POW's captured at St Quentin on or about 21 March 1918

[Black Country Wrinklie]

I am researching Harry B Parsons of the 2/8 Worcestershire Regiment who was captured and taken as a POW to 3 Camps during his captivity, Langensalza then Lamsdorf and Neuhammer.

I have compiled lists of the people who were moved with him to each camp and the list attached is of fellow prisoners who went to ALL three camps with Harry. Does anyone have any comments about anyone included in the list? I have recorded dates and places of birth given for all of those on the list BUT only from the information given to the International Red Cross. If any of you out there have any information about anyone on the list I would be grateful AND if any of you want more information about anyone on the list, I will let you know what I know.

Regards

POW's at Langensalza, Lamsdorf and Neuhammer with HBP.pdf

[Acknown]

 

19 minutes ago, Black Country Wrinklie said:

If any of you out there have any information about anyone on the list

That's an interesting piece of research, but have you looked up any of them on a family history site, such as FMP or Ancestry? It's a big job to investigate so many names.

Acknown

[sadbrewer]

J G Lockyer came from Millam Street in Holborn, his service record survives.

G H Backhouse was from Rochdale, he died in 1918...he is buried in The Poznan Old Garrison Cemetery.

 

 

 

 

Harry Beddowes Parsons. Worcestershire Regt  came from Rowley Regis in Staffordshire...he died in 1964.

 

Maurice Jean Maire Bone...b1899  d1995 from Merton Street, Kensington. Service record survives . After the war he became a window cleaner, in 1935 he was seriously injured in a 40 ft fall from his ladder.

 

 

Harry Morris Cohen MGC, b 1898 from 

Edited 12 October , 2020 by sadbrewer

[Black Country Wrinklie]

As I have already tried to indicate, I already have details of dates and places of birth, details of next of kin and their addresses and any other information provided by the International Red Cross. The details, that I have already summarised, from the three moves in POW Camp, total some 2,024 soldiers. ONLY the ones on my list travelled with Harry to EACH of the camps.

I am grateful for ANY information relating to soldiers on the attached list but I am looking for the small details such as provided by Sadbrewer regarding Maurice Jean-Marie Bone. The picture was a great addition.

Please do not go to any trouble looking for information OTHER than the information you have already come across in your own research.

Of the 2,024 soldiers details I have acquired only 23 have not been verified via any website  I have scrutinised relating to soldiers records (such as Forces War Records).

If anyone fancies a real challenge I can post up that list if you are looking for additional homework!!!

I would just add at this point that the information given to the ICRC was not always reliable. As an example, Harry Parsons gave his father's details on arriving at Neuhammer. This added the third camp to my list!!!!

[charlie2]

59 minutes ago, Black Country Wrinklie said:

 As an example, Harry Parsons gave his father's details on arriving at Neuhammer.

Which is understandable as the column is for the date and place of birth of the soldier and his NoK details.

 

Charlie

[Black Country Wrinklie]

The Column where his father's christian names were given was that of the prisoner and NOT his next of kin. I have looked at enough records via the ICRC to be aware of which one is the prisoner and which is the next of kin. Sorry if this sounds as if I am not grateful for your input.

BCW

[charlie2]

You are refering to the Neuhammer list and not the Langensalze list, sorry. As Titus Hingley Parsons was his father the information in column 2 is correct apart from his father not being a Russian. Line c is for the forename of the soldier‘s father but only in the case of Russians. 
Charlie

[Black Country Wrinklie]

Further to my earlier query, I now attach a spreadsheet containing the details of 23 soldiers who were POW's with Harry Parsons and were included on records provided to ICRC. Despite my best endeavours I have been unable to trace any of the 23 entries to any records provided by the Forces War Records. These were the only soldiers out of a total of 2,024 included on lists for the three camps Harry was sent to (Langensalza, Lamsdorf and Neuhammer).

Some of the information provided may well be accurate but some may have been mis-recorded.

I assume names may be wrong but service numbers correct. Regiments may be wrong but other information may be correct. 

You will see that two soldiers have two alternative surnames and one has three.

Three of the soldiers have a choice of christian names.

If ANY of the information links in to anyone's research, I would be grateful of a note of the accurate information so that I may complete my huge analysis of Harry's fellow POW's.

Harry is not a relative of mine but lived next to my father's factory when I was a child and he gave me one of his war diaries when I last saw him in 1960. Unknown to me he gave my father another diary that was only discovered in the loft  of my father's house in 2014 after he passed away.

I have tracked down some of Harry's living relatives and been to see them.

Harry was the 11th of 12 children and never married and although I have no photo of him, I wish to try and tell his story. I was given volume 1 of his diaries and my father Volume 3. The notes for volume 2 had to be destroyed in a hurry just before he was captured on 21st March 1918.

I have done my best to fill in the gap that would have been Volume 2 and collect together as much other information as possible.

Input from the other GWF members is greatly appreciated no matter how small.

