Simon Robert John Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 This is my grandfather who was in the RNVR and who served in the RND in France. Can anyone tell me whether there is anything else I can get from the photo? I think I found his service record, but he didn't serve on the Iron Duke, so maybe there's a disconnect somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PRC Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 Hi Simon and welcome to the forum. A name and service number would be good - there are plenty of people with expertise and experience, (not me!), who would cast a second pair of eyes over his records to see what can be gleaned there as well. Also, I take it there were no photographers studio details on the front or back. Cheers, Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anneca Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 Hi Simon, If your grandfather might have served on the Iron Duke this was the Jutland Crew List. Anne https://www.jutlandcrewlists.org/iron-duke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Robert John Posted 9 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 September , 2020 Thank you Peter. His name is Reginald Jones, and the service number, Z/2249. The record has written on it Pic no. 77821, which I guess means they took photos too, which I would like to see if anyone knows how to access it. He joined up 26/10/1915. Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 The service record doesn't appear to match the photo which clearly shows him wearing an Iron Duke cap tally. The obvious questions are: what makes you certain that the person in the photo is your grandfather? Why do you believe that the RNVR service record is his? The more info we have the easier it will be to make sense of the photo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 3rd question - why do you think he served in France? I found his RND card, but there's no reference to service in France on it. Just trying to establish whether we're discussing the right person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Robert John Posted 9 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 September , 2020 Thank you Anne. I don't understand why he would be in that cap if he didn't serve on the Iron Duke, and his name isn't on the lists you kindly directed me to. There is a bit of a question mark over his name, he was christened Reginald Johnson (Jones) and later called himself Reginald Johnson-Jones, his children all had that double-barreled surname. But he was officially Jones unless it is possible to change surnames when christened. Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 Men could join up under pretty much any name they chose to give. Do you have any evidence that he was RNVR number WZ/2249? What specific details (date of birth, medals, etc) do you have for him? I wonder whether you may have traced the wrong record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Robert John Posted 9 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 September , 2020 To headgardener, thank you for responding. I am told that the photo is of him, but it isn't in my possession. I am trying to track down a relative's reported photo of him on the Iron Duke which would probably mean I do have the wrong record. The reason I thought the record is his is because the birth date is the same, and the name (excluding the middle name) too. His occupation was given as apprentice boilermaker, which fits with his later job as train driver. His service ends at about the time he married my grandmother. Simon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Robert John Posted 9 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 September , 2020 To headgardener' He was supposedly gassed somewhere, and it says on the record G.I.B. 25/1018. Gassed in Battle? I have another picture of him in tunic with what appears to be the British War Medal, Victory Medal and two others. Is it possible for me to see the RND card? You are quite right about whether I have the right man, service record or anything. Simon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Robert John Posted 9 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 September , 2020 To headgardener I didn't realise they could call themselves what they liked. I guess I matched the detail to the record rather than anything else. I sadly have very little other information, except this photo. I hope I'm not wasting anyone's time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Robert John Posted 9 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 September , 2020 Um, just to get back to the original purpose of the post, is this a star over 2 rank stripes? Wavy Navy! And what does it mean? If someone knows how to access the pictures taken on enlistment, maybe that would clear up whether I'm chasing the wrong man. Thank you all, Simon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Robert John Posted 9 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 September , 2020 To all, may I ask one further question, were they elevated one rank on demobilisation? On my grandparents' marriage certificate it says Leading Seaman, RNVR. If Z/2249 is the same man, he was only recorded as AB. Simon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaJane Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 1 hour ago, Simon Robert John said: Pic no. 77821, which I guess means they took photos too I think this is more likely to be the photographer's number than the Navy's, unfortunately - having a photograph taken wasn't part of the joining procedure (alas). Do you have a date or place of birth for him? I have looked in the BT files in case he ever worked for the Merchant Navy, but no joy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 The man in the 2nd photo is wearing a post war uniform of the Royal Engineers. The medals are what appears to be a 1914 star trio (it looks like a bar on the ribbon of the star - otherwise it could be a1914/15 star), plus a further Long Service (?) medal. You also have him as Ldg Smn on his wedding certificate? Any other details from the certificate (dates, etc?