mystery solved 8 years later

[RaySearching]

Way back in 2012  I tried to identify the Alfred James Harris listed on Middlesbrough war memorial

Listed on the memorial roll of the fallen as Harris. Alfred James, S.S Stanhope

See previous thread

However he is not recorded on the CWGC, no entry in overseas deaths not listed on deaths at sea or on the civil death register prior to 1922

Also his death at sea cannot be found reported in any local newspapers in 1917

The steamship Stanhope was sunk in the English Channel on the 17th June 1917 believed by a German submarine (UB-31) whilst on route from Barrow to Dunkirk with rails

22 crew members have been identified as having perished on that fateful day, A.J. Harris was not listed among them and could not be traced

Going back to basics some 8 years later .His medal entitlement gives me his date of birth as 1876

Which led to his Masters + Mates certificates giving me his date of birth as 1st March 1876 born Middlesbrough and his address in 1900 as 8 Benson Street Middlesbrough and in 1902 as 35 Benson Street Middlesbrough

Interrogating the census’s

Alfred can be found on the 1881 census aged 5 residing with his parents George a mariner and Harriet Harris (nee Squire) and siblings at 30 Willow Street Middlesbrough

On the 1891 census Alfred aged 15 employed as an ironmongers assistant, can be found residing with his parents George a sailor and mother Harriet and siblings at 18 Lennox Street Middlesbrough

On the 23rd January 1904 Alfred James Harris married Rose Hannah Boak in Middlesbrough

Rose Hannah Boak a schoolmistress can be found on the 1901 census residing with her parents at 35 Benson Street Middlesbrough

Alfred James Harris not found on the 1901 census

Alfred James Harris and his wife Rose Hannah are also elusive on the 1911 census 

Then the search went cold

Initially I Thought I may be able to find out where his wife (widow?) Rose Hannah, was residing on the 1939 register  but drew a blank

Later I managed to obtain Rose Hannah’s date of birth from a family tree she was born on the 22nd August 1871

Entering her date of birth on the 1939 register brought up several entries’ scrolling through them

brought up a Rose H Hams born 22/8/71 looking at the entry its obvious  the entry had been miss-transcribed

The actual entry reads Rose H Harris born 1871 of 20 Beech-Grove Road Middlesbrough 

and surprise, surprise who was residing with her no less than her husband Alfred James Harris born 1st March 1876 a retired master mariner

Conclusion.

Alfred James Harris did not perish during the Great War, his name was erroneously added to the list of the fallen and added to the war memorial in error

Case Closed

 All done to test us 100 years later

As an aside Alfred James Harris died in Middlesbrough aged 78 in 1954

His widow Rose Hannah Harris died in Ravenscroft nursing home on Roman Road Middlesbrough on the 30th Aug 1956

The offending entry on the list of the fallen

 

Ray

 

 

[DavidOwen]

Well done!

[IPT]

Well it's about time.

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

Well done.
I can never remember, did mercantile marine sailors have a service record?

Would be interesting to see if he was on board Stanhope that day.

[KizmeRD]

Hello Ray,

Out of interest, I had a look on the Middlesborough Cenotaph plaque (online) and located a Alfred Jas. Harris (no unit named), I know its been a long quest for you, but for benefit of people like me who have only just caught up with the original thread, how sure are you that this is really the same person? i.e. Alfred James Harris - the name listed in the book (but thanks to you, now known to have survived), and not another (similarly named) local man whose been misidentified in the book. Have you eliminated all other possibilities?  

https://www.warmemorialsonline.org.uk/memorial/113682

MB

[RaySearching]

23 minutes ago, KizmeRD said:

Have you eliminated all other possibilities?  

M B Only took 8 years but. The straight answer is Yes , all other possibilities have been eliminated

(more than happy to be proved wrong)

David Thanks 

 

IPT sorry for the delay I got side-tracked as usual 

42 minutes ago, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr said:

I can never remember, did mercantile marine sailors have a service record?

Would be interesting to see if he was on board Stanhope that day.

  Service records are few and far between sometimes a list of the vessels Mercantile Marines served on can be found on the masters and mates certificates  

as can be seen on the following pages following  one of  A.J Harris's certificates 

Ray

[ernest james]

Hi

I suspect that TNA have the final crewlist for the Stanhope ON 109238 for 1917.

They hold a crewlist for ON 109238 for 1917  and my experience is that they tend to retain final crewlist details at the time of sinking .

I had to pay for the search and copying of  documents when I used the system but I thought it was good value (and you don't have to visit Kew)

best wishes

ernest james

[ss002d6252]

According to CLIP the N/A hold the last crew list in BT99/3313.

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?name=Search&_cr1=BT 99/3313&_aq=109238

Craig

[RaySearching]

I may be able to find out who the informant was (the person who put his name forward for inclusion on the war memorial) usually a relative

from Teesside Archives in due course,  

Ray

[ernest james]

TNA only states that they hold a crew list for ON 109238 for 1917 not that it is the final one. You would have to confirm it.

The final crew lists I have seen for other British merchant ships lost in WW1 are headed "LIST C & D" and were  filled in after the event usually by the senior surviving  deck officer. It would be interesting to find out if the master completed the final crew list in this case.

ernest james

[PaulC78]

I've just checked the Deaths at Sea records on FMP and there are 22 casualties listed for the Stanhope. The 22nd man is not Harris but an Indian sailor named Mahad Allee. He doesn't appear to be listed on CWGC so I'd be willing to get the DC if he looks like a genuine non-com.

[PaulC78]

Never mind, Mahad Allee is apparenly commemorated as Muhammad Ali: https://www.cwgc.org/find-records/find-war-dead/casualty-details/3062915/ MUHAMMAD ALI/

So, 22 deaths recorded on CWGC.