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Remembered Today:

RAF Unit Interpretation


satty29

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Hello,

I am trying to decipher this RAF airman's service record. I am unsure of what the unit '10 wing' is as a I can't seem to find anything about it online and also the ranks that he holds. Any help appreciated.

RAF Service Record.png

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By April 1918, 10 Wing was at Bruay, moving to Sautrecourt on 1 June 1918. His ranks are Serjeant Mechanic and Chief Mechanic. He would have a service record (RFC) pre-April 1918. Or should have...

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Thank you for the reply. How can I find more about 10 wing's movements and activities? Where would I find this service record if he had one, I've looked on the army service records and can't seem to find anything. Also, his name doesn't appear on the medal rolls and honours for WW1 which would suggest he didn't serve overseas?

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The 1 April 1918 date would suggest he was transferred automatically from the RFC to the RAF on that date. He must have been a young Sgt Mech in WW1 or an old Sgt Armourer in WW2!

 

The National Archives have a number of 10 Wing records:

 

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_q=10+Wing&_sd=&_ed=&_hb=

 

Have you tried (for example) searching Find My Past by his service number? I'd say that based on the 10 Wing reference and his assumed age, he served in France at least.

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He would have been an old Sgt Armourer, he was 59 at the outbreak of WW2! Thank you for the link. I have searched his service number on find my past and the only military record that comes up is the "Royal Air Force Airmen Records 1918-1940" which is where the original screenshot is taken from. Are there any earlier RFC records or are they part of the 'burnt' records destroyed in WW2?

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Using the same form-from Fold3

Doesn't it look like previous service in 2/8 Essex TF from 19.9.14 to15.10.15 then to 'Army' from 16.10.15 to transfer to RAF 1.4.18?

1208.jpg.8485644a81f17aa28c6c683bf8efad29.jpg

George

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Took a look at his service record and it shows service with BEF in France from 5 January 1916 to 31 March 1918 with s/n 2313 and then to Egypt on transfer to the RAF. The latter seems a bit too coincidental but may be correct in terms of date. There is also an annotation "AOC" that coincides with his term in France, which may or may not be "Air Officer Commanding", but seems strange if he was in the Army rather than RFC.

 

I'd suggest contacting the Essex Territorials to see if they have any record of him and a move to an active unit after 15 October 1915. I can imagine that he'd have been working up prior to going to France with the same unit.

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2 hours ago, quemerford said:

There is also an annotation "AOC" that coincides with his term in France, which may or may not be "Air Officer Commanding", but seems strange if he was in the Army rather than RFC.

As an armourer, I suggest that is Army Ordnance Corps ?

Charlie

 

Edit--  looking for clues with near numbers for 2313, there are lots of 1914 AOC enlistments but they begin with a 0 then the four digits. The only one I found as a potential was:

2319 Mansell  Attested AOC 23/10/15

This to me suggests that Waite moved from Essex TF to AOC 16/10/15 and was given the number 2313 at that point. He remained AOC until trf'd to RAF upon its formation 1/4/18.

Edited by charlie962
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Thank you all for the replies, much appreciated. Quemerford, may I ask where you obtained this service record and do you have a link as I can't seem to find anything besides the RAF record I originally shared? A lot of this information is new to me.

I may be wrong but didn't the RFC come under the army until the RAF's formation, but the Army Ordnance Corps avenue does seem more likely.

 

 

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3 hours ago, charlie962 said:

As an armourer, I suggest that is Army Ordnance Corps ?

Charlie

 

Edit--  looking for clues with near numbers for 2313, there are lots of 1914 AOC enlistments but they begin with a 0 then the four digits. The only one I found as a potential was:

2319 Mansell  Attested AOC 23/10/15

This to me suggests that Waite moved from Essex TF to AOC 16/10/15 and was given the number 2313 at that point. He remained AOC until trf'd to RAF upon its formation 1/4/18.

That certainly fits: nice one!

 

Your man's record is available on Find My Past and most of the info came from the reverse side (page 2 in effect) of his card.

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1 hour ago, satty29 said:

Thank you all for the replies, much appreciated. Quemerford, may I ask where you obtained this service record and do you have a link as I can't seem to find anything besides the RAF record I originally shared? A lot of this information is new to me.

I may be wrong but didn't the RFC come under the army until the RAF's formation, but the Army Ordnance Corps avenue does seem more likely.

 

 

I've sent you a PM. 

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Thank you all so much for your help.

What is the rank detailed in the image (it is the rank that he finished on in the A.O.C. before joining the RAF)? Looks to me like "G/Sgt."

Also, reference him being based in Egypt, but '10 Wing' still being based in France was he with a different unit or were they split between the 2 locations? I've tried to find information online about '10 wing' but there isn't anything and all the documents referencing '10 wing' on the national archives are physical copies so would involve a visit to Kew.

Rank?.png

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Very strange; 10 Wing definitely not in Egypt. However 20 Wing was (at Aboukir). But that "10" is very definite. I also don't really understand the 'trans [ferred to] W.R.A.F" statement. 

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Yes its most definitely '10', such a shame as other airmen in the same records have such greater detail in that section. I suppose it will always be a bit of an unknown until for records are released or surface. Any search of WRAF brings up the Women's Royal Air Force which it wouldn't be.

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He'd appear to have an interesting life pre-war, e.g. bankrupt in 1905:

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/Edinburgh/issue/11771/page/1015

He probably managed to continue his pre-war occupation as a cycle agent. He was no spring chicken upon enlistment. 

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Just thinking about that erroneous reference to 10 Wing. I wonder if the clerk got mixed up between numbers and Roman numerals? For example, there's definitely an X Flight and an X AD. Perhaps he/she saw 'X' and read it as the number between VIII, IX and XI, XII and so forth? 

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  • 2 months later...

Just an update to this thread, I ordered his WW2 RAF service record and this also states 10 wing in the unit movement section at the very top (see attached). This makes me wonder whether the mention of Egypt on the country/theatre of serving in was a mistake. Seems like this will always be a bit of a mystery...

10 Wing.png

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