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PRC Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 Sounds like maybe a case for revisiting the family details. The RND man you have identified is shown as having a birthdate of the 10th March 1895. The Reginald Johnson-Jones, a married Railway Engineer and the first person in the household at 9 Mead Street, Bristol, is shown on the 1939 Register as born 23rd March 1895. The date of birth on both sources would almost certainly have been unverified. If you have the marriage certificate it hopefully shows fathers name, trade and whether still alive. Can you share that with us. Cheers, Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Robert John Posted 9 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 September , 2020 To seaJane, Thank you for responding. He was born on 10 March 1895, in Barton Regis, Glos., but census records also say Easton, Bristol. Maybe people were a bit relaxed about place? Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNCVR Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 I have never seen insignia like this rating has on his right sleeve, no idea what the stripes or star above signifies. Sure be interested in knowing tho.... Best....Bryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNCVR Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 6 minutes ago, headgardener said: The man in the 2nd photo is wearing a post war uniform of the Royal Engineers. The medals are what appears to be a 1914 star trio (it looks like a bar on the ribbon of the star - otherwise it could be a1914/15 star), plus a further Long Service (?) medal. You also have him as Ldg Smn on his wedding certificate? Any other details from the certificate (dates, etc?). Not an Army LS medal, wrong suspension. But not certain what medal it is? Appears to look like a Cadet Forces or Defence medal but way too early for those medals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Robert John Posted 9 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 September , 2020 To headgardener, Royal Engineers! I knew it was post war because I had read that the medals were distributed mid-twenties. Unfortunately, the marriage certificate has his father's name crossed out and no further detail of him. His name was Frederick John Jones. I have him on 1901 and 1911 census', and on Reginald's birth certificate. Reginald married 12 March 1919, and it was recorded as being at Liskeard, Cornwall. He gave his address as in Bristol. Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 1 minute ago, RNCVR said: Not an Army LS medal, wrong suspension. But not certain what medal it is? Appears to look like a Cadet Forces or Defence medal but way too early for those medals. Yes, I agree. Would almost certainly have to be an LS medal though. But the ribbon doesn't match anything that I can think of. The RNVR records show him to be the son of Alice Jones who was living in Canton, Cardiff in October 1915. Do those details match your man? Just now, Simon Robert John said: To headgardener, Royal Engineers! I knew it was post war because I had read that the medals were distributed mid-twenties. Unfortunately, the marriage certificate has his father's name crossed out and no further detail of him. His name was Frederick John Jones. I have him on 1901 and 1911 census', and on Reginald's birth certificate. Reginald married 12 March 1919, and it was recorded as being at Liskeard, Cornwall. He gave his address as in Bristol. Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNCVR Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 21 minutes ago, Simon Robert John said: To all, may I ask one further question, were they elevated one rank on demobilisation? On my grandparents' marriage certificate it says Leading Seaman, RNVR. If Z/2249 is the same man, he was only recorded as AB. Simon. No, that was not normal procedure for RN ratings upon demobilization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Robert John Posted 9 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 September , 2020 To RNCVR, Is the sleeve insignia not standard rank? What could the other medal be? Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNCVR Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 2 minutes ago, headgardener said: Yes, I agree. Would almost certainly have to be an LS medal though. But the ribbon doesn't match anything that I can think Not necessarily, the RN LS medal had a straight suspension but this rating (apparently) was RNVR(?) & I am not certain this has been positively established as yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 9 September , 2020 Share Posted 9 September , 2020 14 minutes ago, RNCVR said: I have never seen insignia like this rating has on his right sleeve, no idea what the stripes or star above signifies. Sure be interested in knowing tho.... Best....Bryan That star on his sleeve looks like the type usually worn on the upper sleeve doesn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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