Walter GIBSON 1/6 Northumberland Fusiliers

[stephen p nunn]

Afternoon all.

 

I was very fortunate at Christmas in receiving a number of Great War medals as gifts. I am not having fun researching them.

 

The first is a Victory Medal given to me by my daughter. It relates to a Walter Gibson of the Northumberland Fusiliers. This is what I know about him so far:

 

Birth and Early Life

Born in 1894 in Gateshead-on-tyne, third son of George Richardson Gibson and Mary Gibson.

Aged 7 in 1901 living in Gateshead at 77 School Street with; parents, George (a general labourer) and Mary; brothers John and Charles and; sister Catherine.

Aged 16 in 1911 living in Gateshead at 72 School Street with; parents George (a brickarshman) and Mary; brother Charles and; sister Catherine. Walter worked as a fitter’s apprentice in the Loco Dept of the Railway Company.

Enlistment

Enlisted at Newcastle-on-tyne - served as a Private (6/4237) 1^st 6^th (Territorial) Battalion, Northumberland Fusilliers. (In August 1914 the 1/6^th was in St George’s Drill Hall, Newcastle. Part of Northumberland Brigade, Northumbrian Division. They landed in France in  April 1915. In May 1915 they became 149th Brigade, 50th (Northumbrian) Division).

Death

Died 7/3/1916 (aged 22). (The Battalion were in the trenches in the Ypres area and near to Zillebeke).

Commemoration

Buried Railway Dugouts Burial Ground (Transport Farm) (II.C.16).

Entitled to the medal pair.

 

Can anyone add anything please?

 

Thank you.

Stephen (Maldon).

[Matlock1418]

44 minutes ago, stephen p nunn said:

Birth and Early Life

Born in 1894 in Gateshead-on-tyne, third son of George Richardson Gibson and Mary Gibson.

3 x Pension records at WFA/Fold3 give:

Mother: Emma - 6 South Street, Gateshead on Tyne [aged 54 at time of pension claimed 4.9.1916 / gratuity paid 3.10.1916]

:-) M

[stephen p nunn]

1 hour ago, Matlock1418 said:

3 x Pension records at WFA/Fold3 give:

Mother: Emma - 6 South Street, Gateshead on Tyne [aged 54 at time of pension claimed 4.9.1916 / gratuity paid 3.10.1916]

:-) M

Hi M - thank you, but I think that is a different Walter Gibson?

 

[Matlock1418]

32 minutes ago, stephen p nunn said:

Hi M - thank you, but I think that is a different Walter Gibson?

Pensions have as: Pte. Walter GIBSON, Northumberland Fusiliers, 4237, Died/KiA 7.3.1916 - with mother as Emma

Image courtesy of WFA/Fold3 - with thanks.

A remarkable coincidence then / or possible pension clerking error ???

:-/ M

 

Edited 29 December , 2020 by Matlock1418
added a pension card image / added possible error

[Don Regiano]

war diary has him sick to hospital on 11.2.1916 (also gives incorrect number when lists his death in March 1916)

[PRC]

The Medal Index card only shows entitlement to the British War Medal and the Victory Medal, so he didn't serve in a Theatre of War until on or after the 1st January 1916. He therefore wasn't part of the 1/6th when they went out to France in April 1915, and any training he did was with another unit. No additional information of Soldiers Died in the Great War as to previous unit, so possibly he trained with one of the 2nd or 3rd line Territorial Force Battalions back in the UK.

 

Given date of death and that the earliest he could have arrived was the 1st January 1916, then sadly you are looking at no more than 9 weeks in Theatre.

