15th & 21st - W Yorks

[West Yorkshire Man]

Does anyone know if these titles exist, I have asked this question before on other sites, and recieved this picture but no other information to support this. 

358413200_WestYorksTitlesPictures1.pdf

[charlie962]

Welcome to the forum.  Your picture shows the title exists but is your question about the title being genuine or about the unit ?

 

Do the titles appear in Westlake ?

 

The LongLong Trail has this on the two units.

 

charlie

Edited 12 April , 2021 by charlie962

[West Yorkshire Man]

I know that the Units existed but not sure about the Titles.

This picture could be of a made up badge or do they realy exist ?

[FROGSMILE]

45 minutes ago, West Yorkshire Man said:

I know that the Units existed but not sure about the Titles.

This picture could be of a made up badge or do they realy exist ?

According to Ray Westlake’s original publication on metal shoulder titles the 16th and 18th Battalion titles certainly existed.  There is no mention of a 15th or 21st Battalion title at all.
He has recently published an update in paperback that I do not have, so I’m unsure if further details (revelations) might have been given.

 It seems to me that if 16th and 18th titles existed and were contemporaneous with the 15th and 21st then it’s certainly conceivable that titles for them probably existed.  Once conscription was introduced in 1916 then a lack of justification and purpose soon led to such titles falling into abeyance in favour of standard issue titles, so it seems to me that not that many can have been made.

Edited 12 April , 2021 by FROGSMILE

[West Yorkshire Man]

Thank you for your reply Frogsmile, 

As a collector of CapBadges and Shoulder Titles I am trying to collect all the West Yorks,West Riding and all the other various Titles and Cap Badges worn by the different Battalions. I already have the   T5/W York. T6/W York. 16/W York, 18/W York and all the Leeds 7th & 8th Btn & Leeds Rifles stuff , but not the 15/1st Leeds Palls, or the

21st  Wool Textile Pioneers Titles.

To be Fair apart from the picture that I posted, I have never seen the real deal on any WW1 photos or in any collections. (Not in Brass anyway) I once saw a cloth 21 worn above a  "W York Title " , so if they do indeed exist they are very hard to collect. My Westlake does refer to both Units but not the Titles.

Regards  W Y M.

 

  

[FROGSMILE]

9 minutes ago, West Yorkshire Man said:

Thank you for your reply Frogsmile, 

As a collector of CapBadges and Shoulder Titles I am trying to collect all the West Yorks,West Riding and all the other various Titles and Cap Badges worn by the different Battalions. I already have the   T5/W York. T6/W York. 16/W York, 18/W York and all the Leeds 7th & 8th Btn & Leeds Rifles stuff , but not the 15/1st Leeds Palls, or the

21st  Wool Textile Pioneers Titles.

To be Fair apart from the picture that I posted, I have never seen the real deal on any WW1 photos or in any collections. (Not in Brass anyway) I once saw a cloth 21 worn above a  "W York Title " , so if they do indeed exist they are very hard to collect. My Westlake does refer to both Units but not the Titles.

Regards  W Y M.

 

  

I don’t know if shoulder title fakes were ever produced for ‘Pals’ battalion collectors in the same way that some of their cap badges were.  Perhaps you could write to Ray, he is still fairly spry and publishing again (for Naval and Military Press).  If you have his latest shoulder title book then you know more than I do.  I don’t know to what extent any new facts have been uncovered.

Edited 12 April , 2021 by FROGSMILE