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The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

William Charles Caddock Evans - Military Foot Police 9841 & RA 70660


Thomas Jones

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1 minute ago, Thomas Jones said:

Yeah he shortened his name right down.  Its even shorter down to Chas Evans on his medal card :)

Yes, one of his Pension cards is under "Chas".

[Though that might just be regular clerks' shorthand - likewise Wm, Jas, Thos, Fredk, Ed, Richd, Saml. etc. feature frequently on pension records - always worth bearing in mind when searching WFA/Fold3]

:-) M

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Just now, Thomas Jones said:

Nice of the clerks to make it easier for us :D

Would have been nice if the transcribers had updated but I guess they have been told to transcribe [often it would seem without much knowledge of the Military, UK geography, British spellings and foibles etc.!]

That said I am a fanatic when it comes to updating/extending the obvious ones at WFA/Fold3 [with additional check(s) if at all unsure] - after all they are just/only 'tags' to help future searches.

Once found viewers can make their own mind(s) up.

Once found!

:-) M

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51 minutes ago, Matlock1418 said:

RN K/59663

 

Charles Evans, born near Beaumaris, Anglesey, on the 17th November 1897 and issued with service number K/59663 enlisted in the Royal Navy on the 11th March 1921 and was discharged on the 21st June 1921, "Organic Heart Disease". His statement of seamans services record can be downloaded for free from the National Archive.

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D7016994

(Just in case you're not aware, you do need to sign in with your account to get it for free. Even if you don't already have an account, one can be set up, no financial details needed, as part of placing your first order.)

 

Cheers,

Peter

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Yeah i been doing a bit of that on ancestry.   To be fair the Welsh words have been transcribed are all over the place so needed to pitch in 

 

image.png.d383bbe9628ad6b247ed5f38138244b2.png

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8 minutes ago, PRC said:

 

Charles Evans, born near Beaumaris, Anglesey, on the 17th November 1897 and issued with service number K/59663 enlisted in the Royal Navy on the 11th March 1921 and was discharged on the 21st June 1921, "Organic Heart Disease". His statement of seamans services record can be downloaded for free from the National Archive.

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D7016994

(Just in case you're not aware, you do need to sign in with your account to get it for free. Even if you don't already have an account, one can be set up, no financial details needed, as part of placing your first order.)

 

Cheers,

Peter

 

Wow that was short lived, 3 months.   "Organic Heart Disease"   :mellow: Seems to run in the family... damn! 

But yeah, definitely him and a great document to add for him. Thanks for your info Peter and Matlock :thumbsup:

 

1865856376_CharlesEvans.jpg.ff11fc25e76a1ff896a385ce07f2e285.jpg

 

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13 minutes ago, Thomas Jones said:

"Organic Heart Disease"

Tom,

Yep, that's what VDH was [Vavular Disease of the Heart]

Sorry I didn't warn you.

:-) M

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25 minutes ago, Thomas Jones said:

Wow that was short lived, 3 months.

 

Surprised he even got in - must have known his past was going to catch up with him. Presumably desperate times.

 

At least know you have a physical decrisption of him which may help when trying to id old photo's of him, or even colourise them.

 

Cheers,

Peter

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Yeah probably desperate times.  He seems to have done well on pensions... every cloud (if they were worth anything? )  Been an incredible evening.  Gone from nothing to finding out he was was Royal Navy and RWF, so really pleased with the help off you and Matlock. Great result. Best Regards, Tom 

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6 minutes ago, Thomas Jones said:

He seems to have done well on pensions

I doubt it. 

All his claims/details seemed to be recognised as linked so he won't have got multiple

And pensions weren't all that great really

Sadly the Pension ledger [or the cards] doesn't tell us the level of disability and/or pension received - though I couldn't see an outright rejection

Pension would have been worked out on account of his rank and disability scale - would have only been initially 'conditional'/temporary at first and/or perhaps been reduced if he got better and/or perhaps to a final quantum pw and/or a final gratuity pay-off if disability was considered less than 20%.

At the moment we can't tell.

All in all, I think which is probably likely why he tried to re-enlist in the RN

Though Stoker wouldn't have been a good rank/role for a dodgy heart as it was a very physical one.

:-) M

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5 minutes ago, Matlock1418 said:

Sadly the Pension ledger [or the cards] doesn't tell us the level of disability and/or pension received - though I couldn't see an outright rejection

I spoke too soon - note to self/all - look at the back of pension ledgers!

14-9-20 No grounds for any further award of Pension or Gratuity - to 24/8/20  [my underlining]

Not an absolute rejection - he seems to have had at least something for a while

:-) M

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right, okay that's decent.

 

Look at this, Charles passed away in 1980 - he did really well, unbelievable.  :D

 

image.png.baaa8caeb40da531dfb7c598df1b01e0.png 

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so Charles has another military number here of 2831 RWF if 708197 is him.  Any addresses or battalion connected to this for Charles Evans ? 