 

Peter

[Matlock1418]

There is a war memorial at St Mark's Methodist Church (WMR 48265), Gateshead, Tyne And Wear for a Pte. Walter GIBSON, NF which I suspect potentially is for 4237

https://www.iwm.org.uk/memorials/name/105749 

:-) M

[ss002d6252]

29 minutes ago, Matlock1418 said:

There is a war memorial at St Mark's Methodist Church (WMR 48265), Gateshead, Tyne And Wear for a Pte. Walter GIBSON, NF which I suspect potentially is for 4237

https://www.iwm.org.uk/memorials/name/105749 

:-) M

It's certainly close to where he lived, these days it would probably be the nearest one. Less than a 100 metres.

 

What was South Street is now under what is South Street school, the road running right through what is now the main school building. There's two little sections left of the street at either end of the school.

 

EDIT: if it's the South Street man.

Craig

[clk]

Hi,

 

53 minutes ago, stephen p nunn said:

1 hour ago, Matlock1418 said:

3 x Pension records at WFA/Fold3 give:

Mother: Emma - 6 South Street, Gateshead on Tyne [aged 54 at time of pension claimed 4.9.1916 / gratuity paid 3.10.1916]

:-) M

Hi M - thank you, but I think that is a different Walter Gibson?

 

Soldiers' Effects shows that when his outstanding pay was settled by money order in June 1916, it was sent to his step mother, named as an Emma. She is recorded as being his sole legatee. The associated will is here.

 

Regards

Chris

[ss002d6252]

There is a School Street (a few hundred metres from South Street) that was not far from the big NER Loco Works so I'd imagine the School Street in question is probably this one.

Craig

[stephen p nunn]

Thank you everyone so much for this information. It is (as usual for GWF pals) incredible. This man has come alive and is truly Not Forgotten.

Best wishes.

Stephen (Maldon).

[stephen p nunn]

 

Thanks to all who have responded, this is the latest on Walter:

 

Walter GIBSON

Birth and Early Life

Born in 1894 in Gateshead-on-tyne, third son of George Richardson Gibson and Mary Gibson.

Aged 7 in 1901 living in Gateshead at 77 School Street with; parents, George (a general labourer) and Mary; brothers John and Charles and; sister Catherine.

Aged 16 in 1911 living in Gateshead at 72 School Street with; parents George (a brickarshman) and Mary; brother Charles and; sister Catherine. Walter worked as a fitter’s apprentice in the Loco Dept of the Railway Company.

Enlistment

Enlisted at Newcastle-on-tyne - served as a Private (6/4237) 1^st 6^th (Territorial) Battalion, Northumberland Fusilliers. (He wasn't part of the 1/6th when they went out to France in April 1915, and any training he did was with another unit - possibly he trained with one of the 2nd or 3rd line Territorial Force Battalions in the UK).

On Active Service

The earliest he could have arrived in France was the 1st January 1916.

War diary has him sick to hospital on 11.2.1916.

Death

Died 7/3/1916 (aged 22).

His step-mother: is recorded as Emma - 6 South Street, Gateshead on Tyne [aged 54 at time of pension claimed 4.9.1916 / gratuity paid 3.10.1916].

Commemoration

Buried Railway Dugouts Burial Ground (Transport Farm) (II.C.16).

There is a war memorial at St Mark's Methodist Church, Gateshead, Tyne and Wear that includes a Pte. Walter GIBSON, NF.

Entitled to the medal pair - the British War Medal and the Victory Medal, so he didn't serve in a Theatre of War until on or after the 1st January 1916.

 

[PRC]

Had a quick run through the medal index cards on the National Archive catalogue for individuals with a 6 prefix, hoping to find a few who were issued with the Silver War Badge, and so get the date of enlistment from the Roll. Ended up looking at the range 6/4208 to 6/4267. Where there are gaps there are no MiC matches.  Those I did find I ran through FMP but didn't come up with any service records. Hopefully this will save someone else the legwork

 

6/4213 Frederick Evans SWB Roll enlisted 29th June 1915. When discharged as a result of sickness on the 19th July 1916 he was serving with the 3/6th Battalion.

