alecc Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 Hello, everyone! My name is Alex, I am a new one here Need help to atribute this splendid collection of German & Austro-Hungarian officers with black armbands on this postcard below. Could it be the funeral of Franz Ferdinand? Thank you very much! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 (edited) 6 hours ago, alecc said: Hello, everyone! My name is Alex, I am a new one here Need help to atribute this splendid collection of German & Austro-Hungarian officers with black armbands on this postcard below. Could it be the funeral of Franz Ferdinand? Thank you very much! Welcome to the forum Alex. Looking at the styles and range of uniforms apparent I think it is certainly possible to be the funeral of Franz Ferdinand, but there seem proportionally more German style uniforms than Austrian or Hungarian. I would have expected to see more Bosnian and Honved style uniforms. Perhaps forum members @The Prussian , @GreyC and @AOK4can comment? Edited 19 July , 2021 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecc Posted 19 July , 2021 Author Share Posted 19 July , 2021 Thank you, FROGSMILE! Probably,they are missing in photo because the procession was very long and they didn't fit in the particular part? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecc Posted 19 July , 2021 Author Share Posted 19 July , 2021 sorry, but I just noticed Stahlhelms! Soldiers standing on roadside! So it is after 1916... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 2 minutes ago, alecc said: Thank you, FROGSMILE! Probably,they are missing in photo because the procession was very long and they didn't fit in the particular part? That seems a possibility yes, but the real expert opinion will be provided by those I have mentioned. I’m sure that they’ll be along to comment soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 1 minute ago, alecc said: sorry, but I just noticed Stahlhelms! Soldiers standing on roadside! So it is after 1916... Yes, I didn’t spot them either. It could be a funeral for a senior officer then. I’m sure you will soon get more informed opinion once this thread draws more attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecc Posted 19 July , 2021 Author Share Posted 19 July , 2021 Thanks a lot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 (edited) Hi, I don´t see a single Austrian uniform BUT the address of the photographer. He is from Stuttgart. That leads me to the funeral of Graf Zeppelin on the 12th March 1917 in Stuttgart. GreyC Edited 19 July , 2021 by GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecc Posted 19 July , 2021 Author Share Posted 19 July , 2021 yes, very good tip! I thoght those bicorned hats are Austrian but, obviously, my knowledge here is far inferior than yours! Thanks but how sure you are that it is Zeppelin´s burial? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 5 minutes ago, alecc said: yes, very good tip! I thoght those bicorned hats are Austrian but, obviously, my knowledge here is far inferior than yours! Thanks but how sure you are that it is Zeppelin´s burial? Looking at the large numbers of extremely senior officers and officials it's very likely that it is Zeppelin's funeral. GreyC knows his stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 (edited) Thank you Frogsmile, I hope you are correct The ones who were mistaken for Austrians are officals of the royal court of Württemberg. It is clearly a state funeral, later than 1916 (Stahlhelm). If anyone finds another state funeral within the Stuttgart confines during WW1 1916 or later, than your bet is as good as mine. GreyC Edited 19 July , 2021 by GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AOK4 Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 56 minutes ago, GreyC said: Hi, I don´t see a single Austrian uniform BUT the address of the photographer. He is from Stuttgart. That leads me to the funeral of Graf Zeppelin on the 12th March 1917 in Stuttgart. GreyC I immediately thought of Graf Zeppelin's funeral when I saw the picture. Jan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 Thank you, Jan! GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecc Posted 19 July , 2021 Author Share Posted 19 July , 2021 Thank you very much, everyone! Glad that my question was answered so quickly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AOK4 Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 Hold your horses still a bit. It might be the funeral of König Wilhelm II von Württemberg in 1921 as well. I'm checking some things still. Jan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AOK4 Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 I'm not sure but I think the 1921 may be very well possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecc Posted 19 July , 2021 Author Share Posted 19 July , 2021 strangely, google can´t find the name of atelier - Friedrich Clar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 Hi Jan, interesting. Do you have any reverse sides to make out the studio address? Pro 1921: the presence of the court officials with mourning band. Not entirely necessary with Zeppelin. In 1917 and 1920 the studio of the photographer was still at the given address. Unfortunately there is no addressbook for 1921 )online at least), 1922 the address was some place else. So, as I wrote: Your guess as good as mine. GreyC 2 minutes ago, alecc said: name of atelier - Friedrich Clar Not strange. There are lots of studios not easily accessible on google. Check the addressbooks and you´ll find it. GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecc Posted 19 July , 2021 Author Share Posted 19 July , 2021 ok, will try but anyway thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 (edited) If there was a formal declaration of “a state of national mourning” for Zeppelin (which should be recorded if it was issued) then that would generate the wearing of mourning bands. If there was no such declaration for Zeppelin then the Konig of Wurttemberg would seem the more likely candidate of the two. Edited 19 July , 2021 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AOK4 Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 12 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said: If there was a formal declaration of “a state of national mourning” for Zeppelin (which should be recorded if it was issued) then that would generate the wearing of mourning bands. If there was no such declaration for Zeppelin then the Konig of Wurttemberg would seem the more likely candidate of the two. I'm quite sure there was some kind of national mourning for Zeppelin. The man was a hugely important figure. Just comparing the online available pictures, I tend to prefer the King's burial (because of the presence of steel helmets and the uniforms of the men in the funeral procession). Jan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, AOK4 said: I'm quite sure there was some kind of national mourning for Zeppelin. The man was a hugely important figure. Just comparing the online available pictures, I tend to prefer the King's burial (because of the presence of steel helmets and the uniforms of the men in the funeral procession). Jan Yes on balance Wurttemberg does appear more likely. I thought it was striking that the officer in the bicorne hat and heavily laced tunic in the centre of the newspaper article that you posted above, is dressed identically to several figures seen in the original post. Edited 19 July , 2021 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecc Posted 19 July , 2021 Author Share Posted 19 July , 2021 just watched Zeppelin funeral video and, yes, there were armbands but, obviously, steal helmets do not appear but spotted few helmets on Konigs video Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 19 July , 2021 Share Posted 19 July , 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, alecc said: just watched Zeppelin funeral video and, yes, there were armbands but, obviously, steal helmets do not appear but spotted few helmets on Konigs video It seems that by a process of elimination and the excellent contributions of GreyC and Jan your photo now has a likely provenance and context, which is an excellent outcome for such an old and tattered image. Edited 19 July , 2021 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecc Posted 19 July , 2021 Author Share Posted 19 July , 2021 indeed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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