 

1974494683_evans).jpg.fbca89554bcdd7b4a400b79a755f1036.jpg

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1 hour ago, PRC said:

Charles Evans, born near Beaumaris, Anglesey, on the 17th November 1897

 

So if we take that date of birth as correct - then Charles Evans should have been 21 last birthday when he was discharged on the 13th February 1919 - tick :)

But he has overseas service? So where is his Medal Index Card............

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Sorry - no sooner did I post than I found it :)

 

744962429_CharlesEvansRWF2831Labour708197sourcedAncestry.jpg.15821194045649ce63d1eb64915339b7.jpg

 

(Image courtesy of Ancestry, nothing on the reverse)

 

So first goes overseas to Gallipoli. We have several potential Royal Welsh Fusiliers Battalions, but my money would be on the 8th.

 

Our parent site has the following for that Battalion.

 

8th (Service) Battalion
Formed at Wrexham in August 1914 as part of K1 and came under orders of 40th Brigade, 13th (Western) Division. Moved to Salisbury Plain but by February 1915 was at Blackdown.
Moved to Mudros in July 1915 and subsequently served in Gallipoli, Egypt and Mesopotamia.

https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/the-british-infantry-regiments-of-1914-1918/royal-welsh-fusiliers/

 

The other Battalions were all Territorial Force - the 1/5th, 1/6th and 1/7th. They didn't get to Gallipoli until August - however it's not unknown that sometimes the dates shown on MiCs for theatres of war other than France & Flanders shows the date of sailing from the UK rather than arrival. It's particularly a problem when by the time it comes to sorting the medals out, the man concerned is serving with one of the big "Corps" - Labour, MGC, Engineers, Artillery, Medical - which would apply here.

 

The War diaries for Gallipoli are only available online at Ancestry. Almost certainly won't mention him by name, so not much use when it comes to confirming which Battalion he was serving with. The Labour Corps service medal rolls also tend to be fairly spartan, so they won't mention which battalion he was serving with in my experiemce.

 

Hope that helps,

Peter

 

 - Sugar - just seen you have posted the MiC as well:)

 

 

 

 

 

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Tom,

Without assuming things - I hope you know the ToW (2B) was Gallipoli

:-) M

 

Edit;

Peter, We crossed re: Gallopli :-)

Edited by Matlock1418
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Wow Gallipoli. This is great information and 8th Battalion RWF.  2B, that's a useful deciphering, didn't know that thanks.

Nice to see he had the Trio of medals.  Is it possible he had a mfp medal?  

 

216278081_caddockmfp.jpg.bacc043cf9fefba403047be55d208cff.jpg

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The card you have posted is the one I referred to earlier and deals with the issue of his Silver War Badge. Those weren't unit specific and had a badge number engraved rather than a name and unit.

His badge number was B.145325, (from the Silver War Badge Roll you posted earlier).

 

There is a little bit more on the Silver War Badge on the Long, Long Trail.

https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/soldiers/how-to-research-a-soldier/campaign-medal-records/records-of-the-silver-war-badge/

 

However does raise the prospect that he was only with the Military Foot Police for a few months - after the end of the war, (as they are not mentioned on his Medal Index Card nor were they responsible for issuing his service medals) and up till his discharge.

 

Hope that helps,

Peter

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Great, i did wonder about the timings of when he was in the MFP.  There's a lot to put together now, many thanks, Tom

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16 hours ago, Thomas Jones said:

His address in 1914 was 5 Panton Street, Bangor (loads lived in this tiny house) and was on the Absent Voting List.

 

Cogs whirr slowly but get there in the end - which Absent Voter List? He would most likely have been out before the 1919 one was prepared, and most electoral districts only had one for 1918 as far as I'm aware, prepared between February, (when the 1918 Representation of the People Act was passed which significantly expanded the electorate) and May. Some districts did have a second one prepared later in 1918 and Bangor may have been one of those.

 

I'm assuming this was the original source for him being in the Military Foot Police.

 

Cheers,

Peter

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2 hours ago, PRC said:

which Absent Voter List? He would most likely have been out before the 1919

Hi Peter, @Hywyn found 1st William Charles Evans has a military history while kindly looking up John Drinnan 426402.

John D married Williams Charles' sister Margaret and they lived in 5 Panton St. Bangor.

Hywyn found the Absent Voters for 5 Panton Street only has a William Charles Evans 9841 Military Foot Police.

Not sure what year the AVL is from? I'll ask Hywyn what year it's from.

Baptism in 1917

cheers, Tombaptised.png.ad6f8e2cfaabc4c1c519b75340d0f433.png

Edited by Thomas Jones
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As to his Military Foot Police service, at least I can give a definitive transfer date. He is listed in the Corps Order Book (Military Police Corps Order No 62 of 21st April 1917). Although his initial looks like an O, it is in fact C - some letters can be particularly hard to identify depending on the handwriting.

 

He was one of a number of men who were transferred into the Corps with effect from 20th April 1917, and posted for duty with Western Command. As you can see, we have yet another Regimental No to deal with - 265348. I have not yet been able to find the date he transferred from the MFP to the Labour Corps.

 

Cheers,

 

Richard352458009_EvansCOB22p32.jpg.9a31db1fb578f39bdc494c4f38590af7.jpg

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