6/4225 Harry Banks then 7/5509 then 291636 Landed France 10-10-15. Admitted 4 Stationary Hospital from Sick Convoy on (probably) the “27th” November 1915. Stated to have been in the Army 18 for 1 year 6 months and to have completed 1year 1 month with the Expeditionary Force. I think you can knock the years off both of those values.

6/4228 James Armstong then 5/7360  then 242520 then Commissioned.

 

6/4237 Walter Gibson

 

6/4238 James McCullock KiA

6/4240 Peter McMenam 1/6 KiA

6/4244 George Waggot 1/6 DoW

6/4245 Thomas Hodgson DoW landed France 10-11-15

6/4246 Uriah Watson subsequently 265940 landed France 11-11-15

6/4247 Joseph Wooding then 4/8077 then 263843

6/4252 Fred Sutcliffe then 288007. Discharged but no SWB issued.

6/4259 John Stott then 340315.

 

Hope that helps,

 

Peter

[stephen p nunn]

4 minutes ago, PRC said:

Had a quick run through the medal index cards on the National Archive catalogue for individuals with a 6 prefix, hoping to find a few who were issued with the Silver War Badge, and so get the date of enlistment from the Roll. Ended up looking at the range 6/4208 to 6/4267. Where there are gaps there are no MiC matches.  Those I did find I ran through FMP but didn't come up with any service records. Hopefully this will save someone else the legwork

 

6/4213 Frederick Evans SWB Roll enlisted 29th June 1915. When discharged as a result of sickness on the 19th July 1916 he was serving with the 3/6th Battalion.

6/4225 Harry Banks then 7/5509 then 291636 Landed France 10-10-15. Admitted 4 Stationary Hospital from Sick Convoy on (probably) the “27th” November 1915. Stated to have been in the Army 18 for 1 year 6 months and to have completed 1year 1 month with the Expeditionary Force. I think you can knock the years off both of those values.

6/4228 James Armstong then 5/7360  then 242520 then Commissioned.

 

6/4237 Walter Gibson

 

6/4238 James McCullock KiA

6/4240 Peter McMenam 1/6 KiA

6/4244 George Waggot 1/6 DoW

6/4245 Thomas Hodgson DoW landed France 10-11-15

6/4246 Uriah Watson subsequently 265940 landed France 11-11-15

6/4247 Joseph Wooding then 4/8077 then 263843

6/4252 Fred Sutcliffe then 288007. Discharged but no SWB issued.

6/4259 John Stott then 340315.

 

Hope that helps,

 

Peter

Thanks Peter - that's great - so are you saying Walter would have been in the Army for around 6 months and on Active Service for about 1 month?

Regards.

Stephen (Maldon).

 

[Don Regiano]

War diary reports on 24.1.1916 receiving a draft of 137 ORs from 3/6 NF; next report of draft is of 42 ORs on 4.2.1916 (effective 1.2.1916

 

6/4238 J McCullock was reported sick to hospital on 15.12.1915 - there are one or two others with numbers greater than Walter's also reported around that time but the majority begin to appear in 1916.

[Matlock1418]

1 hour ago, stephen p nunn said:

George (a brickarshman)

Think that might be "Brickarchman" [a specialist form of bricklayer] - would seem to fit with a possible railway context - I think most likely building them inside engine fireboxes and the like.

:-) M

[PRC]

16 minutes ago, stephen p nunn said:

Thanks Peter - that's great - so are you saying Walter would have been in the Army for around 6 months and on Active Service for about 1 month?

 

Seems likely he was recruited after or on the 29th June 1915, but without more digging it's not possible to say with certainty the latest he might have been recruited - informed guess would be mid-July. So by the time of his death on the 7th March 1916 he most likely had been in the Army 8 months and from the information supplied by @Don Regiano, in France 6 weeks, part of which was spent in hospital.

