.

* devils own book states 1 officer and 55 men made it back.  Noting some may have been wounded. 

If anyone has a trench map of where the engagement took place I’d be most grateful?

Andy

Edited 9 October , 2022 by AndrewSid

[Gardenerbill]

3 hours ago, AndrewSid said:

If anyone has a trench map of where the engagement took place I’d be most grateful?

Hi Andrew, the Salonika campaign society has a trench map DVD which contains a 1:20,000 scale map of the trenches at Doiran, if you join the society you can obtain the DVD for a modest fee:

https://salonikacampaignsociety.org.uk/publications-and-dvds/scs-digital-collection/

Edited 9 October , 2022 by Gardenerbill

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

My grandmother's first cousin died on the 18th September, in 11th RWF.

Edited 9 October , 2022 by Dai Bach y Sowldiwr

[Gardenerbill]

Thanks Dai, link edited and now works.

[AndrewSid]

Thank-you both for replying.  I will look into the link.

That ever annoying burden of work has distracted me from much further research but of the 20 men dying in the month after the 18th  engagement the majority appear to have succumbed to wounds rather than  poor treatment.  I see what I can turn up.  What happened to the prisoners  in their brief time as POWs is most interesting.

The  whole Brigade attack seems to have been a sadly wasted endeavour.