Regards

 

BCW

POW's on ICRC lists with Harry Parsons not traced.pdf

[sadbrewer]

Isaac Vartin is actually Isaac Varty....some of his service record on Findmypast 

https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=gbm%2fadm339%2f0448-unwi%2f00188&parentid=gbm%2fadm339%2f46579

 

A pension record on Ancestry.

https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&dbid=61588&h=842163&tid=&pid=&queryId=57f531dc703601d7249e9ab97e67c41f&usePUB=true&_phsrc=ubi14556&_phstart=successSource

 

A worker in a soap factory in 1911...a porter on the railway in 1914.

Looks like the same man in Consett in 1939, married with three children, Thomas W, Isaac W, and Lilian...died in 1951.

 

JH Baldwin could be 54257 James Baldwin, from Tingley, West Ardsley, Manchester Regiment...released as POW in 1919.

 

Bertram Toon looks interesting, only one candidate of the right age is showing up in the census. Joins the Notts and Derbys after the war and is arrested as an absentee in 1920, after that he has a string of convictions for burglary.

 

 

George V Hoggins looks to be this chap, from The absent voters list.

 

Edited 14 October , 2020 by sadbrewer

[Black Country Wrinklie]

Eat your hearts out Miss Marple and Poirot !!!!

 

Great job.

 

BCW

 

[sadbrewer]

Grieves Albert W....is Albert William Sreeves.

 

[clk]

Hi BCW,

 

14 hours ago, Black Country Wrinklie said:

I was given volume 1 of his diaries and my father Volume 3. The notes for volume 2 had to be destroyed in a hurry just before he was captured on 21st March 1918.

I have done my best to fill in the gap that would have been Volume 2 and collect together as much other information as possible.

Input from the other GWF members is greatly appreciated no matter how small.

 

What's the date gap between the end of Volume 1 and the start of Volume 3?

 

I suspect that you already have them, but Harry appears on two casualty lists held by the National Library of Scotland. One for being taken PoW (link). and one for his repatriation (link).

 

Regards

Chris

[Black Country Wrinklie]

Dear CLK

 

Volume 1 finished on 27/06/1916 and Volume 3 started on 3/12/1917 till May 1918 when it stopped.

 

I have copies of the Worcestershire Regimental War Diaries and have reviewed all the information in Stacke's History of the Worcestershire Regiment, in so far as it affects the 1/7th and from February 1918 the 2/8th.

I have typed up over 200 pages of content so far and have spreadsheets coming out of my ears relating to 1/7 and 2/8 Worcester soldiers, POW's at Langensalza, Lamsdorf & Neuhammer who travelled with Harry, Generals/LG's, MG's & BG's linking in to Harry's story.

The work on his family tree is very extensive and I have visited a nephew who is still alive in Stourbridge and given him and his wife a copy of my findings on the family tree. I got back the other way some details they had just received from one of these estate hunters where another relative had died intestate.

I can laugh about it now but the initial greeting I got was to put it mildly "FROSTY" from the nephew's wife. Her opening line at the door was "What ever you are selling, I don't want any so clear off". DESPITE using all my charms - she eventually let me in! She and her husband had no idea that the husband's father was one of 12. They were only aware of 5 other than the husband's father.

The link provided earlier to the National Library of Scotland (for which I have already given my grateful thanks) has provided the information about Harry's return. I already had details of his Camps from ICRC records. Harry himself wrote about his time at Langensalza and Lamsdorf in Volume 3. I have already traced many of the soldiers encamped with Harry to the NLOS lists and intend to check further either side of Harry's return date of 28/01/1919.

 

Regards

 

BCW

 

[Black Country Wrinklie]

Would anyone be able to identify the type of bullet that I was told was dug out of Harry Parsons if I posted a picture of it????

 

Regards

 

BCW

[clk]

Hi BCW,

 

46 minutes ago, Black Country Wrinklie said:

I have already traced many of the soldiers encamped with Harry to the NLOS lists and intend to check further either side of Harry's return date of 28/01/1919.

 

That's the date of the published list, and would have been after the date that he physically returned to the UK. For example from the same daily list, there are some papers for 4473 Neale (1/Worcestershire Regiment) which show that his return date was 13.1.1919.

 

51 minutes ago, Black Country Wrinklie said:

Would anyone be able to identify the type of bullet

 

Might that be worth posting the photo separately, for example in the 'Arms and other weapons' sub forum?

 

Regards

Chris

[Black Country Wrinklie]

The NLOS reports contain lots of information but how do you ascertain the ACTUAL date of return? Clearly I am a novice at this game.

 

BCW

[sadbrewer]

James Kaylor looks to be 140757, Machine Gun Corps.

https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&dbid=61588&h=1197813&tid=&pid=&queryId=2aaffe2ea0c7d73b0b07b62feed8decc&usePUB=true&_phsrc=ubi14574&_phstart=successSource

 

He suffered a GSW...left leg.

https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBM%2FWO363-4%2F007299610%2F00831&parentid=GBM%2FWO363-4%2F7299610%2F76%2F831

[sadbrewer]

Cecil William Connolly/Cower looks to be Joseph Cecil Conn...b1897, at Newbottle in the 1911 census....he died of pneumonia in 1923.

His mother died in 1914.

Courtesy of the British Newspaper Archive 

 

 

 

Edited 14 October , 2020 by sadbrewer