Aviator's Certificate graduates at British Civil Flying Schools - numbers of?

[Errol Martyn]

Just wondering if anyone here has done any research into the number of Royal Aero Club Aviator's Certificates granted per British civil training school for 1910 to 11 Nov 1918, or for the war period (4 Aug 1914 - 11 Nov 1918) only.

TIA,

Errol

[Jim Strawbridge]

1 hour ago, Errol Martyn said:

Just wondering if anyone here has done any research into the number of Royal Aero Club Aviator's Certificates granted per British civil training school for 1910 to 11 Nov 1918, or for the war period (4 Aug 1914 - 11 Nov 1918) only.

TIA,

Errol

 

They are available on Ancestry but I don't know how complete they are (1910 to 1950). They seem to be complete as there are so many of them and a bonus in that they have a photograph of the aviator. But I am guessing that you are after information as per each training school which would take some time to compile..

[Moonraker]

Timothy C Brown's Flying With the Larks - the Early Aviation Pioneers of Lark Hill  has a four-page appendix listing RAeC certificates awarded between November 15, 1910 (Number 27 to Captain J D B Fulton) and April 28, 1914 (Number 775 to Air Mechanic A J Locker).

[Errol Martyn]

Thank you Gents. But, yes, it is totals for each school that I'm seeking. Asking the question here to avoid possible wheel reinventing should someone already have the answer to hand and foot.

Cheers,

Errol

[Moonraker]

2 hours ago, Errol Martyn said:

... should someone already have the answer to hand and foot.

Well, I did have to resort several times over to digits on both hands and feet to tot up 129 entries for Lark Hill.

 

(I was intrigued by the names of Zee Hee Lee - actually Zee Yee Lee - and Prince Serge Cantacuzene.)

[MikeMeech]

On 21/05/2021 at 11:44, Errol Martyn said:

Thank you Gents. But, yes, it is totals for each school that I'm seeking. Asking the question here to avoid possible wheel reinventing should someone already have the answer to hand and foot.

Cheers,

Errol

Hi

 

Appendix E in 'History of British Aviation 1908-1914' by R. Dallas Brett, has all the 'tickets' issued up to Aug. 4th, 1914, including the school and type of aircraft it was taken on.  For example: "863 Sergt. A R May Aug. 4, (1914) M. Farman (RFC) Netheravon."

Increasingly the wartime schools became military run and the training given by the RFC/RNAS was more than was needed for the 'ticket' (by the end of 1915).  Jefford in 'Observers and Navigators' (updated edition) page 47 mentions the following:

 

"Recognising that the RFC's Flying Certificate reflected a far higher standard of competence than its own, the RAeC agreed to issue its 'ticket' to any pilot who could produce evidence to show that he had been certified by the military.

     By the summer of 1916 more than 3,000 RAeC Certificates had been issued but it was becoming increasingly common for pilots to neglect to inform the Club authorities that they had graduated, often because they were packed off to France as replacements before they had time to attend to this chore."

 

And:

 

"All pilots who had qualified up to and including August (1916) were, therefore, automatically and retrospectively granted their RAeC Certificates (although not all of them were claimed).  For pilots who qualified thereafter, the CFS documentation alone was deemed to be sufficient proof of their competence to fly military aeroplanes."

 

So it appears from 1916 the 'ticket' is basically irrelevant, therefore the question is what do you require this data for?

 

Mike  

[Errol Martyn]

Mike,

" By the summer of 1916 more than 3,000 RAeC Certificates had been issued but it was becoming increasingly common for pilots to neglect to inform the Club authorities that they had graduated, often because they were packed off to France as replacements before they had time to attend to this chore."

The RAeC charged a one guinea fee for the Certificate. By mid-late 1916, when the RFC (and RNAS?) dropped the Certificate requirement most graduating pilots probably had other priorities for their guinea!

It would be interesting to learn of the numbers trained by each of the civilian schools in order to gain some idea of the level of activity of each.

Cheers,

Errol

[Sprucey]

I have the pre-war numbers here if this helps: 

 

Pilot Training 1912-1914
					to 4/8/14
Flying Schools			1912	1913	1914		Total
Bristol Flying School	Brooklands		63	70	182		315		315	26%
Bristol Flying School	Salisbury Plain		35	47	127		209		524	43%
Vickers FS	Brooklands		6	35	77		118		642	53%
Grahame-White Flying School	Hendon		20	19	70		109		751	62%
Central Flying School	Upavon		14	56	0		70		821	68%
Ewen FS	Hendon		7	25	37		69		890	73%
Bleriot FS	Hendon		8	8	32		48		938	77%
Naval School	Eastchurch		16	29	0		45		983	81%
Deperdussin FS	Hendon		9	12	21		42		1025	85%
EAC FS	Eastbourne		6	12	20		38		1063	88%
Sopwith FS	Brooklands		11	0	13		24		1087	90%
Avro FS	Brooklands		3	2	12		17		1104	91%
Hewlett & Blondeau FS	Brooklands		1	0	13		14		1118	92%
Deperdussin FS	Brooklands		5	0	6		11		1129	93%
Melly FS	Freshfield		2	1	4		7		1136	94%
Shoreham FS	Shoreham		0	1	6		7		1143	94%
Harriot FS	Brooklands		0	0	7		7		1150	95%
Durocq FS	Brooklands		1	2	3		6		1156	95%
Temple FS	Hendon		0	3	3		6		1162	96%
Lakes FS	Windermere		1	1	3		5		1167	96%
RFC Military Wing	Netheravon		0	4	0		4		1171	97%
RFC Military Wing	Montrose		0	4	0		4		1175	97%
Blackburn FS	Hendon		0	2	2		4		1179	97%
Beattie FS	Hendon		0	1	3		4		1183	98%
New Forest Aviation School	New Forest		0	0	4		4		1187	98%
Hall FS	Hendon		0	1	2		3		1190	98%
Aeronautical Syndicate FS	Hendon		0	0	3		3		1193	99%
Ogilvie FS	Eastchurch		1	0	1		2		1195	99%
Cody FS	Farnborough		1	0	1		2		1197	99%
Handley-Page FS	Fairlop		1	0	1		2		1199	99%
Percival FS	Brooklands		0	1	1		2		1201	99%
Bleriot FS	Brooklands		0	0	2		2		1203	99%
Avro FS	Shoreham		0	0	2		2		1205	100%
British Cauron FS	Hendon		0	0	2		2		1207	100%
Grahame-White Flying School	Pau		0	0	1		1		1208	100%
Grahame-White Flying School	Brooklands		0	0	1		1		1209	100%
Spencer FS	Brooklands		0	0	1		1		1210	100%
Blackburn FS	Filey		0	0	1		1		1211	100%
			211	336	664		1211

[Errol Martyn]

Many thanks for this Sprucey. However, I note that only 862 Aviators Certificates were issued up to and including 3 Aug 14, and that includes those dated 1910 and 1911 which are not included in your table. What were the sources used to identify the balance?

Cheers,

Errol

[Sprucey]

Hi Errol, apologies for the delay, just seen this.

Thanks for the push back. I agree with your numbers from my list of certificates issued.

The 1912 and 1913 numbers look okay but 1914 looks way off. The source of my numbers is here 

1914 Flying Schools - Graces Guide

but as you suggest something has gone wrong with their counting. I should have cross-checked them before posting.