 

Hope that helps,

Peter

[Don Regiano]

1 hour ago, PRC said:

 

Seems likely he was recruited after or on the 29th June 1915, but without more digging it's not possible to say with certainty the latest he might have been recruited - informed guess would be mid-July. So by the time of his death on the 7th March 1916 he most likely had been in the Army 8 months and from the information supplied by @Don Regiano, in France 6 weeks, part of which was spent in hospital.

 

Hope that helps,

Peter

 

My wife's great uncle was in 1/6 NF and was mortally wounded at High Wood in September 1916.  His number was 6/5050 and IIRC he enlisted sometime around the end of 1915.  We don't know why he decided to join the NF.  We think maybe another relative was in the NF or, as he also was a railway man at Stockport, Cheshire, he just decided to jump on the next train leaving and enlist at wherever the train took him!

[PRC]

On the 1911 Census of England & Wales his parents George Richardson Gibson and Mary Jane Gibson state they have been married 22 years and have had 5 children, of which 4 were then still alive.

 

As well as Walter the other children in the household are Charles (19) and Catherine Isabel (13) – both born Gateshead.

 

The most likely marriage seems to have been that of a John Richardson Gibson to a Mary Jane Gair which was recorded in the Morpeth District of Northumberland in the April to June quarter, (Q2), of 1889.

 

(George Richardson Gibson gives his age on the 1911 Census as 42 and born Newcastle, Mary Jane was 42 and born Morpeth. On the 1901 Census they are both 31 and with the same places of birth. Additional child shown is an 11 year old John G, born Gateshead.

 

There is no straight forward match for either a John Richardson Gibson or a George Richardson Gibson in the birth records for England & Wales. Pre-1872 the compliance rate for birth registrations varied considerably, so absence of a birth registration doesn’t necessarily mean absence of a birth.

 

Therefore a transcription error somewhere along the way between the local register and the printing of the quarterly index of marriages in England & Wales can’t be ruled out.)

 

The birth of a Walter Gibson, mothers’ maiden name Gair, was registered with the Civil Authorities in the Gateshead District in the April to June quarter, (Q2), of 1894.

 

Other births of children registered in the Gateshead District with surname Gibson, mothers’ maiden name Gair are:-

 

Q3 1889 John George Gibson

Q2 1891 Charles Gibson

Q2 1897 Catherine Isabella Gibson

Q3 1900 Joseph Henry Gibson. (There is a death recorded for a Joseph Henry Gibson, aged under 1 in the Newcastle upon Tyne District in Q4 1900).

 

Father George, Walter and his brother Charles are all shown as employed in the Loco Department of a Railway Company.

 

However Walter doesn’t appear to be remembered on the Roll of Honour of Fallen Railway Workers at the National Railway Museum.

https://www.railwaymuseum.org.uk/research-and-archive/our-research#first-world-war/fallen-railwaymen/

 

Regards,

Peter

 

 

[stephen p nunn]

Thank you all so very much. I have updated my file on this man and we certainly know a lot about him now! I am very grateful to you all.

Best regards.

Stephen (Maldon).

[PRC]

23 hours ago, stephen p nunn said:

I am not having fun researching them.

 

BTW - was that a Freudian slip

 

Peter

[Graham Stewart]

22 hours ago, PRC said:

 

Seems likely he was recruited after or on the 29th June 1915, but without more digging it's not possible to say with certainty the latest he might have been recruited - informed guess would be mid-July. So by the time of his death on the 7th March 1916 he most likely had been in the Army 8 months and from the information supplied by @Don Regiano, in France 6 weeks, part of which was spent in hospital.

 

Hope that helps,

Peter

He's a late June, early July 1915 enlistement, but you have to be careful when looking at this sort of thing. For instance 6/4232 Pte Thomas Redpath enlisted on the 30/6/1915, but 6/4227 Pte Phillip Lawson enlisted on the 3rd July 1915 - so nothing is specific unless you have access to their service records. As others have noted he was also "Sick to Hospital", as of the 11th February 1916.

[stephen p nunn]

Thanks Graham. Very helpful.

Best regards.

S.